Whats with all the Autism Speaks hate.

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Gene therapy? really?

Either we're talking about completly different things, you unquestioningly accept the expectations of society no matter how unfair or illogical they may be, or you're trolling.

I'm gonna be nice and assume it's the first.

I never claimed some bureaucrat defined what is sufficient or acceptable. My point was that there was no such person nor should there be.

I'm not talking about language. I'm talking about social expectations.

And for the record, there is no such thing as "sane".

One's entire neurology wouldn't have to be changed. Not all of the various aspects of neurology are flawed, even though the condition is pervasive. Nowhere near the entire genetic structure would have to be changed. You have no reasoning for this. We live in a modern society that does examine medical treatments for safety. Something that has risks likely won't work anyway. Cure won't involve things like harsh powerful medications anyway.

Look, you can't effectively debate this. You're saying senseless things to back up something that isn't wanted. Your meddling is not wanted. I answered your question. Try handling it. Anytime I prove a point, you just whine like a hipster who repeats the word "society" over and over. Language is involved in this topic. I don't want to change the subject. Don't focus only on aspies.


I don't think you're even trying to have credibility at this point.

Most research I've read about indicates it is complex and effects many genes as well as multiple aspects of their neurology. That is what I reason from what I've read about it. Also this 'modern' society is a disease, thus far which needs to be deeply repaired. Also though how do you think they could cure autism in a risk free manner, what's you're theory. You're spending plenty of time criticizing wether I can reason or not but you haven't come up with any real reasons why my points are wrong or 'irrational' so how do you think it would be cured without there being any risk?

Not all on the spectrum have the same genetic variations involved. If you were so certain of your conclusions, you wouldn't have to make up other reasons to bash the possibility. I have refuted lots of what you have said. I'm not a scientist, but real scientists are working on this through funding, and I'm not just going to let your side stop them. You ask the same questions over and over again, and I keep answering. I don't know exactly in what way it would be risk free.

I never said I was perfectly certain of anything, just that I think it is unlikely they can cure it...I even said I didn't know for sure though. Also you haven't refuted anything at all...telling me I am wrong and irrational is not the same thing as refuting my points.

Considering you are so doubtful they can cure it, why not relax and stop complaining of cure then if it won't come? Listen to what I've been saying.

I've read everything you've said and it does not change the accuracy of anything I've said.

Interesting topic...

Don't like them. They're big on finding a cure and a cure seems extremely unlikely because as I understand it Autism is a combination of different things. A cure indicates something simple for something that is actually complex. I talked to my psychologist and she thinks that Autism Speaks is irresponsible to prey on the parents of Autistic children. Autism Speaks caters to the parents really more than the those with Autism which leads me to my next problem with them...

Autism Speaks had a commercial that was pulled because it made those with Autism objects, in particular objects of pity. I met a mom whose son was very Autistic and she was trying to start a support group for adults with Autism. I was around her twice and never went back. She talked AT me not too me. She was so used to herding her son, controlling things on his behalf, speaking on his behalf that she couldn't transition to dealing with an independent Autistic adult. To me, that's reminiscent of Autism Speaks. They're perfectly happy to think of Autistics as objects, those that need to be spoken for and taken care of, but they really don't want to deal with the Autistics as an individual with their own thoughts/desires that can speak for themselves (though maybe needing just a bit of help to do that). Why? Easier/neater to deal with the parents. Besides, they're often the ones with the $$$$.

Having said all this, I really sympathise with the parents of strongly Autistic children and I can understand why they'd want a "cure". I don't really fault them for that, I have more of an issue with those that tout a cure, like Autism Speaks.

That doesn't disprove any possibility of cure. They could come up with a way to manage different things. Nobody said it was simple. These assertions have been made up to belittle the goal.


If there was independence guaranteed with cure, none of this would occur. Even if we're not objects, some of us need to be cared for and spoken for, sadly. We don't need "just a bit of help", as if some should dismiss these gruesome impairments as trivial while congratulating themselves for being "helpful". You can't have it both ways. It's not like there isn't a bunch of mothers of autistics who have bought into this anti-cure mantra verbatim. I saw one of those mothers who at least talks in favor of "acceptance", debated some other individuals on the comments section of her blog, and then she said a few things to me, basically denying what I thought, knew, etc. She basically talked as if I never knew of what my problems and goals are, and as if she knew more than me of myself and my experiences. Attitudes like what you talk of are going to continue to occur for a while, but going after ultimate goals isn't a smooth or likable path. It really is a miserable one. That's why a radical, all encompassing solution that may be called "cure", is needed. It won't occur overnight. Autism Speaks isn't responsible for all of this. You don't have a fulfilling alternative that will eliminate all of these unbearable problems.

You make a good point.

Acceptance alone is being sold as a panacea that will solve everyone's problems. It's like selling snake oil.

It won't solve everyone's problems. I can accept you, but not be romantically interested in you, I can accept you, but if you can only work one day because it's too emotionally draining, your not not going to be a good employee.

The very high functioning might get by with acceptance only because they already have enough ability to get through most things, the acceptance would just be a push.

Acceptance might get the very high functioning who is shy around girls to the point of getting a date.

Acceptance won't get the guy who has sensory issues and wears torn clothes and doesn't bath more than once a week to the point of getting a date.

Those not so lucky, would not find acceptance alone to solve their problems.

In short, acceptance does not equal being liked.

No, you keep on saying I'm not making sense, but never bother to explain why. You haven't answered anything, you just keep on claiming that I'm not making sense. I don't care if you don't want me to disagree with you, I'm still going to because I do not agree. You're the one who brought debating definitions into thins. Having criticisms of modern society doesn't make me a hipster, and even if it did it wouldn't mean that those criticisms are invalid. And don't tell me not to bring other neurological differences into this and then tell me not to make this all about aspies.

And define "sane" for me, if you will.

You won't recognize the explanations I show, but that doesn't mean I didn't explain anything. You basically just change the subject and say irrelevant things. If you won't listen or act as if you're listening, my point isn't going to get across to you. I'm not going to let you change the subject. You bring up these criticisms that have no basis. You don't explain what you even want. Your demands are not understood.

*sigh*

I view the underlying problem as not being any condition, but that society places pointless expectations on people that not everyone can meet.

People with neurological differences that are considered "social disorders" generally don't suffer from their differences so much as they suffer the pointless expectations society puts on them.

Even if a cure were found for autism, the pointless expectations would still exist, and people with other conditions would still suffer because of them.

Thus, I feel the answer is not to try to "cure" people who are different, but to remove those social expectations, which were never important to being with.

did that make sense?

They are not neurological differences. Some are neurologically impaired, as they cannot do certain tasks.
Things that are expected need to be done anyway. Expectations are formed based on tasks that have to be done to meet the economic needs of actual individuals who make up societies. Society's needs are not pointless. Individuals need to know a way to interact with others. Individuals need to know ways to complete various basic tasks and work. You know this.
Even if the highly-abled are really nice despite someone else's weakness, the person with the weakness is still going to want what the other person has. Call it ego, pride, envy, etc. It's only natural. All want to advance and do things, and don't like others doing better than them, rather than being treated like a compliant grateful pet. One cannot be content just to remain alive with bare needs secured. Even things done for leisure or out of interest can be near impossible or difficult to do without certain abilities. Other conditions that impair mental functioning in some way or another should be cured too.

Hey, Tensu, you should probably just drop it. He'll do this forever, claim that all injustice is the fault of "able" aspies, and ignore any rhetoric you throw at him unless it agrees with him.