The Black List - think before you buy

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For me it was less about the stimulus (although thinking back, large groups were definitely harder to navigate then small ones..still are...hrrrmm) and more about total and utter social failure. I tried to be social... I wanted friends, but I just failed sooo miserably that life was easier alone and I ended up keeping to myself most of the time. Periodically I'd try again, but it was like banging my head against a wall. No one wanted anything to do with me other then bullying. One year the teacher tried to address the class about their bullying of me, and they all called me rude and mean, which I didn't understand in the least at the time.

Side track: wth did she take your pencils?!

I would like to give speeches and that is not introverted. I do not lack confidence. I do not feel socially left out. When I feel like accomplishing I do well. It is environment and my brain. If I go to many places in a day, the lighting is a certain way, I am outside of my routine my brain gets foggy. I think I am shy to give a speech perhaps. However if I am shy I think to myself do it to conquer it then onto the next thing.

Just to much changing wrecks my mind and certain kinds of lighting. I do not fear people. I do not fear much of anything. If fear is a obstacle I will overcome it. If I decide to accomplish something grandious I do it. The environment and mind overloading is not psychological based but has psychological results ( I can become mentally distorted and diluted from it). Also if people enjoy what my mind is interested in which is becoming more diverse I suppose as I age then I partake with them. For a long time it was computer parts and building computer and then it was certain kinds of psychology and then candles and then public relations for autism. If introversion keeps me from my interest I will kick it metaphorically in the butt but if it is neurological sensory overload primary I do not think I can do much about that but maybe mobile headphones and then sun glasses when the brain begins to fog.

The high school folks were very uninteresting and the classes either to hard or simply uninteresting. If I went back to the school time in a time machine I'd refuse to do anything in protest as I now have the audacity. I'd explain my brain in how it works and refuse to do anything but what was and is compatible. Well I ended up doing that anyways and was in the front pages of two newspapers in that area as well as two newspapers here. I know I have disabilities / differences but that does not mean I won't reshape the world in my own way to make room for how my mind works and others. I do not think anyone disagrees with this and if anyone does I got some of the piss and vintager talk.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt134955.html

Here is a link about the abortion issue and Autism Speaks. I have already presented autism and abortion social issues. I have decided I will wait until I write my official papers online. The context is more the psychology of autism abortion and the politics socially as what manifest here and elsewhere. Unfortunitly wisdom and emotions in actions are not always very good in these politics. I will continue to interject for the best interest of individuals who are living and bluntly define the biases, ethics and make recommendation in public relations. It is important to realize anti-cure has failed and will need to evolve to something else to avoid back lash from a growing number of individuals with autism who do not trust anti-cure advocates because they think others are removing improved potentials based on science. The abortion issue when combined with other issues is to much bias. Acceptance of individuals need not violate treatment advancements in research.

An abortion test may be developed and well hell that has nothing to do with wanting a cure. Wanting a cure has nothing to do with not accepting oneself and peer pressure otherwise will be overcome. Anti-cure merging the abortion issue is really anti-selective abortion politics and the assumed anti-cure objective is much the same as evading the right to treatment advancements and treatment choices. Anti-cure has been quite the manipulative politic and so easily others get involved in it based on peer pressure and ego games.

If folks want debate on the social issue they know how to get ahold of me. I will be creating many YouTube Videos about it and related issues to stimulate different ways of thinking. The idea is to de-polarize the extreme politics and have others focus on real-life improvements for those that need help.

hehe, CI, scroll down the page, both glider and I already read and commented on it like 6 months ago. xD It is a good post tho. Frankly I hope it's correct. Ultimately something will be developed. As long as it's post-natal therapys instead of pre-natal tests, we should be ok.

I cannot control such a test being developed. You will have to enter into the debate of abortion politics. Cure development has nothing to do with this. Ultimately the law states a women can have an abortion. If a person who is in prenatal development and cannot survive outside the womb who will develop freckles can be tested in the womb early on as likely to develop freckles does the women \ will the women have the right to abort. If it is legal to abort because of freckles and this is superficial, a sin, a discrimination and so on and the law allows for it then it is in the realm of morality persuasion. Anti-abortion with concern to autism defining the image of autism within society is a conflict of interest and so is self-esteem politics. All that matters is the fact of the needs of those with autism and the Asperger's Syndrome is very mild.

This politic will be separated accordingly and many will not be happy. The same interest that desire to not fund the needed help also oppose abortion in general. So the political lines are already drawn. I did not create them. I am ethically bound to preserve quality of life for those living, their opportunity and to end isolation when applicable and the preservation of truth is also vital to this for reasons of public trustability. Each polar extreme has their bias.

Well I never said I was 100% anti-cure. As I said before, it's a complicated issue. Any reasonable person would want treatments for those who need them without the eugenics. Problem is, research can have unintended consequences. Regardless, research is going to go forward. It always does. If we wish to keep the focus on voluntary treatments, we need to make sure we're funding organizations that listen to us. Autism speaks is not one of those organizations.

btw, what are you? You talk like you're a doctor or something.

Autism Speaks is a research and public relations organization. Autism Speaks seems to cater to individuals with autism, parents, professionals and the alike that seek to develop treatments that potentially can cure or reduce said symptoms. Anti-cure in conceptology evades this right in public relations awareness by definition. You are by definition and self-description an anti-selective abortion advocate. Anti-cure being pro-treatment development is an oxymoron and I do not believe you are a moron.

What am I? I am an autism self-advocate, public autism and general DD advocate and with specialty in DD inclusion media and public relations consultancy and deployment strategy.

Autism Speaks is an awareness nightmare. They're actively hurting our image. There are better research and support organizations to support.

I never described myself as anything. Not everyone sees issues as being black and white. Reasonable individuals understand that issues can be complicated. You have a right to a cure, but we don't want to have a neurological genocide on our hands either. There is also the issue of do we want everyone who is born with even a hint of the spectrum to be given a cure? AS has not demonstrated that they understand the community enough to handle the issues. Given that they seem to be the elephant in the room regarding Autism Research Funding, it may very well come down to their decisions that decides how the whole thing pans out. And frankly, we just don't trust them.

She said I had too many pencils, and that I didn't need that many. She should have just let me take them home, but when I asked where they were (she got them out of my desk before we students arrived at school) she brushed me off and said that she had them put away. I never did see them again.

I probably won't be on WP much today to discuss this thread or others because I have a heavy work load today. But I respect all of your posts here---I am anxious to talk more with you on this interesting topic Ducky9924 and Ci, (and others that have taken part in these discussions).

I'm thinking that Autism Speaks goes over board to create reaction. If an organization really wanted to end discrimination against individuals with autism I think they would become the example or show autism as a disability when others don't want to take it seriously for political correctness reasons. I am not sure what you mean by black and white. MY ego is effected easy but behind the scenes I don't think like other self-advocates do that are part of the heard. When others went against autism is a jail sentance I was pissed off because I was isolated for years and here you folks want to view it as just this difference in personality. Sometimes self-advocates need to stop hampering advocacy for others who are not even aware of this online stuff including ASAN or those who have been emotionally bullied to keep their mouths shut about their truth.

Self-esteem ego can be a good and bad thing.

The abortion issue is a conflict of interest.

Nathan Young

The Preservation Politics Model

Brief Subjective Overview

1. Abortion - To preserve life with the potential of a prenatal test for autism.

2. Supports - To preserve needed supports for human rights.

Conflicts

Note: Abortion politics will play down the seriousness of autism to preserve developing life.

Note: Support advocacy for quality of life will entice to preserve quality of life.

They need to be socio-politically separated for reasons of ethics. In extreme manifestations the two may end up battering each other politically. Preservation politics may confront one another even though they may seem to be both in the best interest of one another. For instance to state truth of needed supports may not be in the best interest of the image of autism for reasons of abortion politics. Confrontations may include accusations of supporting a prenatal abortion test to preserve the quality of life of the living in their needed supports.

A compromise is seeking to enhance diversity inclusion for this "difference" to show the world including parents to be that the world will embrace people with autism so to improve outcomes in mainstream cultures and societies.

The two do not mix well. The relating issues may be complicated but I've studied and mapped them out accordingly. I am prepared for debate and neutralization politics to preserve ethical standards and individual human rights.

Saddly their not trying anything of that sort. Their main focus right now is genetic testing. I read somewhere 60% of their research money is going toward genetic research. They're putting little effort into quality of life/opportunity improvements and betting it all on a full eradication either through a cure or a test.



A black and white issue is one with one simple correct answer. This is not one of them. ^.^



Yeah, there are asses on both sides. Being Autistic doesn't exclude you from being an ass. Frankly both sides need to stop.

If you have a bad case of Auspergers of Autism, I can see where the idea that we're just "different" can be frustrating. But I don't think anyone is under the delusion, that we're all just "different" and no one needs help. It's a spectrum and everyone handles it differently and has different capabilities. If someone handed me a bottle with a cure, I wouldn't take it, but I'd sure as heck wouldn't begrudge those who would.

There are always going to be those on the spectrum who are going to need a cure and they should get it.
The problem is how do we avoid "curing" everyone into being exactly the same?



Yes, yes it is. And I'm sure we got alot of pro-lifers in there convoluting the issue. But my stance on pre-natal testing has less to do with the sanctity of life, and more about the sanctity of genetic and neurological-diversity.

It's a simple practical matter of protecting our species.

Society needs it's nerds, techys and outcasts. Non-NT's make the whole thing work. If someone wants out, to be normal, and we have the ability to grant that, let them. But breeding non-NTs out all together is a recipe for becoming an evolutionary dead end. If a comet ever comes at earth, you think a NT is going figure out how to deflect it? Oh heck no. They'll be lucky to figure out it's even coming.

There is also the issue of simply keeping the genetics diverse. Eliminating autism genes (if there are any) from the population might not sound like a big deal, but anytime you reduce genetic diversity, you reduce our adaptability.

We're already having this issue with our agriculture. Thanks to a series of patents and genetic engineering the vast majority of our food is exactly the same genetically. All yellow corn we eat is the same strain. All potatoes, same strain, so on and so on. It didn't used to be this way. Every farmer had their own strain of a certain vegetable. The products produced are AMAZING. Drought resistant, bigger, heartier, bug resistant, disease resistant, easier to harvest, ect ect. But if a new bug disease ever came that the crop couldn't resist, instead of one or two farmers losing their crops, we could see entire worlds supply of corn go 'POOF".

In human's we've already begun eliminating some genetics in the name of cures, the more we eliminate, the more vulnerable we become. While justifiable in some cases, we should avoid eliminating every single abnormality that comes along. Abnormalities are how populations avoid mass extinctions.

Last edited by ducky9924 on 28 Feb 2011, 8:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The psychology of your arguments needs further understanding. I will brief this shortly.

If autism is viewed as a disability commonly to remove the perceived disability would commonly be perceived as a good thing. If social understanding were to evolve then this perspective would likely not exist. I think in root it is a cultural problem but at the same time ethics would entice the idea of the removal of a disability as very honorable. The approach of calling Autism Speaks for instance a Hitler, a Nazi and or genocide is not good in approach if you wish to accomplish at least part of your agenda.

Here is an ethical problem but socially in these alike social circles unpopular but in the mainstream likely acceptable.

*A female person with autism would like to know if the child she is carrying has autism in the womb and wants to abort. What rights in your political model would she have if she believes autism while a difference and with at least some advantages is a disability and she wants what she "believes" is best for her future family.

Nathan Young

Oh lovely Ethics problems. I hope I understood the question correctly.

I'm hesitant to condemn anyone for doing what they think is right within the context of the law. However, for the sake of both our people and the general population, logic dictates that we need to ban prenatal tests and genetic selection in regards to non-life threatening genetics.

Every time we come up with a way to test for something, it leads to less genetic diversity. Right now there is a controversy, because in the UK, parents are aborting children in the 3rd trimester if they have a cleft palet. Cleft Palets are easy enough to fix, however there is a loose association with retardation, so parents abort 'just in case'.

Frankly, I see this, and the fact that anyone would want to abort a baby just because it may be Autistic as a failure of society.

As a group we still have alot of quality of life issues inadvertently inflicted upon us by NTs that artificially inflate the downsides of the syndrome. Kids bully us in normal schools, employers skip over us because we don't perform well in interviews, and people avoid us just because we're a little strange. These are all fixable problems, that if fixed would make our lives much more enjoyable. Many of us who currently 'need' a cure may very well change their minds if they were treated with some respect and understanding. (Seriously, why do I have to be personable to get a job sitting in a cubicle crunching numbers or code?!).

There will still be those that they genuinely need more then just accommodation and understanding. Those who are unable to interact or function with others on any meaningful level. By all means, come up with drugs and treatments to help them.

However.... you can't justify breeding away an entire unique population, because a portion of them have serious health issues. That's like doing surgery with a machete.

I will sum it up quickly.

1. The idea that everyone has a bit of autism has failed and is a simple psychological trick \ gimmick likely initially designed to help people relate and to help with the advocacy.

2. The abortion issue is regrettable but how far will anti-abortion advocates go to help their side when it is mentally disturbing individuals with autism. Yes the issue is not the fault of anti-abortion people yet the more wood added to the fire per say the more psychosocial destruction and anti-societal like fantasy / ideals / thoughts manifest.

I cannot solve the abortion issue. Yet the issue need to be separated from other issues for the preservation of the quality of truth. This will be done with ease. It has already been done in part. There are indirect ways to assist society in appreciating the diversity at hand by means of inclusion. No human is perfect and the pursuit of perfection in race has histological relevancy to help society realize the mistakes of the past.

I had made a post, but edited it away because I have decided I don't need more anxiety in my life. And anxiety is all I feel would come out of debating my firm beliefs on this thread.