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Asperger96
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20 Dec 2013, 9:50 am

I have this Neurodiversity poster on my binder, and a classmate just asked me what it meant. I was glad to explain it, but I completely botched it. I mumbled something about neurotypes and minority rights and brain structure, but it was pretty obvious i wasn't communicating anything useful

Next time i'm asked, what exactly should I say?



StatsNerd
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20 Dec 2013, 1:10 pm

Neurodiversity is quickly becoming one of my favorite words.

Just as there is diversity in skin pigmentation, there is diversity in cognition.



Asperger96
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20 Dec 2013, 1:34 pm

Another interesting one I heard is Neurohomogeny; which is the opposite philosophy, that such profound divergence in cognition is wrong



Willard
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20 Dec 2013, 2:28 pm

:lmao: 'Neurohomogeny' - isn't that the same thing as "Hive Mind"? What an Orwellian concept.

8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O

Assimilate or die. Resistance is futile.



Asperger96
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20 Dec 2013, 4:54 pm

That looks good on the forum post, but in the html it looks like a lazy teacher grading: 80 80 80 80 80 80 80

I read that word on ASD community, and I think that it can cover everyone from those who just don't understand autistics and don't want to, as well as the scary eugenics nuts. And everyone in between



Willard
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20 Dec 2013, 5:33 pm

Asperger96 wrote:
it can cover everyone from those who just don't understand autistics and don't want to, as well as the scary eugenics nuts. And everyone in between


Yes, all those "You don't have a disability, you just aren't trying hard enough" bullies, and the Autism Speaks "Autistic kids are a tragic burden that should be CURED out of existence" advocates. :roll:



cubedemon6073
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20 Dec 2013, 6:43 pm

Willard wrote:
:lmao: 'Neurohomogeny' - isn't that the same thing as "Hive Mind"? What an Orwellian concept.

8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O

Assimilate or die. Resistance is futile.


This is 'Neurohomogeny'.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyenRCJ_4Ww[/youtube]



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05 Jan 2014, 6:00 pm

Here's a house metaphor for people who like houses, and others...

There are three basic concepts that can be explained in brain function and houses that could be useful in explaining (neuro)biodiversity in the brain. One is the sizes, and types of rooms. The next is the electrical system that powers things in the house. The other is the way the rooms are connected to each other and to the outside world. Please pardon my lack of terminology, as I don't work on houses or study anatomy much.

The sizes and types of rooms is a good way of explaining specialized processing clusters that are dedicated to processing a certain type of information. It can even be used to describe how people look on the outside, but that's another lesson. Basically, brain regions are affected by several things, such as our genetics, how much we think about something, and the amount of space that's available. The same is true for designing rooms in a house. Some people prefer huge laundry rooms, others prefer huge living rooms, and others prefer huge kitchens.

Our brains also have to be powered in order for us to think. Many scientists use images of blood flow to track real-time maps of brain activity. The way different processing clusters of our brains are powered affects how well we can think in certain ways. In a house, rooms get power through wires in the walls connecting breaker boxes to outlets. Some older houses, like mine, are wired with lower capacity breakers and wiring, so more powerful appliances will not run as well in some rooms. In the hallway, if someone decides to vacuum, it trips the breaker and the power goes out in half of the living room! Some brains even have "dead zones" that don't get enough nourishment to function at all, just like my grandma's closet, which I have no interest in visiting, ever...

Just like in a house, there are many interconnections between specialized processing clusters in our brains. Sometimes it's hard to get to that back room because there is a lot of junk in the way, and I have to go through a bunch of other rooms to get there. Some rooms don't have window views of the back yard, so if you're in that room, you have no idea what's going on there. Some of the doors are the wrong shape so they scrape against the door frames. Just like a house, the neural connections in the brain can be a bit messed up, and some regions won't be directly connected at all. Of course, the brain is much more adjustable than rooms in a house.

Just like there are problems and limitations in various houses, there are differences in various peoples brains that give them challenges, or make them unimaginably smart in one area (like the kitchen) such as math! A lot of people have wiring and processing capacities that conform to the "standard" (house codes), even if their abilities are a little higher or lower than the code, and since the wiring is in the walls, most people just take it for granted that it works.

Okay, maybe that made no sense to a lot of people, but I hope it made sense to someone other than myself...


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Asperger96
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06 Jan 2014, 8:54 am

KWifler wrote:
Here's a house metaphor for people who like houses, and others...

There are three basic concepts that can be explained in brain function and houses that could be useful in explaining (neuro)biodiversity in the brain. One is the sizes, and types of rooms. The next is the electrical system that powers things in the house. The other is the way the rooms are connected to each other and to the outside world. Please pardon my lack of terminology, as I don't work on houses or study anatomy much.

The sizes and types of rooms is a good way of explaining specialized processing clusters that are dedicated to processing a certain type of information. It can even be used to describe how people look on the outside, but that's another lesson. Basically, brain regions are affected by several things, such as our genetics, how much we think about something, and the amount of space that's available. The same is true for designing rooms in a house. Some people prefer huge laundry rooms, others prefer huge living rooms, and others prefer huge kitchens.

Our brains also have to be powered in order for us to think. Many scientists use images of blood flow to track real-time maps of brain activity. The way different processing clusters of our brains are powered affects how well we can think in certain ways. In a house, rooms get power through wires in the walls connecting breaker boxes to outlets. Some older houses, like mine, are wired with lower capacity breakers and wiring, so more powerful appliances will not run as well in some rooms. In the hallway, if someone decides to vacuum, it trips the breaker and the power goes out in half of the living room! Some brains even have "dead zones" that don't get enough nourishment to function at all, just like my grandma's closet, which I have no interest in visiting, ever...

Just like in a house, there are many interconnections between specialized processing clusters in our brains. Sometimes it's hard to get to that back room because there is a lot of junk in the way, and I have to go through a bunch of other rooms to get there. Some rooms don't have window views of the back yard, so if you're in that room, you have no idea what's going on there. Some of the doors are the wrong shape so they scrape against the door frames. Just like a house, the neural connections in the brain can be a bit messed up, and some regions won't be directly connected at all. Of course, the brain is much more adjustable than rooms in a house.

Just like there are problems and limitations in various houses, there are differences in various peoples brains that give them challenges, or make them unimaginably smart in one area (like the kitchen) such as math! A lot of people have wiring and processing capacities that conform to the "standard" (house codes), even if their abilities are a little higher or lower than the code, and since the wiring is in the walls, most people just take it for granted that it works.

Okay, maybe that made no sense to a lot of people, but I hope it made sense to someone other than myself...


I liked it, but I wouldn't use it to explain it to my classmates, Theyd stop listening after the first paragraph



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09 Jan 2014, 5:50 pm

Neurodiversity is a flawed concept. If I thought that the opinions of neurotypicals were equally valid to my own opinions then I would just cave in to their opinions just so I could fit in.



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09 Jan 2014, 10:29 pm

Willard wrote:
Asperger96 wrote:
it can cover everyone from those who just don't understand autistics and don't want to, as well as the scary eugenics nuts. And everyone in between


Yes, all those "You don't have a disability, you just aren't trying hard enough" bullies, and the Autism Speaks "Autistic kids are a tragic burden that should be CURED out of existence" advocates. :roll:


Neurohomogeny...scary indeed. I can handle the "not trying hard enough" bullies, that's just sheer ignorance. You can't blame people for not knowing what they don't know. The Autism Speaks issue however....well, now we are getting a little closer to an idea that borders on basic human cruelty. What is worse perhaps, is the power that Autism Speaks has. Seems they are behind everything these days, including a forum you all know quite well. Autism TV while you wait anyone? Meanwhile, the community just seems to sit back and think its okay because at least we are being "acknowledged". Gee thanks Autism Speaks...

I think its time we start really discussing the basics of neurodiversity again. We would do well to be mindful of the damage done when we, ourselves, take a heavy Aspies vs. NTs stance in such a vehemently "us vs them" context.


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10 Jan 2014, 3:28 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
Neurodiversity is a flawed concept. If I thought that the opinions of neurotypicals were equally valid to my own opinions then I would just cave in to their opinions just so I could fit in.


I think opinions of Neuromajority areas valid as my own. That means I give them equal consideration then make up my own mind, not "cave in"


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11 Jan 2014, 2:24 pm

Equally valid does not mean equal consideration. After consideration of the ideas of the neurotypical you must come to the conclusion that your ideas are no more valid than their ideas. Since both ideas are equally valid it would make logical sense to choose to believe the ideas of the nuerotypical so you can fit in since there is no advantage to the opinions of the autistic.



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11 Jan 2014, 4:01 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
Equally valid does not mean equal consideration. After consideration of the ideas of the neurotypical you must come to the conclusion that your ideas are no more valid than their ideas. Since both ideas are equally valid it would make logical sense to choose to believe the ideas of the nuerotypical so you can fit in since there is no advantage to the opinions of the autistic.

That is horrifying. A lot of people went along with the Nazi's in WWII Germany just because it would have been a disadvantage to voice opposition to them. And look what happened.



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12 Jan 2014, 6:31 am

Asperger96 wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
Equally valid does not mean equal consideration. After consideration of the ideas of the neurotypical you must come to the conclusion that your ideas are no more valid than their ideas. Since both ideas are equally valid it would make logical sense to choose to believe the ideas of the nuerotypical so you can fit in since there is no advantage to the opinions of the autistic.

That is horrifying. A lot of people went along with the Nazi's in WWII Germany just because it would have been a disadvantage to voice opposition to them. And look what happened.


I think androbot2084 was trying to point out a flaw in my argument saying that if I consider both arguments equal valid by logic I should choose the neurotypical one out of convenience. I don't believe androbot2084 believes one should blindly accept ideas from anyone Nazis or otherwise. I believe that androbot2084 believes neuorotypical ideas to be inferior.

Logical or not since part of me is aspie those are the ones I am more likely to choose. But I will not automatically or always choose them because I do not think an Aspie idea is automatically superior to a neuromajority one. Each idea needs to be judged on it's merit. I do think there are advantages to autistic ideas even though having them usually it makes it much harder to fit it. Usually not always.


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12 Jan 2014, 9:41 am

I don't agree with the viewpoint that all ideas are equally valid. For example, the notion that autism is caused by vaccination is refuted pseudoscientific bunk. Baron-Cohen's extreme male brain theory has some scientific validity and some major weaknesses. The Markrams' Intense World Theory also has weaknesses, but has the advantage of both scientific validity and the fact that it explains most observed phenomena in autism. You can't say that all these ideas are equally valid.

The idea that someone else's ignorance is as good as my view based on good science is extremely dangerous - it's one thing getting us deeper into trouble over climate change. What is important is that the science is carefully scrutinised for bias - and failure to do so has also caused no end of trouble, from eugenics to the neurotransmitter theory of mental illness.

Then you have to ask what interests might be served by an idea. An idea that supports a fascist eugenics policy supporting neurohomogeneity is incredibly dangerous and should be opposed, as has been correctly pointed out. One that supports acceptance of difference both makes the Homo "sapiens" species stronger and is more compassionate. These two ideas are not, to my mind, equal.

Yes, I do understand the corollary that others will insist their ideas are superior to mine. At that point, we need agreement on what makes an idea good or bad, or at least better or worse. That is more complicated.