Martial Arts Patterns or kata

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I have been doing Taekwondo for about 18 months now which I believe has improved my confidence and fitness. One problem I have been having is remembering patterns which is a sequence of moves(if you do Karate you may call it a kata). I was wondering if anybody else has had a similar issue and knows a good way of remembering it which works for somebody with AS. I practice most days but it appears I have had less than partial success learning them this way. My club have been very supportive. I also believe I am mildly dyslexic. So if anybody has any suggestions I would be happy to know about them. LOL

Last edited by Robbie on 14 Mar 2011, 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

It's "kata", not "carta".

In order to remember them better, try to understand their purpose. Research it.

Thank you. I have corrected the spelling of kata.

I will try this.

Last edited by Robbie on 14 Mar 2011, 5:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Try and video the lesson on a camcorder or flip, then you can watch it back as often as you like and see the moves over and over again.

There are lots of different learning styles. I always found it difficult to learn something while being in the middle of it (including kata), so I like to step back and either take a break or try to learn in a different way. Read about it, watch others perform it, or go over an instructional dvd.

I remember trying to learn to skate when I was a lot younger. The first night at the rink I fell over about 40 times... and the second and third night. I didn't go back for a couple of weeks, but then only fell over about three times.

I believe the process is called 'Consolidation of the engram complexes' whereby the brain uses periods of no active learning to put what was learned into a useful order.

Perhaps you could try visualizing a map of your Taekwondo poomsae or hyungs, one which features each position. Then, maybe it is easier to remember the order. It is just like knowing the direction to go to leave your house from your bedroom, neighborhood from your house, or your place of work from your neighborhood.

If you can't watch someone do it, begin by simplifying the form. Review the steps from beginning to end without any other movements of the hands. You can imagine the stances. Then you can visualize the shape of the movements on a plane. Graduate to performing the physical steps in proper stance without hand movements. Finally, add the hand movements once you know all of the footwork and can visualize each step on the plane. Also, it was suggested to learn the purpose for each movement. That is essential. Know why you are going to each place. The forms are meant to encapsulate a series of similar techniques. At some point you should execute the entire form as one large task against one or more imagined opponents.

Like any task which becomes routine, efficiency is likely to increase with frequency. So practice it even though you remember it.

First ,.. one of my best friends is a Hopkido master, I am not!
Forgive me if I dont explain it well but this is how "I" do it. ... And its weird , but works for me.

What I do is break it down into its individual parts..kinda like music is to dance steps. I'll start at a slow speed and assign each step a sound and then start connecting them, Repeating first few and adding as comfortable but its more complicated that

VVwhat I mean by musicVV

I program the speed of my movement like that of a cnc robot. Some moves are fast,or powerful and some very slow and precise. Like the sound of the motors speeding up and slowing down their pitch changes. So my speed ends up being a slow is low pitch and fast is high
I'll incorporate the pause or stop points into a rythem or beat that fits the sequence It doesnt have to sound right or good,just fit the timing.
A duration/time that a note is held and a beat is what I end up with

I guess for lack of a better explaination it is "reverse interpretive dancing", taking the movement and adding sound to it. I play drums and the two "fit" for me. Move >sound/sound >move,.. there seems to be an interactivity that connects the two.

Hope this helps, my word skills arent the greatest, and I dont read music. I just understand it


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHkucr1j ... re=related

I think patterns are pointless, they don't teach any practical moves. Shadowboxing or drilling are better ways to spend your time outside of sparring.

Please elaborate on this comparison.

Patterns are a long and sequential list of moves. They are pointless since they are just a fixed routine. You are better off just drilling short combos since a fixed routine doesn't teach you how to apply your techniques spontaneously. Let's say you wanna work on your punches. Why not just do a couple drills of that rather than a long series of punches, kicks, blocks, etc? Also you can experiment with different punches, timing, ranges, angles, etc rather than just going through the motions of a fixed routine.

Also some of the moves they teach are ret*d. Like how they teach you to step forward with the rear foot. Why not just step in with the front foot and slide with the rear foot?

How about a feint-step to a kick with the leading foot? I know that is a simple example, but it negates your insistence that stepping at all with the rear foot is ret*d. Its also difficult to respond without knowing how much combative freedom you are trying to indicate when you talk about "sparring." I think your comments are too general and based upon assumptions.

It is true that much of what resulted in classical martial arts is no longer applicable. Thus, for example, the evolution from Japanese Juujutsu to Brazillian "Jiu-Jitsu." Koryuu Juujutsu, or "traditional/classical combative arts (armed or unarmed)," from which the traditional Kara Te styles you are familiar with were derived, were divined in a time and place where people moved differently and behaved differently. Bushi who carried weapons and armor during the Sengoku or Warring states period found themselves in physical positions which were much more limiting: weighted with heavy armor, kneeling on mats, et cetera. All of the protocols of the time encouraged different valuations of movement. In all close-quarters settings one's movements would have been much more temperate, much more moderated. Those limits do not exist today.

I think those patterns you disagree with can still teach a lot about moving and using the body. But perhaps it is simply that those traditional styles remain too pervasive for me to note an example of a great fighter that learned from a place of complete freedom. It doesn't matter whether you first learn Karate or Krav Maga; there are patterns and combinations, the tools of teaching, which must be unlearned to be fully prepared.

Yes I was speaking very generally but if I was to address the nuances, then it would be very long-winded. And the feint kick thing would be fine if they only teach you to step forward with your rear foot when you're feinting a kick. But no, I've been taught to do so while doing a series of punches which is absolutely ret*d. Pretty much every move in every pattern I've been taught involves stepping forward with the rear foot.

There's a difference between patterns and combinations, it isn't just semantics. Patterns a a long fixed routine which doesn't pertain to a specific type of attack or defense, but it is a sequential mix of both which is why they are pointless. And no all these patterns have taught me is bad movement and bad everything. What the hell is the point of chambering my fist to my hip? That's just gonna open me up to a hook to the jaw. And who uses a horse stance in a fight? You could say the chambering thing is just a training tool, but they still do this in higher belt patterns and why couldn't you teach the concept of chambering from a normal guard and fighting stance?

All I've learned is useless footwork, stances, blocks, and punches. Oh, and martial arts have been watered down big time so patterns are pretty much aesthetic these days and even a lot of the strictly combat-oriented moves have been pussified.

The front stance is absolutely useless and one of my instructors back then told me that the reason I keep my back leg absolutely straight and my shoulders squared is so that if an opponent is behind me he can't break my stance if he tries to stomp down on the back of my knee. WTF? Why wouldn't he try something smarter such as hitting me in the back of the head? It would make much more sense for him to punch me in the back of the neck since I'm stuck in such a rigid stance. Why would I do a long sequential list of punches, kicks, blocks, and s**t like that when I could mix em up in a drill and apply em more spontaneously and accordingly to what I need to work on? On top of that, patterns have a lot of useless punches, kicks, blocks, footwork, and stances. The blocks are ret*d. Why would I chamber a block before blocking a punch? Why not just parry a straight or cover the side of my head against a hook?

I can agree with more of your reasoning, now that you are more explicit. It is complicated to analyze when talking about body movement in general, but your examples are great. If I were teaching Shotokan today, then I could offer fewer justifications for why certain movements are useful without framing it in the historical context or in the context of the art exclusivlely, like ballet or wushu.

But when I refer to this being a complex topic, here is the caveat I offer: it is to the individual to use the style, and no top fighters that learn a traditional art use them so stringently in combat. Here is a similar, more unequivocal opinion of a dominant fighter who is regarded as top in the world for his class:

To the OP,

What style of Taekwon-do do you do? I used to compete in ITF Taekwon-do. So I might be able to help you out.