Palaeolithic Diet

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Are there any fans of the palaeolithic diet out there?

If so, what do you think of it? How long have you been on it? Do you have an recommended reading in regards to it? What about palaeolithic lifestyles in general?

I'm on the paleo diet, more or less. One thing I learned is that you have to detox from sugar, especially if you're a sugar addict like me. It sucks. Also, you need lots of fats in your diet to replace the carbs that you're cutting out. If you don't have enough fats, you will crave carbs. Stuff like sunflower seed kernels and nuts like almonds and walnuts, unless you have a nut allergy. Also fatty meats like pork. If you're a sugar addict, you will have to acknowledge it and realize that you can't be 100% perfect about it, especially since sugar (or high fructose corn syrup) is in practically everything. You will have to learn how to cook for yourself, as an aspie I find that cooking for myself is very draining emotionally, must be the executive functioning issues. I recommend Why We Get Fat by Gary Taubes, he is a nutritionist and lays out the reasons why the carb heavy, no fat diet is guaranteed to fail. In a nutshell, it goes against 70,000 years of human evolution. Our bodies are designed to run on fat, not grain. Grain was domesticated only 10k years ago. I love your avatar, is the plushie on paleo too?

You can eat balanced, no fat, live long and die of cancer, or you can eat all fat and die young of a heart attack. It's a big decision how one dies, y'know.

Why are you specifically interested in paleo?

I'm more on a "flexitarian diet." I'm predominantly rice-and-beans, eggs for breakfast occasionally, and MAYBE twice a week I'll eat meat. In my experience, the reason diets fail is because they all involve food. If you want to lose weight, you have to stop eating. You can lose weight FAST by fasting (be careful, though…I was able to do 40 days and nights, and it was entirely a spiritual thing and not a health thing. I lost almost 80 lb. during that time and over a few weeks later while I transitioned back to eating normally. I've gained 15 lb. or so back since then, so I'm just within a healthy BMI). As long as you're taking in the nutrition your body needs, you will maintain weight. Any more than that and you'll gain weight. The whole evolution thing, IMO, is kinda hokey and gimmicky. I wouldn't buy into it. Pursue a diet that you'll both enjoy and that will support a healthy lifestyle.

Oh, and dittos on cutting the sugar. A paleo diet is by its nature ketogenic. About 4 weeks into my fast, after I'd been in ketosis for some time, every time I drank water I tasted something that was intensely sweet, like concentrated honey or something. I was also exhaling so much acetone I thought I was in a nail polish remover factory. A ketogenic diet mimics this effect since, although you won't be metabolizing sugar, you will be building up the same kinds of chemicals in your bloodstream that people going through extreme starvation do. You MIGHT have a similar kind of experience, so just be aware of it…it's nothing to panic over. When I first began fasting, I had MASSIVE headaches from sugar and sodium withdrawal. It'll pass in about three days once ketosis sets in. A paleo diet isn't the same as fasting, so I doubt the effects will be as pronounced, and you also don't have to deal with hunger pangs. With fasting, you stop feeling hungry after about two weeks and it's tolerable after that. Above all, really push the water. Try for a gallon a day if you can. Even now if I'm feeling hungry to the point of insanity, I'll drink as much as 2 liters in just a few minutes. For some reason I find my concentration and overall energy levels are better, and I don't know if it's a pressure effect on the brain or what.

Best of luck!

I am a big fan.


I think it is fantastic but greatly misunderstood. It gets presented in the media as a bacon and beef diet but that's not what it's about at all. In fact it is arguably going to be quite different for different people depending on their genetics. It is also not possible to re-create exactly since many of the foods of that time no longer exist. But I have found it gives me a whole new paradigm for food shopping and cooking.

Close to 2 years.

I recommend websites rather than books because books tend to be quite prescriptive while websites are more dynamic and can change as new things are found. They are also more dynamic because the website curators can integrate things they learn from partcipants in the forums, comments and at the various meetings like AHS (Ancestral Health Symposium). My favorites:

www.marksdailyapple.com

www.gnolls.org

www.drbganimalpharm.blogspot.com


Lots of good stuff there too. I have adopted at least some of their workout advice (at my age, I can only adopt some). I also go barefoot as much as possible, let myself get cold and don't wear sunscreen anymore.

Consuming large amount of water in a short period of time is dangerous as it may cause water intoxication.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_intoxication

Yes, but I'm also 5'10" and about 167 lb. A gallon of water between, say, 5:00 a.m. and 3:00 p.m. is not an extraordinary feat. For me, half if not all that isn't unusual before noon. I also am in the habit of keeping my sodium levels up, so I'm not terribly worried about water intoxication around mealtimes. I'm highly prone to overeating and have been most of my life, so I have to be pretty close to insanity to put away 2 liters in under 30 minutes.

Fasting, on the other hand, was just wild. I took small sips of water frequently throughout the day and MIGHT have topped out at 2 gallons in one day. I was having a lot of problems with dry-mouth towards the end and difficulties swallowing, so I was drinking a lot of water just to get a little relief. In my final week the hyponatremia really started getting to me as I was having difficulty sleeping and breathing.

The thing with water intoxication is it's really difficult to do damage that way, and I mean EXTREME amounts of water. It's not unusual for me to take in 1 liter or more at a time. If you weigh less and are smaller than me, you might want to take it a little easier than I do. However, I do believe it affects my moods somewhat. I tend to experience anxiety often, anyway, along with depression. Chugging water doesn't really make it go away, but for some reason anxiety and depression don't seem quite as crippling when I've been drinking a lot of water.

I just wanted to point out that recommending what works for you to others carelessly could lead to accidents.
You don't know the op's height/weight so recommending drinking a gallon of water a day might not be appropriate. If she has a small frame it could be very dangerous.

This happened recently. A girl died after drinking just two liters in two hours.
http://edition.cnn.com/2014/02/08/justice/tennessee-girl-soda-death/

True. But that girl was 5 years old, too. It's really difficult for an average adult to overdo water. Even if you far exceed adequate intake, you're body is still going to eliminate it quickly. You're not going to hurt anything as long as you don't consume more than you can eliminate in a reasonable amount of time. Also, if your stomach feels full, chances are you've had enough. It just happens that I personally can handle a lot. But then, I'm in and out of the bathroom at least once an hour, too, so there are obvious practical issues here that might also cause problems for others.

Average adequate intake for, I guess, an adult female would be roughly 2 liters in a day…obviously not all at once:

http://www.mayoclinic.org/water/ART-20044256

I would think on a paleo diet, since your protein will be up in addition to fat, slightly higher water intake would work well to balance out the higher sodium levels. I won't suggest as much water as I drink, but a slight bump in liquids isn't a bad idea.

Those are VERY interesting links, thank you!

I have come across marks daily apple but not the other two. I was wondering about things like metabolism and its ability to switch between glucose and fat metabolism...shall read.

Fat metabolism is WAY different from glucose metabolism. The biggest immediate medical risk will be proteins in the blood and their effects on the kidneys. But I'd think that the risk would be minimal.

Read up on ketogenic diet as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketogenic_diet

Paleo isn't the same as ketogenic, of course, since you'll be getting SOME carbs and naturally occurring sugars. But I'd predict similar physiological effects given the high-fat content of paleo.

I'd suggest reconsidering if you have an eating disorder. If you have a low BMI you might want to bulk up on carbs and sugars for the short term and then switch to paleo as a maintenance diet. I would much prefer a vegan diet myself, but my family isn't vegan and I've found that strict avoidance of all meat and meat products are a hardship, plus I don't have any ideological issues with eating meat. I'm all for it. But I find I can keep more reasonable portion sizes when I avoid meat, so I can keep a consistent weight more easily and lose weight when I NEED to. That way I stay out of a gain/loss roller coaster and don't have to obsess over it like I used to.

If you're super-skinny already, look at anything that might be affecting metabolism…like nicotine or caffeine consumption (excess caffeine will boost cortisol, actually, which is helpful if you're underweight. I quit coffee for several months and found I lost weight faster than with caffeine. I'm not aware of nicotine having the same effect, and I've never smoked/don't plan on smoking. And smoking is just, well, BAD anyway).

Overall, I'm just speaking from my own experience…you should think about seeing a professional nutritionist more than anything else. You've got some good internet sources here to get an idea of how to get started, but I'd supplement that advice with a nutritionist just to be sure you're body is getting what it needs and you're not messing yourself up.

I'm not on a paleo diet but according to this website "The Paleo Diet What to Eat?", it seems that my diet is pretty close to it.

Eat:
Grass-produced meats (I don't eat meat other than seafood)
Fish/seafood
Fresh fruits and veggies
Eggs
Nuts and seeds
Healthful oils (Olive, walnut, flaxseed, macadamia, avocado, coconut)

Don't eat:
Cereal grains
Legumes (including peanuts)
Dairy
Refined sugar
Potatoes
Processed foods
Salt
Refined vegetable oils

I eat lots of veges and fruits. Eggs and fish for protein. No wheat products or dairy. And I'm trying to cut back on salt as much as I can. The only oil I use is either olive or virgin coconut oil.
The only difference is that I eat rice and potatoes occasionally.

This website's sample menu seems healthy enough. It doesn't say you need to eat lots of animal fats, it recommends the opposite actually. (Lean beef, skinless turkey breast) and lots of vegetables.
I don't think we should consume too much animal protein on Paleo diet if it's based on the eating habits of our ancestors in the Paleolithic period, between 2.5 million and 10,000 years ago. I don't believe they ate meat everyday. They had to stalk the animal for long time so meat was a rare treat after a strenuous hunt. Not to mention it was a totally different kind of meat, the lean meat of wild animals, nothing like the corn fed chicken or grain fed beef that we get today.

So I think it's a good diet overall, if you limit animal protein to a minimum and make sure you eat lots of fresh veges and fruits.

I recommend the book Why We Get Fat by Gary Taubes. It is a good informative read. But, I'd like to make a correction as well. Taubes is not a nutritionist as someone else posted. He's just a science writer.

I'm definitely for avoiding highly refined carbs like sugar and white flour, especially if you come from a certain genetic background. A lot of indigenous peoples cannot tolerate a diet rich in carbs, but I'm not so sure you really need to go paleo...

The closest to a real paleo diet that ANYBODY eats these days would be traditional diet of the Inuit. They eat lots of marine mammal blubber, raw meat we would consider rancid, and raw organ meats... I bet nobody in this thread is eating eyeballs and raw kidney. (just sayin').
...and eating their meat raw is why the Inuit diet works. google 'the Inuit paradox' for more info.

There's an interesting "skeptic check" pod cast over at bigpicturescience.org right now. It's worth a listen.

http://www.bigpicturescience.org/

[opinion=mine]

Palaeolithic Diet == Just another diet fad.

[/opinion]

Does anyone have any experience with the Paleo Autoimmune Protocol? It's an elimination diet that is a stricter version of the Paleo diet. (For example, no nuts, eggs or nightshades are allowed, plus some other differences I can't recall offhand).

I'd heard the paleo diet is good for autoimmune problems and had thought about trying it, but the Autoimmune Protocol version seems like it would be rather hard to follow. I've been gluten and dairy free for about seven years now and gave up nightshades about a year ago and, honestly, those restrictions present enough challenges in daily life as it is.

Just curious if anyone has tried this and, if so, what kind of results you experienced.

I read your question a couple of days ago and it just dawned on me this morning that I have done exactly that, the name threw me off.
Ten years ago I began to experience some rheumatoid arthritis type symptoms. My joints became stiff, swollen and painful, they felt like they were on fire. My hands got so stiff that I couldn't make a fist and the little finger on my right hand wouldn't bend at all and then I had a flare-up that left me flat on my back for a couple of days.
So I did some research and found that symptoms of autoimmune diseases like RA could often be managed with a restricted diet so I decided to give it a try.
I restricted my diet to vegetables - minus the nightshades, beans, fruit, a lot of salmon for the omega -3's , grilled chicken, olive oil and water. And 6 months later, all of the arthritis symptoms were completely gone.
I wasn't 100 percent militant about it, I would cheat a little here and there every now and then, but for those first 6 months I took it very seriously.
I've kind of 'fallen off the wagon' a bit since then, I still eat reasonably healthy, I mainly try to avoid processed foods and greasy stuff and so far I none of the RA symptoms have returned - fingers crossed.
It wasn't an easy diet to follow, it takes a little extra effort and can be inconvenient but it was well worth it and I never felt better. All my digestive issues cleared up, my hair and skin looked great, in fact my barber, a woman, always mentioned how soft my hair was - lol
So to sum it up, I think that anyone would benefit from a diet of vegetables , good meat - especially fish, fresh fruit and water, so simple , so easy - a caveman could do it.

^^That's very interesting. Thank-you for responding. It's kind of comforting to hear that someone found it simple and easy and also had a good outcome.

I'm easing into the changes and in addition to the gluten, dairy and nightshades, gave up grains and eggs over the last week and started getting rid of corn and soy, too. (I am still searching for a soy-free fish oil supplement and multivitamin, but am nearly soy-free at the moment). In the next two weeks, I'm going to try wean off of nuts and legumes. Due to thyroid concerns, I am also limiting my intake of veggies that interfere with thyroid function (mainly cruciferous veggies) to only in cooked or steamed form and only in moderation. Also got myself off coffee recently and replaced it with green tea.

I'd always thought I'd eaten a diet that's healthier than the Standard American Diet, but it's still amazing just how much soy and canola oil I was consuming in salad dressings and other store-bought foods, not to mention weird additives that cause inflammation, too, like guar gum and carrageenan. During the elimination diet phase, which will last a few months or until I start feeling a lot better, I'm going to be making everything from scratch, in order to avoid all the extra additives. Entrees, broths, salad dressings, making my own coconut milk yogurt, etc. It should be interesting.

It's been sort of overwhelming, but desperate times call for desperate measures. And, I've been trying to make finding recipes with my limited repertoire of ingredients a game, like I'm on Chopped, but can only use the mystery basket ingredients or something. Lol.