Schizoid Personality... possible comorbidity?

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I'm diagnosed with aspergers, but the more I read up on schizoid personality, the more it sounds like me. Is that because its so similar to ASDs or is it actually possible to have both?

Schizoid PD is pretty much the mildest end of ASDs (along with NvLD), as per Lorna Wing who coined the autistic spectrum.

Meaning, you'll probably identify with at least some of it if you have an ASD.

Ah. I was just worried about the possibility of also being on the schizophrenia spectrum because I heard somewhere that you can always slide further down the schizophrenia spectrum and that scares the crap out of me.

I mean, I like what I think are my schizoid features (keeping people at a distance keeps me protected, not feeling the need to bother with social relationships frees up more time for me to work, etc.), but as soon as I start thinking people are sending me messages through the TV and I start hearing voices... yowza.

The probabaility of Schizoid PD evolving to schiziophrenia is very low (although higher than general population); I think that what is is a high probability of the relatives having schiziophrenia.

However, I have some distrust about the diagnosis, both of AS and of SPD, because dos not seem to be a solid criteria of diferential diagnosis; I think that even the DSM is contradictory - in the article about AS, it says that the difference is "early onset" in AS; in the article about SPD, it says that the diference is the "stereotyped behaviour" in AS.

As I said, some studies show high incidence, BOTH of classical autism and schiziophrenia in the relatives of people with SPD and AS, then probably SPD/AS are simultaneosly in the two spectrums (perhaps A+B genes provoke classical autism, B+C genes provoke AS or SPD, and C+D genes provoke schiziophrenia)

TPE2,

The ICD-10 calls AS Schizoid PD of childhood, so you can kinda see that some professionals are a little skeptical over the differences (a lot of professionals are involved in the ICD-10).

Ah yes. I have considered Schizoid myself.

It's technically impossible to be diagnosed with both because there are exclusion criteria, but I think it's entirely possible for an autistic person to also have that personality style--that is, extremely introverted, not seeking interaction or romance, not getting enjoyment from too many things, flat emotional expression.

What you have to ask yourself is: Okay, so: Where's my introversion coming from? Do I not know how to interact, so that when I want to, I'm thwarted? Or is it that I simply don't want to, and that my skill level is higher than my actual level of social interaction? If you have strong special interests and get a lot of pleasure from them, that points away from schizoid (but not entirely, if you have the other traits).

Basically, though, schizoid PD is more of an extreme introversion than anything else. As a personality disorder, it's a long-running pattern, not an acute problem; and most people with schizoid PD never get, nor want, treatment. Getting a diagnosis would be a bit superfluous, since what you're already probably learning from whoever manages your AS treatment would be the same thing they teach schizoid types. Autistics are often introverted, and any psychiatrist/psychologist worth his salt will take that into account when teaching you.

The only reason I'd bring it up to a shrink is if I had the classic traits of schizoid PD, none of the "repetitive behavior/odd interests" criteria that distinguish Asperger's, and low social skills only from lack of practice (i.e., if you want to, you can interact; you simply don't want to). In that case, there's a possibility of misdiagnosis.

There are several aspects in which the two categories overlap! Schizoid personality disorder is characterized by “a pervasive pattern of detachment from social relationships and a restricted range of expression of emotions in interpersonal settings” (DSM-IV, p. 638). So some psychiatrists say that lack of empathy, limited social skills and friendships, social aloofness are both characteristics of schizoid personality disorder and AS.

The deficits in social interactions in the Schizoid Personality group are often believed to be less severe than in AS/HFA and they have a higher chance of living an independent life and occupational success than AS. People with schizoid personality disorder are often more socially skilled and independent. Also the social defits in schizoid personality disorder are not apparent until later school years instead of preschool years of AS.

One difference between the schizoid group and AS is the presence of imagination and fantasy within the schizoid group and the concreteness and creativity defits in the AS group. Other difference is the lack of intense special interests as mentioned above.

Yeah some authors claim that schizoid personality disorders should be part of the autistic spectrum as mentioned above.

Apperently, both "Asperger's Syndrome" and "Schizoid Personality Disorder" have their days numbered.

I doubt that, after some years, you can distinguish efectivly between the two: if, at 5, John is extremely introverted and Peter has an innate impairment with social skills, mch probably at 10 (or 20, or 60...) both will have extreme introversion and low social skills

Most people at Wrongplanet.net claim to have imagination and fantasy (there are recurrent threads about that).

And if you take a look at schizoids.net, most of them claim to have been loners since the first day of school.

I wonder if the difference between "age of onset" are not largely the result of social change: the diagnosis of AS become famous at an age (1990s) when the majority of children go to pre-school, kindergarten, etc., while "schizoid" was a concept created in the first decades of last century, where children spend their pre-school years with family and/or playing with 2 or 3 other kids of the neighbourhood; in these times, it was natural that social deficits began later - true social life began later, also.



A possible "problem" is that, if we include SPD in the Autism Spectrum, we could end up with what will be, basically, a "Schizoid Spectrum":

The range of estimates of prevalence for SPD go from 0.5% to 7% of the population, but most estimates are between 1% and 3%; attending that current estimates for ASD are around 1% or slightly below, the "typical" person in these enlarged spectrum will be the current "typical" schizoid.

The Schizoid diagnosis seems to be "out of fashion" at the moment. It filled a in the gap in the diagnostic nomenclature before Asperger's Syndrome was introduced. Due to the significant overlap in features of each, there is debate concerning how to differentiate between them or whether they are distinct conditions. I don't think it's possible to have both, but it is possible to have features of both.

Not sure of the similarities, but I was dx with schizoaffective many years ago along with a whole bunch of other stuff........now it is AS. I was treated with anit-psychotics for years. I had mild hallucinations, a werewolf that scared the crap out of me in the corner of my eye(I thought that I was being punished by the Devil and abandoned by God) and severe paranoia......I also talked to myself a lot and would hear my name constantly when no-one was there. Yep, terrifying time.

Mics

A relative was diagnosed with Schizoid personality disorder last year.

I am expecting a diagnosis of an ASD later this month.

I have come to realize that a major difference between the two of us is that I crave to be understood, and to be set free from my present state. I long to be able to relate to others well and in real and meaningful ways. He however, was not bothered by his "lonliness". In fact, I'm not sure that he experiences "lonliness" in the same way that I do. Whereas an aspie may feel that they are one the "wrong planet", and find this to be bothersome -- even if they view everyone else as having the problem, the Schizoid is not only not bothered by it, but may enjoy this sensation -- it may even be a comfort to him.

Another major difference is that he has absolutely no problems adjusting to significant changes in his life. He can, and has, moved from place to place, changed friends, and careers, without any apparent distress. If anything, he becomes more anxious the more things stay the same. He has absolutely no need for routine. ASDs are characterized by a desire for routines, and extreme resistance to change, so I believe this to be another major difference.

Anyway, that's my personal experience with the differences -- I hope that it helps you in some way.

I do believe that many psycho-professionals (funny huh?) are ill-qualified to differentiate the two. The second major difference can be easily observed -- if the person knows what to look for, but the first major difference may be totally internal and therefore not observable by an outsider.

ookami-ka

Thank you this thread has been an eye opener.

I think it's simply an outdated term. When Schizoid was first written about, the people probably really had AS. I don't really trust phycology anymore since I found out Frued was a pervert but really since pretty much all of my phycologists and phycitrists treated me like a freak and wanted to dope me up on everything under the sun and then commit me because I refused. I bet if lobotomies were still legal, they'd want me to have one of them. I personaly believe that half of the "disorders" in the DSM aren't real or were made up to sell drugs. I personaly belive AD/HD is really simply AS or mild eppilepsy. PDD was invented because parents are scared of the word autism. PMDD actualy was made up in order to sell Yaz to gullible women. I won't be surprized if there is a "condition" for someone who cannot pick their nose with the right hand.