Gender roles you find strange.

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Very true.

It is a matter of preference and that preference is often the result of the culture during the formative years.
I have a preference for women with long hair, probably mainly bc when I was a kid it was fashionable.

You can change your early year's influences, or you can simply be comfortable with them.
Probably best not to mention them in today's climate of people wanting to find things to complain about, just to virtue-signal.

Last edited by Pepe on 19 Feb 2021, 5:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

You are 'normal'.
Most are not.



Preference.

Making a fuss about it is stupid.
Accepting the fact that, if you were courting, you would have a better chance of attracting a mate, is not.

What, how do you think that is at all a widespread opinion.

A lot of an aspect of something like male privilege comes across from how society treats you, so if one otherwise comes across as a cis woman, they are unlikely to just have male privilege.

I don't just lose my male privilege because I realised that I was non-binary. We can get into other topics also like cis privilege, or whether we should call it cis male passing privilege, with perhaps Gender Non-Conforming cis men whether they are always treated the same.

I wouldn't say men are 'fixated' on women's breast, but the 'interest' is there for a reason.
Evolution has made certain aspects of the anatomy 'interesting' to inspire the mating process.
Why is that a problem?

Most men find women 'interesting' to look at.
Most men have simply learnt to pretend it isn't so.

"Bing-drinking" is/has-been a major problem in Australian culture.
I don't drink, btw.

I've had other trans guys argue with me about having male privilege even when I don't pass. People tried to harass me off an app when I was younger for not sharing that opinion, because they thought I was denying my "inherent misogyny as a masculine-indentifying person".

You're definitely right that it's not a widespread opinion at all, but there are fringe groups of people that believe that and try to push that narrative, which is what KT67 is probably talking about. I try to avoid groups of people like that now. They're ignorable if you stay off certain sites/apps.

Perhaps an element of some trans guys desperate to validate their own masculinity by needing to confirm to having traits that are toxic. A lot of that "inherent misogyny" junk is like a part of things like transmedicalism, where a lot of validity is treated like pain or negatives associated with your assigned gender, so a trans man must hate any of their or otherwise elements of femininity as dysphoria, and masculinity for trans women.

Some of that almost makes me miss the sort of research I had access to in High School that put forward the ideas that everyone has mixes of male and femaleness, which kind of made it sound like people can embrace what they want. Although I think steps have been taken anyway in general for more acceptance.

The thing is too, their starting point for masculinity is often times not mine.

Mine is around gentlemen.

Theirs is around rough guys who I have no desire to be like, no desire to be near even.

A Labrador and a German Shepherd are both dogs and equally doglike. But they're hardly the same thing.

Yeah.

I consider it alcoholism.

Everyone else thinks it's normal.

Most of us are Irish diaspora so it's really stereotypical...

I'm trying not to call anyone a drunk/alcoholic so I'm basically pointing out soft drink alternatives.

I think that if I drank I would drink like that. So I don't drink.

When I say I'm teetotal I mean I only drink a glass and at a special occassion.

They taught us in biology that people are turned on by secondary sexual characteristics (those appearing at puberty) so men like boobs and women like beards

I remember my sex ed experience. VHS tapes on an old TV that they'd wheel out on a movable cupboard. Typically recordings from the late 70's to 80's. Bad acting and questionable messages. The tapes were a bit worn out and sometimes they'd have to skip it to the end and rewind it back to the beginning so it would play properly. If they were having trouble with that they'd ask someone for tech support. On the plus side, it usually took a while for them to set up so we could talk amongst ourselves.

Sometimes our teacher would have to pause the recordings and correct a fact that was outdated. I felt bad for our teachers sometimes, because it must get annoying having to keep pausing a tape and make such corrections each time you teach that module. Especially with tapes that barely even worked. It made me wonder why they even bothered with them anymore, but the tapes did give us a good laugh (the acting alone ). Not sure what caused them to be so worn (I guess simply over usage).

My school was a fairly typical underfunded state school. Fairly traditional. We were taught abstinence and a pregnant teenage girl had to leave when were taught about this. If that sentence alone doesn't tell you all you need to know I don't know what will.

When I left that school and went onto an A-level equivalent, the 'British Values' scheme had been rolled out. In that scheme, there was a section on sex ed and I had to awkwardly ask a classmate what the answers were because I didn't have a clue.

This might be an unpopular opinion, but we should stop teaching abstinence. I don't think I learnt much of anything in my high school sex ed other than society looks down on women who sleep around and, according to my educators, gay people should just not have sex. You probably think I'm joking, but no, my school was just rather backwards. This was a fairly memorable part of my life since there was also the debate about whether same sex marriage should be legalised in the UK going on at the time. Whilst I was realising that I'm not straight. It was quite a lot to process. Especially with a dying homophobic relative at the time that I was close to and trying to come to terms with it all.

Never really talked about women liking beards but I figured some of them did based on male deodorant ads. The recordings occasionally mentioned breasts and men often liking them but that was a fairly well-known thing to begin with.

There's no problem with being attracted to breasts! The problem is when the media picks up on it and oversexualises women. (Big boobs are good. MASSIVE boobs aren't.)

I used to find it weird that I did not seem to have the same reaction to only breasts, and had no idea what that meant, like most guys acted like they were more important. Only more recently realised that it was probably because I am bisexual, so I can take them or leave them. I think a lot of confusion is still there.

I am also aware that a lot of media goes the other way in regards to women or AFAB with large breasts, either making it their whole character, or erasing them all together, that women/AFAB with large breasts are either going to have overly sexualised characters or none at all, like they are supposed to be ashamed or something.

I have been mapping out a story idea for a while, with a cast of characters that I want to be varied, inclusive and fair represented, and one character I want to be explicitly large chested. I am still not entirely sure how to write this character to make it sure it is made clear she is a buck against the erasure without making it sound like attention is put on to sexualise her, she is also a halfling(hobbit), so something quick could be put in to mention her the size of a child but decidedly not so in certain places. Whether that is too much or too vague, I am not sure. The other will be to write more of her getting attention she does not want who mention things, but not so much that she should feel ashamed. This up against a trans man half-orc who might punch someone's teeth in for making a comment when they are not covering or binding, and a gender fluid changeling.

Women (not trans guys and certainly not cis guys) with big boobs are sexy to me tbh. I think it's a biological part of being bi.

Talking of the alcohol thing:
My stepdad being 'normal' as a guy for drinking a pint of beer with every meal except breakfast. Middle of the day? Beer. Dinner time? Beer. Watching TV? Beer. Before bed? Whisky.

That can't be a healthy way to encourage guys to be.

For me it looked like:
No shame after uni because I'm afab and under 40. But during uni 'how can you be having fun if you're drinking a J2O, have you tried this alcoholic cocktail everyone's talking about'... I settled on drinking red wine cos it shut up the anti-non drinkers brigade, says 'classy' to me, and it tasted good. Nowadays at the pub I'm inevitably offered Guinness. I'm just there to see the game.

For my mum it's:
Being considered weird cos she doesn't regularly drink red wine on an evening. All her friends her age do. Women between 50 and 65. 'Wine o clock' type language.

For our family in general it's:
My auntie pouring us all champagne every Christmas morning. It's why I was glad not to celebrate Christmas with her this year. Then when you get to the table she asks 'red or white' rather than 'what would you like to drink' - her excuse being that it stops me and the rest of the guys from saying 'beer' which is apparently too tacky for Christmas...

It's weird, it's like wine for a woman is feminine but also feminist - taking time for herself, wine/whisky for a man is classy, beer for a man is normal, not drinking for a woman is seen as no fun/doormat, not drinking for a man is seen as effeminate or infantile.

Bear in mind I am talking about people who are 18 or older. Although underage drinking is seen as a way of being 'grown up', actual adults frown upon it in underage teenagers. Reinforcing why teens think it's cool: a form of rebellion.