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Yes, sort of. A synthesizer can have a keyboard, but some people just buy the "brain" and use a midi controller. The "brain" is known as a "rack" or "desktop" synthesizer, which is a smaller version with just the controls to create different sounds. When you have a large amount of instruments, that is the way to go so you don't waste tons of space.... but not all synths have that option. This is the best way I could explain it to someone that doesn't know what I am talking about. Hope I didn't make things even more confusing.

I have some VST's that I have dabbled with, but something about them seems flat to me. With analog machines, there is a warmness that seems very alive. This is something that is very hard to replicate with VST's, and even digital synths. Not all of my synths are analog, but the ones that are really have a mind of their own.




So glad you are enjoying it. I really appreciate the feedback.

@awes: VSTs are more economical, sure, in general tend to be very static and cold--even the analog modeling ones. Don't get me wrong--I heavily (ab)use Absynth since there's really nothing like it other than maybe Alchemy (which is on my wish list). The nicer analog modelers are pretty good at simulating that "drift" you get with the real thing, but you'll never quite get that raw, in-your-face quality of VCOs and analog Curtis filters.

If you're totally lost on gear-talk, here are some links you might like to peruse:
http://www.vintagesynth.com/
http://www.harmonycentral.com/index.jspa
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/

And, of course, there's Musician'sFriend/GuitarCenter, but I prefer not to get advice from people who want to sell me something. I just go there once I have some ideas and just want to get some pricing.

In case you're wondering, the V-Synth is one of the few current synths that Roland got right. It has a vocal modeler card option and a D50 option, which back in the 80s was Roland's breakout digital 'board in response to the popularity of the Yamaha DX7. The idea was to sample the attack transient of several different sounds and follow that up with essentially wavetable sounds to make up the rest of the timbre. You could get some pretty good realistic sounds, but its real power was in the kinds of unreal sounds it could make. The V-Synth also does subtractive synthesis as well as some other goodies. The only reason I don't have one is it's hella expensive, and I felt my money was better spent in making up for my guitar and bass deficiencies.

Yes, there are some economical options when it comes to sampled sounds and VSTs. The trouble here is that none of those instruments really get you that classic vintage sound, although there are some B3, Rhodes, and Hohner emulators out there that are really good. Now, my own preference is for the more "ravey" sounding boards that used DCOs, which use a digital clock to stabilize the oscillator--the result is still purely analog, but is more "pulsey" than the more natural circuits. I don't think I've ever seen a digital version of the alpha Juno or the Oberheim Matrix 6. You have Propellerheads' Thor (Reason) which matches and exceeds the mod routings of the Oberheim, but nothing quite like the alpha Juno waveforms which are totally bizarre for any synth. I think maybe the point was to get a mega-huge polysynth sound with nothing more than a single DCO and DCO sub-osc. But nothing in proprietary software like it. You might be able to create something like it in Reaktor or Max/MSP. I just think a lot of the time it gets to be more trouble than it's worth such that you don't really mind putting down the money. Another drawback for a lot of people is having to switch through several pages of settings to create the sound they want on softsynths, whereas the older synths make it pretty clear what to do. Part of the appeal of the Synclavier was that it was a digital synth in the analog age, so there is really very little to do from the terminal. For production, you mostly use the buttons on the front panel of the keyboard, while the terminal lets you do more detailed editing and more precise sound design.

Last edited by AngelRho on 30 Dec 2011, 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I like it, too. I think you might be going a little overboard with vocal effects, but otherwise I like what I hear and your voice itself does not offend me. I just feel like I'd like to hear more of it in a not-quite-so-wet mix. It sounds like you have this really nice Madonna thing going--and I was a big fan back in the day. I think you should have more faith in your voice--you have a beautiful one. If it's any comfort, I hate the sound of my own voice, too.

The other thing I think I'd change is your drum track. It's extremely bright for electro percussion, so if you at all can put a lpf on it to cut back on those high overtones--or if nothing else run it through some equalization to cut back on the high end. That will keep your drum machine front-and-center in your mix while not being quite as abrasive.

Thanks for the information. It's a totally different aspect of music than the aspects I've been considering until now, the shaping of sounds as the main interest for composition instead of the harmonical, melodical and rhythmical aspect alone.
I'm questioning myself if those instruments do also have the potential for a little more complex compositions. If there would be a way to use those instruments for something rather classical while it would still sound good. One problem that I think there is is that those synths don't really have a touch like a piano or any other dynamical ways to play a note. Another problem that I think there is is that the sound of the most synths I've heard was rather raw, no matter if saw, square or sinuswaves they sounded all rather raw so they are too dominant to harmonize that well with many other instruments.
So it makes the appearence to me, that those synths could only be used in the arrangements with the usually used instruments.
Though in the samplers I've heard also enough clean sounds which to me sounded like having a much higher quality.
What's the difference between the sound of a modern synth and a "vintage" synth? Does it still sound as raw and dirty or is it smoother and cleaner now?
To me, an analog device would also appear much more desireable, is it possible to create a great variety of smooth and clean sounds through a modern analog device? And if it's analog, is there a way to save a sound, I mean, is there a way to controll an analog device digitally? Or would I have to modify each single switch everytime I want to change the sound, that would be quite unpractical, especially for live performances.

Thanks a lot!

The difference in sound has to do with the way sound is produced. Digital models work by amplifying a PCM or otherwise mathematically producing the harmonics in code which is then converted to an analog signal. Analog synths produce a waveform that cycles dependent upon the amount of voltage, i.e. higher voltage=higher note. On a digital synth, the volume level is limited by the ability of the dac to reproduce all present harmonics without distortion--and digital distortion, since it results from an inability to correctly encode the signal, will about make you go deaf. It's painful. Analog has no such limit, though, and will go as loud as your equipment can handle and even blow your monitors. If the signal exceeds a certain threshold, the worst that will happen is a compressed distortion, same as with an overdrive guitar amp channel. That's where the warm fatness of analog synths come from and why all-analog synths are still so desirable (and expensive). The best thing you can do with a digital synth is add a tube preamp between it and your amp or pa, and some of the nicer new synths out there are already doing this internally.

"Vintage" just means that the synth is representative of the times it was made, like, say, a Hammond B3 as opposed to an XK, which is just a current knockoff (a good one, but still a knockoff). If you want that 80s sound, you need vintage 80s gear. All gear is "vintage" in some sense, and it all comes down to what you're writing for and how you want it to sound. "Vintage" does not mean "better," it's just that some things are going to work better for what you want than other things.

For you, awes, don't get too caught up in vintage gear and all-analog equipment until you've had some time to figure out where you're ultimately going musically. Stick with plugs until you have an actual need for other kinds of stuff. And you'll pick stuff that best suits your purpose.

My graduate experience was strong in composition but weak in synth progging and sound design, which is essential to serious electronic composition. So I took an online course, and Reason was required material. The great thing about Reason is it forces you to concentrate on signal routing and modulation sources as well as various controls. It's very basic, and if you understand how to use Reason, you can program probably just about any synth out there. For you, there might not be anything else that you need.

As far as digitally controlling analog synths, you don't generally want to. I've never done analog pattern sequencing, but it does exist and you can change patterns at the touch of a button. Current analog synths will store settings so that you don't have to reset everything. The only analog synths that are difficult are those massive modulars that require using physical patch cables. In live performance, the basic patching is done ahead of time and changing the settings in real time is part of the performance. Think Radiohead. The performances are never really the same from one performance to the next, but that's just the beauty of it. What sound designers often do is create the sound they want and sample the result to use in production.

The problem of rawness of different analog sources is a lot of times you're hearing an unfiltered signal. Saw, pulse, and triangle waves are used in subtractive synthesis in which harmonics are either boosted or cut to shape the sound. You don't really use sine waves because sines are single frequencies and have no harmonics to filter out. What you can do is use sine waves to emphasize specific harmonics for effect, but sine waves aren't really a feature of analog synths. Some sounds are deliberately gritty sounding, like when using oscillator sync or ring modulation/amplitude modulation. The most annoying sound to my ears is overdone acid lines with extremely high resonance settings on lpfs, That causes the filter to self-oscillate, producing an extremely loud and harsh sine wave that is difficult to control. Good acid house producers make an art form of this.

My specialty is electro-acoustic music, the fusion of computers and/or synths with live performance. For that, you should already have a good background in orchestration so you understand the principles behind balancing different kinds of sounds. If I'm only working with electronics, it's more about collage and exploring variations of timbre.

I'm not a big fan of synth action because I like the resistance of weighted piano action, like I'm more intimately connected to the instrument. The advantage of synth action, though, is that not all sounds "feel" like piano sounds. Like organ sounds, for instance, and any kind of sustained timbre. Leads fall under the fingers better on synth action, and you can do some serious shred on synth action a lot more easily than on piano. If you're in mono mode, you can play twice as fast as normal just by sustaining one note and playing everything else staccato. If you have a good stage piano in your setup and a typical synth action keyboard, you allow yourself a lot of flexibility in your playing. Keep in mind this really more applies to jazz or jazz/rock fusion than any other style, and in just plain rock playing this is also useful. As a composer, you may not even care to go this far. Most composers seem to prefer a good piano-style board to synth action, and the nicer workstation synths ONLY use hammer action.

As for application to "classical" style, check out Walter/Wendy Carlos. You might guess that I find this kind of thing mundane and boring, and you'd be right. But what Carlos did with Switched on Bach was groundbreaking for the time and was done without any kind digital assistance at all, since, after all, it didn't exist at the time.

Thanks for the constructive feedback. Periodically I get carried away with vocal FX because there are so many options. I am also terrible at writing drums and usually try to get that part out of the way as quickly as possible. Occasionally I will go back and change things around, but it is rare. I will get too caught up in the details and completely lose sight of the original course.

Your drum track works, though. You're doing the right thing there--now it's just a matter of taming the high end to fit better in the mix.

I feel your pain, though. Once I get done with a project, I'll say I'll go back and fix things, and then I end up forgetting about it once I've moved on. I have a recent handbell composition that I was really disappointed in how the orchestra performed. I'm probably going to do a good mock-up of just the orchestra parts and make a video of my handbell partner and I performing to a track. Wish I didn't have to, but I was once told to never put anything out there unless you're totally happy with the result. But I worry if I move on to another project starting next week, I'll forget about it and never come back to it. My mentor always had a "when you're done, you're done" attitude about that sort of thing.

I meant what I said...you have a lovely voice. I think your effects would have been spot-on if you were going more for a Mazzy Star kind of thing, and I LOVE Mazzy. Or if you're into shoegaze. Please post more of your vocal work!! ! Maybe we could collab on something. I could stand to get out of my experimental phase just a little and try something closer to mainstream.

I think I need to take the advice of your mentor. When you are done, you really are done! It gets too complicated otherwise. I don't listen to much shoegaze, but I am familiar with the genre.

Below I linked another track with vocals. It really is a work in progress and needs proper mixing, among other things. It is actually a little story about shopping at a thrift store mall named "Flamingo Plaza" in Miami. I would be interested in collaborating, providing none of our possible quirks got in the way of working cohesively... which has usually been my problem with collaborations in the past.

http://nouveauplastique.com/ModeleMecha ... emo%29.mp3

Some more of my violin stylings.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Sl0tff9Qy8[/youtube]

NICE! I love it.

Der Freischutz as far as I'm concerned is one of the two greatest operas ever written. The other is La Bohéme. And neither is greater than the other.

Von Weber is by far my favorite Romantic composer. I like Wagner, but compared to Weber I think Wagner is just extra noise. Thanks for interpreting some great music.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6KU9YH09uk&feature=youtube_gdata[/youtube]
My new composition, translated it means heart attack. It is about the strange excitement and the masochistical bloodlust that I sometimes feel while in a psychotic wave feeling the drive to stab a knife into my heart to reach some kind of whole body orgasm. It has been there since I had some kind of side effect because of my medicine against my psychosis which was some kind of heart attack where I nearly died. sounds weird, doesn't it?^^
Now I do play already more than 4 months but there are still many mistakes in this video since I've written it yesterday and couldn't practise very much.

here is a piece that I've already posted but the quality is better in this one since I recorded directly with cubase and a chinch cable instead of my ipod camera^^
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfxh3HVGhbg[/youtube]

Beautiful...

I was just going to post something I've made but I'm afraid they will look pretty pale in comparison to other peoples songs here.
I only just started making music and I don't really know what I'm doing yet!

Or maybe I should stop being such a coward...

here it is (it has no name yet):

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MSbF151H2g[/youtube]

Thank you very much.
The benefit of such a community is that nobody knows you, and much more, you don't want to sell anything but only want to receive feedback so it doesn't really matter how good it is. Nobody would be angry with you, in the worst case somebody would be very honesty but that's at the same time the best case because only this way you are able to improve yourself. But if you are really at the beginning there would probably be too much things to say. As long as you don't want to show of with it it won't be embarassing.

Your composition seems to be lovely. But with those midi instruments the message isn't that clear. I don't know if it's only the instruments but it somehow sounds very much like old video game music. It's ok to write music this way but in the course of your development you should have an idea of where it should lead to. In fact this song would be useful for a video game but there would hardly be any other use for it, you could certainly make a new arrangement by just keeping the harmonic structure and the melody but using different instruments and a more dynamical rhythm. If you want to express the feeling of a storm I would use legato played strings or pipes and flutes and a drum with a pushing rhythm, for example a march rhythm. But the harmonic idea/character of it is fine. If you need better instruments download those two free vst plugins (can probably be used with the software you used to for your recording, otherwise download the free trial of the program "reaper", you can use it even if the trial period is over, there is no real limit)
Komplete
Kontakt
there are many hundred instruments available and they have a good quality, just play around with it a little bit and it would improve your working a lot.

yeah you are right. I wouldn't dare to post this in a music community though!

I am pretty proud of it but I am painfully aware of that I don't know what I'm doing.
I cant play any musical instruments and I only recently learned what a chord was...

the only feedback I have got so far is from my dad who said it was boring (but then he has never been very supportive of anything I do) and my bf who likes it but wants me to use more advanced sounds..

Thanks for the feedback. I really apreciate it..
Yeah I heard complaints about the choice of instruments before. Maybe the problem is that I actually like old video game music

I am trying to learn Reason so that I can play around with the instruments and sounds more.

here is another song with hopefully better sounds:
(the name storm is more aimed at the video. Nothing to do with the songs):

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMlrlXHXJ6o[/youtube]