Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

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If it is purely an external thing, an internal thing or both depends on how you define the word. In it's most narrow meaning beauty refers to looks. If you use it to refer to if someone is a pleasant or nice person instead, then your use of beauty does not refer to looks and other people will be beautiful by your definition of the word.
This is really just arguing about what the word 'beautiful' is supposed or allowed to mean. If someone uses 'beautiful' in a narrow meaning that only refers to looks, it doesn't necessarily mean it's the only thing this person can value in another human being. It may just mean that they think a word to describe how appealing someones physical appearance is to them, is not an useless concept to have in a language and that they prefer words to have exact meanings.


In a narrow meaning, no I've never seen a person with a beautiful mind. Minds do not have a physical appearance. I've seen nice, intelligent, caring, imaginative etc. people though. If I use beautiful to refer to anything positive, then sure I've seen plenty of people with beautiful minds.

What about women like me who wear makeup not out of insecurities but because it's fun and a form of self expression?

In my case, makeup and trying different brands, products and colors is one of my various hobbies.

Agreed!! ! I can spend HOURS searching makeup and comparing different colours and textures ..

layer it all on my hand or arm to see the effects.

I just did this about an hour ago ... did not buy it but just interested to see the products that are out Now.

I was like this since I was v young (6) and did not actually wear makeup.

Makeup for me is like playing video games. I don't play video games to impress others just like I don't wear makeup to impress others.

Makeup gives me just as much excitement as reading the sequels to my favorite book series.

Makeup generally isn't my thing. I'm allergic to most of it and I would rather spend my money and those minutes of my life doing other things.

However the practice of wearing makeup goes back to antiquity and likely to the very dawn of humanity.

The person I find by far the most beautiful person in the world
is not a standard beauty.

That is the magic of love

Beauty is quite objective. Most people agree which people look good and which people are ugly; therefore is not something that is arbitrary.

Taste is subjective. For example I like big hook noses in women but I know that they are way less aesthetic than small flat noses. I acknowledge that and I don't go out there saying that big hooked noses are beautiful (in women, in men is different) because I know perfectly that's not the case.

Well said. I think that summarises it well.

^ Then Beauty is not the eye of the beholder.

/thread.

Well again, 'hot' is subjective. I think most people can instinctively tell whether someone is conventionally attractive, though that doesn't mean they find that person attractive.

Perhaps we should say attraction is in the eye of the beholder instead. I often see men who are considered good looking and I can identify them as such but they are very rarely those that I find most attractive. I know other women vary as well because while we seem to have an agreement (mostly) on who is good looking, when we pick which (unknown) men we personally find most attractive the choices are really varied with some women picking men others think are really ugly. I find quite a few famous actors ugly.

True

Even if they were ugly though, being a famous actor would give them an edge.

Same!! ! I am so overexcited when I look at makeup or talk about it. I like to just keep some in my purse to look at when I’m stressed. People think it’s funny but it’s the same as pulling out an awesome book in the doctor’s office. It makes me soooooooo happy!!

Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.

i think people that are pretty on the inside (aka nice personality, smart and what not) come across to me as extra beautiful as I get to know them better! plus I'm bored of the "handsome bad boy" type and thinking fellow nerds make much better companions.

'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' does NOT mean:

Perceived beauty is distributed evenly among humans. At any given moment, as many people find Helen beautiful as find Penny beautiful, and so on through the entire population.

What it CAN mean, is:

Just because most people seem to agree that Helen is beautiful, doesn't mean that everybody does, or that they find her beautiful for the same reasons. And vice versa, just because most people seem to agree that Penny is not beautiful, doesn't mean that everybody does.

And it's not just about women. It can be used for cars, paintings, flowers, poetry, whatever. Beauty is subjective. Subjectivity doesn't mean "even spread", it means it's an opinion, and not definitive. And an opinion can be shared among a HUGE number of people, even ALL people, and it's still an opinion.

Height is objective. Someone who is 5'10 cannot be 5'8 just because someone thinks they are.
Hair colour is objective. Though because humans do not perceive in the same way as each other, someone may actually see a different colour to someone else. That in turn may influence the perceived beauty of the person with the hair! You wouldn't say "well her hair colour is ACTUALLY shade #345 of blonde, so she is ACTUALLY beautiful, no matter what you think".

And sure, evolution of humans would have been influenced by trends in perceived beauty. That's the numbers game - those who are considered attractive by the most humans of the opposite sex are more likely to procreate, and make attractive babies who will in turn have a higher chance of procreating, or some crap like that. None of this changes the fact that it's still an opinion, and that beauty isn't an objective trait.

If beauty was objective, there would be no point in ever arguing over it. You could just look up the beauty rating manual and see if a particular woman fit the criteria for beauty. Nobody could disagree, because that would involve discussing personal feelings, and that's subjectivity.