Stereotypes in L&D forum.

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Do you believe it is generally true that (a) AS guys have it harder than AS girls. (b) NT girls discriminate against AS guys. (c) an AS/AS relationship is better than an AS/NT relationship.

I believe (a), (b), and (c).	0%	[ 0 ]
I believe (a) and (b).	15%	[ 9 ]
I believe (a) and (c).	3%	[ 2 ]
I believe (b) and (c).	10%	[ 6 ]
I believe (a).	5%	[ 3 ]
I believe (b).	10%	[ 6 ]
I believe (c).	8%	[ 5 ]
I disagree.	37%	[ 23 ]
I am undecided.	13%	[ 8 ]

Total votes : 62

Bethie
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18 Apr 2011, 9:27 pm

People who'd prefer to think all the fatties are just lazy have got to be related to members of the Flat Earth Society-
the difference being the former involves not only a gross ignorance of facts, but a gross moral judgment against people based on that ignorance.

:roll:

Of course most people lose weight on calorie/fat/carb restrictive programs. And then they gain it right back when they start eating normal meals. Statistically, it is an EXTREMELY small percentage of people who lose weight and keep it off, likely because a great many if not most are not overweight or obese because they eat Twinkies on the couch all day. Such is why doctors don't recommend diets, only a healthy lifestyle. If you're overweight or obese living a healthy lifestyle, with no causative physiological factor, you're not meant to be thin.

I've yet to see anyone opining about obesity being a moral failing who is not completely ignorant of food deserts, of corn sugar meat and dairy subsidies which make fattening foods more affordable than healthy ones, underlying medical conditions (look up Lipedema and then keep proclaiming all people can lose weight) and medication side effects.

Most of them have no clue what it's like to eat a quarter of the calories that might be average, exercise twice as much, and remain obese for decades even if there ISN'T a medical problem. It never occurs to them that certain people are simply not meant genetically to be thin, probably because they're likewise ignorant of why the BMI, the tool most commonly used to determine overweight and obesity, was actually DEVELOPED.

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Last edited by Bethie on 18 Apr 2011, 9:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.

hale_bopp
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18 Apr 2011, 9:29 pm

Bethie wrote:

People who'd prefer to think all the fatties are just lazy is have got to be related to members of the Flat Earth Society-
the difference being the former involves not only a gross ignorance of facts, but a gross moral judgment against people based on that ignorance.

:roll:

Of course most people lose weight on calorie-restrictive programs. And then they gain it right back when they start eating like a normal person. Statistically, it is an EXTREMELY small percentage of people who lose weight and keep it off, likely because a great many if not most are not overweight or obese because they eat Twinkies on the couch all day.

I've yet to see anyone opining about obesity being a moral failing who is not completely ignorant of food deserts, of corn sugar meat and dairy subsidies which make fattening foods more affordable than healthy ones, underlying medical conditions (look up Lipedema and then keep proclaiming all people can lose weight) and medication side effects.

Most of them have no clue what it's like to eat a quarter of the calories that might be average, exercise twice as much, and remain obese for decades even if there ISN'T a medical problem. It never occurs to them that certain people are simply not meant genetically to be thin, probably because they're likewise ignorant of why the BMI, the tool most commonly used to determine overweight and obesity, was actually DEVELOPED.

lol I'm going to use "member of the flat earth society" for posts that are narrow minded from now one

hyperlexian
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18 Apr 2011, 9:30 pm

Grisha wrote:

Quote:

The bottom line is that almost every overweight person can lose weight if they want to.

I refuse to get caught up in this recurring argument, but every overweight/obese person should know that there is hope.

*cough* hope would mean there is something inherently wrong with being overweight or obese, and really there isn't, necessarily. i prefer to direct my "hope" towards a cure for cancer or the like.

both thinness and obesity are reversible, it's true. but it needn't necessarily be something to "hope" for.

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18 Apr 2011, 9:38 pm

Bethie wrote:

Most of them have no clue what it's like to eat a quarter of the calories that might be average, exercise twice as much, and remain obese for decades even if there ISN'T a medical problem. It never occurs to them that certain people are simply not meant genetically to be thin, probably because they're likewise ignorant of why the BMI, the tool most commonly used to determine overweight and obesity, was actually DEVELOPED.

i started climbing stairs as an exercise of choice (in the effort to be healthier), and i noticed my clothing was looser. so i measured and saw that i lost an inch and a half off my waist and 2 inches off my hips in about 45 days. BUT the scale did not budge, nor did my BMI change. BMI calculations fail unless you are perfectly average in every way (i.e. not muscular, not dense in bone structure, etc).

Bethie
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18 Apr 2011, 9:38 pm

aussiebloke wrote:

Agreed its just an excuse for fat and lazy people to keep eating processed junk.

Go to your Indian grocer and you can pick up a kilo of lentils for A $ 3 (even less in bulk)

If your to lazy to cook a can of pulses is like 80 cents , I'm not aware of any chocolate bars or crisps that sell below this price point.

I can guarantee you that the vast majority of people both in the impoverished Southern Baptist town where I grew up,
and in the impoverished area of the city I live in have never even heard of an Indian grocer, or pulses, or lentils, because they simply do not exist, for hundreds of miles in the former case.

Unless you're totally ignorant of the socioeconomic and food availability factors involved in America's obesity trend,
grossly stereotyping obese people as "lazy" deniers is nothing less than elitist classism.

Last edited by Bethie on 18 Apr 2011, 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Bethie
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18 Apr 2011, 9:42 pm

hyperlexian wrote:

Grisha wrote:

Quote:

The bottom line is that almost every overweight person can lose weight if they want to.

I refuse to get caught up in this recurring argument, but every overweight/obese person should know that there is hope.

Underneath all the nasty (and inaccurate judgments) there seems to be this underlying mindset obese and overweight people are somehow "wrong", simply by virtue of how much space they take up, that their simply existing is offensive, and they're "subjecting" people to the unsightliness of their person. It's quite...disturbing, even frightening that people think like this.

hyperlexian
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18 Apr 2011, 9:44 pm

Bethie wrote:

aussiebloke wrote:

I can guarantee you that the vast majority of people both in the impoverished Southern Baptist town where I grew up,
and in the impoverished area of the city I live in have never even heard of an Indian grocer, or pulses, or lentils.

Unless you're totally ignorant of the socioeconomic and food availability factors involved in America's obesity trend,
grossly stereotyping obese people as "lazy" deniers is nothing less than elitist classism.

most families with two incomes also are extremely busy. who has time to cook up complicated dishes? it's not like you can open a bag of lentils and snack on them like potato chips. better options in the grocery store could lead to healthier choices.

Bethie
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18 Apr 2011, 9:46 pm

hyperlexian wrote:

True. The more expensive foods are also more work to prepare-
at my grocery, you can get a monster bag of Cheetos for less money than a single bell pepper.

Bethie
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18 Apr 2011, 9:48 pm

Grisha wrote:

Quote:

The bottom line is that almost every overweight person can lose weight if they want to.

I refuse to get caught up in this recurring argument, but every overweight/obese person should know that there is hope.

Not all people can afford liposuction, least of all the people who are statistically far more likely to be overweight or obese in the first place.

That is, of course, the only route left for people who live healthy lifestyles and are still overweight or obese, except prescription weight loss pills which (as I can testify) don't work on everyone.

Another_Alien wrote:

Therefore, if they can lose weight then it is THEIR fault that they're overweight.

Nope. Losing weight is not synonymous with not being overweight or obese. I've gained and lost 50 lbs all while being obese.
and more importantly, in those individuals who CAN lose weight through calorie/fat/carb restriction, many of them gain it back when they start eating the minimum-recommended amounts of these, much like what they were doing before- hardly a situation where the word "fault" is appropriate. Do you know how many people damage their internal organs on starvation diets in their desperation to lose more weight than is healthy for them as individuals?

I really can't get over how much hostility there is toward fat people on this thread- from making wild laughably false nasty stereotypes about their character and lifestyle, to the insistence that fat people should "take responsibility" and somehow "admit" that strangers know more about their lives than they do, and the implication that fat people's lives are ANY OF YOUR BUSINESS, moreso than a thin person's would be. I shudder (in laughter!) to think about the cognitive dissonance their feeble minds would be thrown into if a fat-positive person told them they feel better and look better when they're overweight.

Another_Alien
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19 Apr 2011, 3:14 am

Bethie wrote:

Grisha wrote:

Quote:

The bottom line is that almost every overweight person can lose weight if they want to.

I refuse to get caught up in this recurring argument, but every overweight/obese person should know that there is hope.

Another_Alien wrote:

Therefore, if they can lose weight then it is THEIR fault that they're overweight.

There is no hostility. You've selectively quoted me above, but even then I've pointed out that it's only their responsibility if they CAN lose it. I've acknowledged elsewhere in the thread that some people can't, and there is a genetic factor. People shouldn't be hated for being overweight, but it's irresponsible not to ignore that there's an obesity epidemic in Western society which damages individual health and stretches national resources. And it's silly not to acknowledge a correlation between this epidemic and the introduction of fast food to the Western diet during that period combined with a more sedentary lifestyle. If the average American eat the way their (poor) grandparents did, and if American kids burnt off as many calories as they should this epidemic wouldn't exist. There would still be some obese people - as there were 50 years ago - who wouldn't be able to lose it, but not that many.

Your individual life isn't any of my business - and I've never claimed it was. But I don't think people should be banned from discussing - in general terms - what has become a major issue of our times. Saying 'mind your own business' on this issue is a bit like saying don't discuss war unless you're a soldier or a casualty. I don't have a problem with a group of NTs discussing the 'Autism epidemic', for example.

Bethie
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19 Apr 2011, 4:42 am

Another_Alien wrote:

~nod, nod~

I can agree with all this.

chinatown
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19 Apr 2011, 5:06 am

Another_Alien wrote:

Saying 'mind your own business' on this issue is a bit like saying don't discuss war unless you're a soldier or a casualty. I don't have a problem with a group of NTs discussing the 'Autism epidemic', for example.

But if you bring up Iraq and the alleged American tyranny in every thread, sooner or later people are going to say that not everything is always about Iraq. And even if the thread is somehow related, people won't always agree with you about the details.

Or if a group of NT's discuss their stereotypes about autistics (like all are nonverbal or have a low IQ), someone is likely to correct them.

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19 Apr 2011, 9:23 am

chinatown wrote:

Another_Alien wrote:

Which is what I was doing with my medical articles, correcting stereotypes. I would have done the same thing had some NT posted erroneous information about people with autism. People discriminate, but the data do not.

~Kate

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aussiebloke
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19 Apr 2011, 6:31 pm

Bethie wrote:

aussiebloke wrote:

Well I'm hardly "elitist," quite the opposite , extremely uneducated and I grew up as trailer trash in the far out rural areas you described I managed to find a "Indian grocer" even though it was many many miles away, why can't they ?

In some instances (rarely) I agree with the right this is such an instance "individual responsibility"

And middle America on the rings of major cities why do they eat so unhealthy surely at the local hypermarket they have access to "lentils" no that's right their "to busy" servicing their Mcmansion and SUV's that can climb Artic tundra that seats 12 (it makes them feel better ) all on a lower middle income wage

, these people do not have my sympathies..

PS I am ignorant.

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Meow101
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19 Apr 2011, 7:23 pm

aussiebloke wrote:

, these people do not have my sympathies..

PS I am ignorant.

Gee, stereotype much?

~Kate

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aussiebloke
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19 Apr 2011, 7:34 pm

^^^^

Perhaps :oops: Have you been on a right wing blog :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

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