Men's thread:when she never initiates communication

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Some women make it so obvious.

I don't see the point of the thread - if either party doesn't initiate, then it means the one not initiating isn't as interested. That goes for any relationship - friendship, relationship or even family.

Very true but some people (especially women) insist that the non-initiation from the women isn't necessarily non-interest because they believe that society conditioned them to not initiate; and many men buy into this.

I am telling the men to wake up and not to listen to those denying voices, this idea is false.

I think men have their little texting "rules" too and I don't know who the heck came up with them. Like the one that if you text too soon then the person will think you are too interested. Let me tell you, when I get a text, I text back when I get it and the same with an email. If it looks like I text back too fast and they think that I'm too interested and "desperate", then that is their loss because I don't follow those "rules" of texting.

I do have a problem initiating conversations, it's mainly down to me being absorbed in doing something else, hours pass and then my boyfriend gets impatient and messages me and then I hear "well I ALWAYS message you first". Then I feel tempted to print out months of conversations with me sending messages first highlighted so I can prove it's not 'always'. I'm in love with the guy, but I really find this intense communication and expectation frustrating, to the point that I want to just have a shut-down in silence for a day, but that would be like a nightmare to him (I don't really understand why???). Most women, I agree, are very different to me in this matter.
Tricky stuff, maybe I'm not made for relationships

Ironically, the key here to understanding one another in this communication thread, is communication.

Even in N.T. relationships, it is very obvious that each person has their own individual needs in all areas, from amount of affection/sex/face-to-face/texting communication.

It can probably be said that many Aspie men and women seem less engaged in texting so these needs have to be communicated to one's partner so they understand.

I could go nearly 2 weeks without messaging my best friend and we both don't really mind, he's an Aspie too but after about a week and a half one of us will send a message and also likely say "Hey it's been a while [since we last spoke] what are you up to?"

I also have two other friends I haven't really messaged at all in about 4 months, but it seems no matter how long I go without messaging them they act like no time has passed when I message them again. I knew them before I had to move far away and we decided to keep in touch online though hopefully I'm moving back to my old city again and I'll be able to reignite our old friendship.

FACE OF BOO:

There was actually a girl who I had a crush on, and she liked me back, in high school.

We would talk in class and I would hang out with her at lunch playing handball and joking around with her sometimes.

She told me months later when we only became friends that she was shy with crushes despite being normally confident, and she could barely even talk to me in class without getting nervous.

I was so close to asking her out before she moved away.

Anyway, I added her on Facebook but she never actually initiated. We didn't talk much though. She told me she dislikes texting, prefers face-to-face, and finds texting 'awkward' and she becomes awkward.

So I decided to just chat to her at school and she was very receptive and still interested in me.

Yes she was actually N.T.

^^ It's just all talk, she didn't like you enough.

Problem is, if a critical mass of men take it to mean that women aren't initiating because they're not interested, then men AND women both lose across the board.

Yes, men can and do drop out of the dating scene, and this is one of the reasons why.

I think that regardless of what many of us say, inwardly we're all intelligent enough to realize that the roles of male as pursuer and female as pursued is decades out of date and shoud be relegated to history.

Nope, au contraire! If a critical mass of men achieve this then this would oblige many women to change their "non-initiating" approach and will have to initiate. It will cause a massive change in the behaviors.

That would be fascinating!! For the men of course, not so for the women.

I mean, imagine a woman logging in her okcupid and finds a zero new message! She might be relieved in the first day (something different for a change! No message at all= No creepy messages at all)......but if the same happens to her to day 2, day 3....nth day , and keeps waiting; I am 100% she would start messaging guys frequently.

That would be wonderful...for the men.

Hey, you can test that yourself, I have once logged as a straight female in a dating app that uses text/voice message, and yet I have noticed something very noticeable: There are a lot of lesbians who are desperate for attention and chasing the fake me.

The ways those lesbians interacted with me is very similar to the way so many men interact with women in these apps, they give up their phone nb fast after 2nd and 3rd message, sending tons of voice messages, sending their Facebook link, they move very fast despite that my fake profile clearly stated that I am a straight woman yet still hoping if "I" am a bi-curious/closet lesbian woman....etc and jeez...they keep insisting even if you tell them not interested, and yes judging on their voices, they are women, not men in disguise.

Why is that? Because they have to initiate, they are much fewer in numbers, in real life it may harder for them to seek for dates depending where they live, they don't receive many messages from their favored sex like the straight women do, so they have to be more proactive and throw a wider net, so they end up initiating like the straight men. So you see, it's not really a matter of biology only, but it's logic, when you receive too much attention you wouldn't have to move to seek for it.

Also Outrider, there's something what I call "opportunistic initiation", which is very for a shy woman to do it, *if* she is really interested.

Let's say for example, and this one is very typical, you forward a joke or some funny story to some of your contacts on fb or whatsapp or whatever, either to a whole virtual group or to a selective contacts, a non-interested woman would be like "haha" or lol...and that's it, but a really interested woman would go further ie. she may comment on it and ask you questions (whether something related to the joke or not, doesn't matter).

There are few girls who always did that with me, every time I send a joke, or even when I share a joke, they IM me telling me how they find it funny or how much they relate to it and start asking me how I am doing.....these girls always turned out to be interested. And YES , they are shy in life, and YES they are traditional.

One thing you need to learn, young fella, you cannot indefinitely justify a girl's lack of communication/initiation whom you think she is interested by shyness.
"Oh...she might be too shy, that's why she never texted me even after 20 dates over 2 months"
"Oh...she might be too shy, that's why she never say hi at school to me even tho I saluted her millions of times".

BS....you should not buy it. This is just a wishful thinking being extended for too long, yet the reality is otherwise.

^^just sad to realize how lonely you can get is all. Fun to fantasize at least. This married woman in her 40s who sent me some nudes seems to have all but disappeared...always initiated conversation, I guess it's my lack of interest in married women that kills any relationship lol

Actually, she said hi in person to me all the time in school first. It was actually about 50/50.

In fact she was the one who 'made the first move', not asking me out but by approaching me to spend time with me - she wanted to walk with class with me.

She was very receptive to what I said and if I attempted to start a conversation in class, she would have lengthy conversations with me, it's just she was too shy to initiate.

Otherwise, don't dare put me into that stupid lapdog category, because I already agree with you in the first place.

I'm just pointing out there are exceptions, like all these aspie women here who say they never text first.

I agree it's dumb that so many women don't, if they're interested than they should.

She even did have a bit of text conversation with me but admitted she was awkward with online communication and even that we are friends now still feels this way.

Did you ever stop to think maybe she didn't want to come across as awkward or embarrass herself to her crush if she really is awkward in text?

Yes it would be, from a male POV... but TBH I think it's wishful thinking, because it would require chucking thousands of years of tradition into the crapper, and women are not as pragmatic as men about these things.

It did happen at least once, though... after WW2, there was an acute shortage of men in the Soviet Union because so many of them were killed in the war, either fighting the Germans or in Stalin's purges. Approximately 80% of the males born in the Soviet Union in 1923 died during the war years. The survivors pretty much got to have their pick of the women for a couple of years afterward, which stood Briffault's law on its head. Somehow I doubt fate would ever let that happen again.

Also, pick-up artists don't like it when women make the first move. It intimidates them and messes up their game.