All women are demons from Hell that like to mess with men.

Post Reply New Topic

double postie

Last edited by sinsboldly on 08 May 2008, 1:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

I apologize Merle.
I was being sarcastic cuz I thought you were being sarcastic too.Lets kill this thread as it seems to be causing incresingly dire misunderstandings.

Let me clarify a few things:
1. I am not single;
2. Merle while I appreciate your great, thoughtful comments and your efforts to maintain decency on this forum, I just want to say that really there wasn't a shred of "dating" interest in my conversations with D1nk0. Not because D1nk0 isn't a good, interesting guy, he might as well be (I don't know any of you, do I?) but because:
a) not for 1 second have I seen WP as a dating site; just as you don't go on a political forum to "hook up." Not in my view. Unless it's a separate thread or something and people are looking for that. We were clearly debating an issue and the conversation became a little tense.
b) of the reason mentioned at number 1 (I am not looking for anyone, I am content with my situation right now).

D1nko, no need to kill the thread completely. It brought to light a lot of "true" feelings and stereotypes that people believe and that they have kept inside (creating a built-up of resentments). Now they've come to light. And that MAYBE gives others the possibility to engage them in discussion and possibly show that life is not that bad, women are not that bad, men are not that bad. Unless there's talk...we're all going to remain stuck with our personal opinions and we'll never learn there are other views that we should at least...hear. I am ok with hearing opposite views from mine. What I meant earlier about how much damage this thread (and its awful title) has created..I was refering more to the hateful, resentful tone of it all rather than the content.

NLG,
Thank you for your kind words. I apologize that my words were misconstrued for suggesting either you or D1nk0 were in 'dating' mode.

My point was that people HAVE and employ a 'dating' mode, instead of open honest conversation, that it can lead to miscommunication when neither party are being 'themselves' but are in 'dating mode'.
This leads to the idea that either side is 'playing games' because neither side is being honest in how they are presenting themselves.

again, sorry for any miscommunication, see? you don't even have to BE in 'dating' mode to screw up!

Merle

Incorrect, if you study the social attitudes of pre-Islamic Arabia, you will understand that Islam liberated women. The reason why Muslim women are covered from head to toe, is quite simple really, to protect her modesty and so that men can treat her for who she is, a human being, and not an object. As for the multiple wives concept, Islam limited polygamy, the pagan Arabs had multiple wives and used to kill firstborn female babies, leading to an unbalanced sex ratio. Islam changed this, and plus, Muslim men who choose to have more than one wife must treat their wives with equal respect. Each wife must have a separate house, equal number of servants, equal number of gifts, etc. As women aren't allowed to have more than one husband, they do have the right to declare their marriage null and void, while the husband must choose divorce. Although divorce is permitted, it "shakes the throne of Allah", while making the marriage null and void does not do so. The Quran states that men and women are equal, but have different duties. A woman is allowed to work, but must only do so if her husband is incapable. It's her duty to raise her children well, while it's her husbands duty to provide his wife and children a good lifestyle. Women were treated almost like slaves in pre-Islamic Arabia. Most of you westerners imagine that women are oppressed in the middle east, which is completely untrue, they are over-protected. Too over-protected IMO.

Regarding adultery, stoning to death goes against Islam. It's a western misconception that was created after a Nigerian woman was stoned to death for having an illegitimate child, this was actually an ancient African practice that Muslims in the north of Nigeria adopted. This is the actual punishment for adultery:



Pardon me for defending my faith.

Why isn't the modesty of Muslim men protected too, with a head to toe vail? The same argument can be made that they need the head to toe veil, so that women would treat them for who they are, human beings, not objects (beautiful bodies/faces). Judgement would not be passed based on how the man LOOKS but solely on how he thinks, talks and acts (kind of what happens virtually too).

The thing is NLG, women certainly Do judge men objectively but more often than not they tend to judge men on things Other than their (pure)physical appearance. Ive noticed that for a man to be good looking is just NOT ENOUGH for him to 'get the girls'. He has to show signs of status and wealth for women to really want him. Ugly guys(who arent fat mind you )with finely honed social skils actualy CAN get very pretty girls. However, I personally would not object in the LEAST if Both sexes had to be covered head to toe except for their faces . Why do western women feel so outraged that there are culture which do not allow women to show off their bodies??

I wasn't trying to offend your faith as I said it was going to sound as narrow minded as the topic itself about women. I don't know much about Islam except from documentaries and books. I just asked why Islam when Averick suggested jokingly how women would take over by including Islam and Paganism. Islam is obviously a male dominated religion just as Christianity and Judeoism.

As for women covering themselves, I don't think I mentioned anything about that. I really don't care if they do or don't. To me personally, I think it would still attract attention anyway since a guy "can't control his sexual urge" (Yeah right.) and knows there's a woman covered up in that burka.

I think NLG was right about how damaging this topic is. It brings out other issues. To me this title represents a double standard to everything. You hear crap all the time about how all women are this and women are that which to me is hypocritical to everything else. People can dish it out but can't take it when it involves something of themselves personally.

Exactly. Something my sister will never understand. She's completely western minded, and I can't do anything to change her mind. Sadly, I've given up trying to tell her what kind of monsters men can be at times.

Men, in Islam, are supposed to cover themselves minimally from the knees to the waist (fardh - compulsory). However, it is sunnat (pious) to cover the whole body, to grow a beard, and wear something to cover the head, such as a cap. For women, covering their whole body including the hair is fardh. The main purpose of these divine instructions is so that we may learn to judge others for who they are, and not their appearance, in every aspect, from business to relationships.



I understood you weren't trying to offend anyone, I'm just trying to clear the misconception that you have. Most non-Muslims (all over the world) have this misconception that Islam promotes oppression of women, promotes murder (terrorism), promotes suicide (terrorism), promotes war, etc. In fact, Islam is completely against any of these. Another misconception is that we're moon worshipers, lol, the silliest misconception of all. I've even come across articles linking Islam to the worship of the Goddess Cybele of Phyrgia.



I mentioned the hijab/burqa as most people target Islamic modesty. Personally, as a male, I don't get aroused when I'm with women who wear the hijab. I can converse with them without a problem. It's like the whole social barrier is absent with them. Most importantly, I end up having a lot of respect for them.

Sadly, the only women who wear the hijab in my family are the old women, such as my grandmother.

Good, glad we got that covered.

Hmmm.....Goddess Cybele of Phyrgia.

Guess I'll have to look that one up.

Perhaps Jesus believed that he was an earthly reincarnation of the egyptian god Wasir(Osiris)
AFAIK the cult of Cybele Never made it to the Arabian pennisula. Before Muhammads conquest of Mecca, the city was the center of the cult of Al-Uzzah(the moon God).

How did we get to ten pages on this subject?

If I posted a thread entitled, "Babies are Satan's pudding and quite good on toast!! !" would we get to ten pages of discussion?

-Frank

Perhaps what I was getting at in my post is that women have had control the whole time, making men think they've had the control. ~ Sweet lemons, sour grapes.

And no, Slowmutant, I'm nowhere near being a woman or like one. In fact women would be intimidated with my perspective had I the strength to state it.

The English Philosopher Samuel Johnson once said: "Nature has give women so much power that the law has wisely given them very little".

I couldnt agree more

This made me snort into my coffee, having been in non Muslim polygamist situations I have found that the first wife is always the invisible head of the home.

Merle

Its so curious how polygyny is fairly common among many non-western cultures of africa, south asia, and the pacific but polyandry is Extremely rare. The ONLY documented occurance of polyandry is in Tibet and a certain tribe in Papua New
Guinea.