Why's she dating HIM?

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It's just been so hard the past few years. Trying so hard, so many times, and always rejected. One girl even rejected me for a guy who was already married! Unfair! I get scared that I try and try and can't seem to make any headway. And when I do get that chance, someone else comes in and gets her with no work at all, just out of luck. He could have anyone, I'm sure, since he's much better looking than me. Why her? I could make someone happy. I've got a lot to give someone. I don't like being alone. I need someone. I can't help but despair that I'm too odd, ugly, that there is something fundamentally wrong with me that no one wants anything to do with me. This latest incident just reinforces that. A friend of many years, whom I got so close to, and in no time at all she can just latch onto the new, better model. It just makes me feel so inconsequential, and worthless. And really, what woman would want a worthless, ugly, low paid failure like me. I spend two years and all my money on a documentary that not even my home town's film fest will screen. Loser!

^So you know the answer of your own question. Evolution!

Now stop crying , move on and seek another. Don't build hopes about her.

Now hang on a second...

While I agree that hating on the guy will get you nowhere, you can't just say "well go for the next girl"... for some people (such as the OP in this case), it can take years for love to develop, so I can understand his frustration of being effectively sniped (in the eBay usage of the term)... Moving on is important, yes, but you keep spouting all this BS about trying to get with girls before you know whether or not they are right for you... The whole shotgun method (sometimes also known as the "spray-and-pray" method) is fine if you're just looking for a quick fling, but for those of us looking for love, well, we want to make an informed decision... and informed decisions take time...

If this were to happen to me, this is where my "boyfriend switch" comes in real handy. Basically my brain has a dead man's switch that trips if a girl has a boyfriend... if I had any attraction to her otherwise, that attraction is instantly nullified the moment I find out. It saves a lot of heartache too and allows me to move on much more quickly, which is what you suggest anyway

If, in this case, said woman later decides to dump the boyfriend and tries to get with me, she's going to have to work to regain my affection... After all, she decided that 1) another guy was more important to her than me, and 2) she potentially decided to arbitrarily dump the other guy (unless it was the guy that did the dumping or he cheated on her)...

Either of those things have no impact on my opinion of her otherwise (whatever she does with her life is her own business, not mine), but I would be far more wary if she wanted to get into a relationship with me after that, since her actions have demonstrated that she doesn't actually love me and would be quick to move on the moment another guy came into the picture... in other words, I'm not wasting my time on a relationship that's going to quickly die off anyway...

But TOS, what has this gotten you? Where are you today? Are you happy with your love life, or lack of one? I'm saying what I say from a position of relative authority and achievement -- done it, had it, married it, etc. From what you've said here in post after post, you haven't. What you are doing is not working. That "boyfriend" switch might as well be called a "keep me unhappy and lonely" switch. You're stuck in a pattern.

Btw, I recommend you read my latest post -- "Don't Be This Guy". Scary stuff, and I would hate to see you turn into even a shadow of that guy in 30 years. See him and beware your future without some major changes.

The reason I would respond to your "position of authority" is that you've had it relatively easy... People just seem to like you, and not every guy is blessed with that kind of quality. Also, I'm not trying to disregard everything you say, just some of it. The points about not trying to interfere in her own life were spot on... same thing with the finding something else to do with your life (at the very least that can distract me from my being a failure in life)... The thing I really take issue with is the whole "find other girls to be interested in"... A good idea in theory, but seeing as how the last X years of the OP's life were effectively for naught, spending X more years just to have it blow up in his face again would not be a very attractive prospect...

As for the boyfriend switch, it's very important... if a potential girlfriend that's involved with another guy is going to start dating me before she dumps the other guy, it's just going to repeat itself with the next "new guy" down the line...


I read the diary link and commented in that thread already... he seemed to have more going on than just the unlovable issues I have...

I could complain all day about my problems with people liking me, but it's pointless. Yes, some people like me instantly (I'm tall and somewhat good-looking, though also a bit chubby and getting older), but others are threatened by me and hold me at arm's length, including someone I find very attractive and would like to be platonic friends with. There's just no logic to it sometimes, and sometimes what we want is either not good for us or never going to happen. I know it hurts when this happens, and it's hard to bear, but we just have to move on. No point wasting time on someone who won't change their mind or isn't interested.

Like in my "Don't get used" thread -- you're just burning time when you do this. If you have a hard time meeting someone, that's the real issue, not the person who isn't into you. Stay productive, not counterproductive. And really, the person you ache for will probably respect you more instead of seeing you as someone who will always be there to fall back on -- they won't value you.

Exactly. You can't just look around the room and pick ANYONE to go out with, like buying an item from a catalogue. If there's no attraction on your part, you are wasting their time. Isn't the idea that you find yourself attracted to someone, befriend them and once you see that they are great on the inside as well, THEN ask them out? Maybe I'm too idealistic, but I just can't understand the mentality of dating lots of people you aren't attracted to in the hope that one day you'll find someone you do love.

I keep wondering how my words and philosophy keep getting distorted..

I'll be the first one to tell you not to date anyone you're not attracted to. If you don't like X, Y, or Z, don't waste your time or theirs by dating them.

But to fixate on just one person and pine for them is a waste of your own life and time, and puts unfair pressure on that person. There are lots of people out there, some of whom you will like. However, you're not going to meet them all in one place, so if you just go to your classes and the one other thing you do in your life and don't meet anyone, it's not fair to cry out that no one likes you -- you can't fall in love with someone if you never meet them.

So that's what I mean about upping the sample size -- just like statistics, the bigger the sample, the better. You meet 50 people a year, maybe half of them are women, which means that maybe 1 in 25 you will like. You meet 500 people a year, that's 10 times more women (at least) who might catch your interest (and you theirs).

And if someone isn't interested, why pursue it or waste time crying about it? Keep going!

Ok, I've just re-read your original post and I can see that I misunderstood. Sorry about that. However, the attitude and advice of "if you can't get the hot girl, go for the plain Jane" has been said many times in threads similar to this one. What irritates me most is the implied assumption that if you date enough of them, eventually you'll find the right girl for you, and that this is somehow better than not dating anyone until you find said ideal girl. It also implies that you should date for the sake of it, regardless of whether there is a connection or not and that, I feel, could be extremely destructive for both parties. For me, dating is something couples do rather than an exercise to find out if you and they are compatible. Perhaps my logic is flawed?

I'll take it a step farther than billsmithglendale (or maybe we agree on this, dunno) and say that while you shouldn't get into a long term steady dating relationship with someone you aren't attracted to, one single date is just fine. More than fine. It's an assignment you should give yourself. If you absolutely refuse to go on a date with a woman until you are sure she's girlfreind material, YOU WILL NEVER HAVE A GIRLFRIEND!! ! Cripes! You are scaring women off with this idea that a date is not undertaken until there is some sort of romance already. It's just way too much pressure. If you would like a girlfriend, you MUST work hard to understand the mentality of dating lots of people you aren't attracted to in the hope that one day you'll find someone you do love. Because this methodology of no dating until you are sure she's "the one" is scaring women off. There will be no "the one" until you drop it. Drop it. Drop it now. And go on many dates with women you have no romantic interest in. This is not leading them on unless you let the dates continue with one particular woman you don't care for. THAT'S leading her on. One date is just one date. And if women get the idea that you think a date is a sign you are almost a couple, they WILL say "let's just be friends".

Did I merely imply it? I should say it straight up. If you date enough women, plain janes included, you'll eventually find the right girl for you. This is not just somehow better than not dating until you find said ideal girl, it's INFINITELY better because the idea that you shouldn't date until you find Ms.Right is your ticket to loneliness. DROP IT NOW! Yes! You should ask women out for a date even if you aren't already feeling she's The One. What is extremely destructive to both parties is to let the dating continue for many dates if there isn't a spark. However, waiting for a spark before the first date is destructive to you.
Dating is how people find out if they are compatible. If you won't go out on a date unless you feel you are already a couple, women will keep you in the "freind zone" because it's far safer to keep you there than to risk having you think you are a couple after just one date.

Why not? Why can't a relationship grow out of a friendship? Isn't it better to know what they are like on the inside first? I thought women were less superficial than men...



Again, I don't see how I am scaring anyone. I thought people didn't go on dates unless their was a mutual feeling of attraction, otherwise, what's the point? It's a waste of time, no? I also thought that dates were agreed upon...both parties were happy with the idea?



I'm not saying it's leading her on, I'm saying that if you don't feel any attraction towards her to start with, you are wasting your both time and hers; that that single date is as pointless as 5 of them.



Again, I assumed the feelings would be mutual before a date was set up, and that we were friends first. Is that too much to ask?

Tell me what you think about my situation:

The woman I described, I had gone on three dates with. We had discussed taking things to the next level, after the third date. I was nervous about it, but said yes after a couple of days. We were about to be separated due to distance, and she said that she couldn't do anything long-distance, and she wanted to wait until graduating from college before starting a relationship. That was a year away. So I dropped the subject for a while.

I started college full-time the following month. That was the reason for the distance issues. I was living in Wichita Falls, Texas by then, she lived near Houston. I had tried to pursue other people in the meantime. I look for female Aspies with the same interests, and there weren't any in Wichita Falls, or even in Dallas-Ft. Worth (the nearest metro area, about 100 miles away). After not connecting with other people I had pursued, I had made the assessment that the one I was initially interested was the best one to date. But a few months later, she mentioned that my personality wasn't good enough, when she was fine with it when she and I met up those three times, and mine hadn't changed a bit. And she stood firm on the distance issue. She had essentially built a wall around herself for whatever reason. I was being shot down because of said wall, and every time I convinced her that I could be a very good partner, she accused me of being manipulative.

I was merely trying to convince her to "tear down this wall" (much like Reagan convinced Gorbachev). But to no avail.

Yes. A relationship can grow out of a friendship. However, if you don;'t ask a woman out until you are sure you are mutually attracted, AND you feel that as date implies the start of a serious relationship, you will stay in the "friend zone". This is not superficial of women. It's a protective mechanism on the part of women to protect them from a man who potentially will see a casual date as a commitment, and worse yet, a commitment as ownership. You are scaring women away by pressuring them.

A single date with somebody who has no relationship potential is not a waste of time. It's a good idea. For one thing, it could help you get rid of this idea that a date means you are already a couple. Because that idea is scaring women away. It is clingy. It is deperate. It is pressuring. At it's worst, it sends off a vibe that a woman puts herself in literal danger by dating you- that you are the kind of guy who would "rather see you dead, little girl, than see you with another man" (old Beatles song). I'm sure you wouldn't. But women protect themselves by keeping men at a distance who give off a vibe of "we are now a couple!! !! since we have gone on a date". It sends a vibe of ownership. It scares women. Stop!

Women have to feel that they are safe. That a date isn't a commitment. That they will not be considered evil liars if they start to feel pressured by a man to commit. I wondered why Aspie men were having such a hard time. But not all are. There is a great divide that I see on this board. There are the Aspie men who cast a wide net and don't take dating so seriously and eventually wind up in a relationship with the one "fish" from their wide net.

And then there are those who insist that they should fish with their hands...to use no net at all but inside put a hand into the water and grab and grab as fish swim by. Use a net. And remember that if you think women aren't on a date with you unless they want to be your girlfriend, the words at the end of the date will be "let's just be friends".

Ease up ion the pressure. Read billsmithglenndale's posts again. You can blow me off because I'm a woman and an NT one at that so how could I know? But he's an AS man. So at least listen to him.

A date is only a date, you go out, have fun, go home. Think of it as a Final Fantasy game. The little battles clock up EXP which enables you to tackle the impending boss battle. In trying to bypass the battles, you will get to the boss and fail miserably, and keep doing the same thing and not being able to pass, you put the pad down and stop playing, saying it is too hard.

I have been guilty of the same things, but I know what I have to do, I just have to get over my anxiety and just do it.

A relationship is like the boss battle. You lose sometimes, till you have the right balance to beat the boss and win. If you bypass the dates, you won't even get to the relationship. Don't place too much emphasis on trying to get a girlfriend or get laid or whatever. Focus on your story, you're the main character, do things that will better your life, dates will come, and eventually, so will relationships.

dude! what he said!