Question about romanticness and men.

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Plus one. Oh, and by the way, the minute the sex stopped, without an earnest effort from him to help address the problem, I'd be out the door. Not every woman conforms to generic gender roles.

You sound a lot like my boyfriend... he hates mushy stuff and when I say sentimental things he even makes vomiting noises sometimes... very unsentimental and matter-of-fact. He also says I give him a lot of compliments and he doesnt know what to do with them, he thinks that someone giving him a compliment is trying to butter him up...

he does do nice things for me though. It is more likely to come in the form of cooking for me, or a massage, or giving me his coat if it is raining, or suggesting advice about things... he tries to comfort me when I am down though he doesnt really know what to do...

He is very self-sufficient in most regards though and expect me to be the same.

Anyway interesting to read your post....

er .. maybe i should have read that more carefully. emotional support can't be a bad thing. it's the (possibly empty) gestures that i can do without.

i got the feeling the quote in the OP was more a rant than an observation of typical behavior or anything.



ha .. i can appreciate that.
it's a bit childish of me but i can't stop rolling my eyes when there is a couple in front of me in a line, say, smooching or squeezing each other.

it seems insincere to me - like bargaining for favors or being possessive - although i'm betting for the smooch couple it is not so. plus that stuff seems private. i'm not opposed to PDA, but if i'm watching someone else it feels like i'm intruding.

weddings are really awkward.

Now that my post in "can't have sex with my boyfriend" thread made enough impression to warrant starting a new thread, let me add my 2 cents. I can act like of the most romantic men in existence. If I have a romantic evening planned for my girlfriend, I'll make my apartment look spotless, clean my car extra-thoroughly, pick her up at home, be extremely chivalrous, take to a romantic fine dining restaurant on a rooftop of a 40-story building overlooking the city, draw a luxurious bath for her after we get back to my place, and pleasure her for hours. But throughout all that, it'll all still feel like completing a deliverable, or like a computer running a "romantic.exe" file. Don't get me wrong; I enjoy doing all those romantic things (much like a programmer would enjoy writing VB.Net code); but in the end, it's still just "something you have to do to keep yourself from getting dumped". So, despite, despite my supposedly unromantic view, my girlfriend gets the romance she wants, I get the physical affection I want, and everyone is happy.

I was probably being pedantic..... ....I do that.


Like I've said, I get a great buzz out of doing little romantic things. Trouble is, once the relationship is stable, I've always ceased to find it much fun any more. I hope the reason is simply that my relationships have always become fraught with unresolved conflicts, and that if I ever get one that remains harmonious, the romance will still be fun for me. But maybe it's just that doing stuff to avoid being dumped is less amusing than doing stuff to acquire a new partner.........finding treasure is glorious, but spending the rest of your life protecting it from thieves is just a scary chore. I think there's an Oriental story about somebody who punishes a guy by giving him a priceless jewel - he knows the guy is too greedy to refuse it, and that it will destroy him because he will have to spend the rest of his life chained to the impossible task of hanging onto it.

it is good to read your post, as you seem quite similar to him and that helps me understand him better. BTW I hate watching PDAs too, they give me a gross feeling.

I am a romantic though and sentimental about things in general.

i am glad that you posted, as when I saw your post in that thread I wanted to ask you about it, whether you thought that doing all those things were a must in a relationship.

I see that you say that you dont enjoy it but do it as a neccessity to keep your girlfriend. Probably a lot of guys, and maybe a number of girls feel that way too.

I guess there must be a certain type of temperament who appreciate and love romantic things, and other types which get nothing out of it.

she is lucky though, that you do so many things for her. She must be happy

It's not that I don't enjoy providing romance, it's just that I see it as, by and large, a job. It's something a good boyfriend does for his girlfriend, while helps make sure she doesn't feel used. Case in point. I work in tech support, and I got into it because it's something I enjoy doing. But if my boss suddenly decided to pay me my regular wages without having me do any work or even showing up, I'd agree in a heartbeat. Sure, I'd tinker with old computers just for the heck of it, but I'd do it only occasionally, when I feel like it.

With all that said, my most recent girlfriend was a self-proclaimed low-maintenance girl; she actually told me that. I didn't have to go to the lengths I described in my previous post, although the "restaurant meal plus an activity" date was always something I provided. I'm sure she'd be OK with me just coming over to her apartment (wink wink), but an outing beforehand is more fun anyway, much like unemployed people take a part-time job because it's more interesting than just sitting at home collecting unemployment checks.

I hope I made my point clear. I see romance as, ultimately, something a boyfriend must provide for his girlfriend in order to stay in the relationship, but that doesn't mean he can't enjoy doing it. Now, what do I require from my girlfriend? Until 2004, all I required was making out. The requirements have been raised since then, to include sex within 45 days of the first date, and a kiss no later than the third date. The security of having a guaranteed date for events is mutually shared, and is therefore not factored into requirements.

aha. i think you've nailed my discomfort with such things. they're ceremonial, in a way.



glad to help .. ?

i think you can have the right sentiment, but just find it nearly impossible to force particular behavior.

i bet he shows his appreciation in ways that are more natural to him.

"be yourself" always has my vote.

i'm not especially sentimental. more like a guy in that respect, if such a generalization is fair to make.

Do you mean it seems somehow contrived? I think for me if I had to do some of those things I would enjoy the romance of them so much, it wouldnt seem that way. though his Planned Evening does seem like hard work, I can see how doing those things might be tiresome. I guess I have never thought about it. If I were to make romantic gestures towards someone I would do them infrequently.

You make it sound almost like a contract! Oh well, it sounds like it is working out for you..

Barry White playing on the stereo, red wine and candlelight, my shirt unbuttoned down to my chest hairs revealing my gold medallion and heaving breast.

Go on baby, you know you want it!

yes, and obligatory.



i'm well aware of the problem i have of perceiving a lot of other people's behavior, virtually anything that i cannot identify with, as patronizing or an act (if not an outright manipulation). this cannot always be true, it just seems fake to me. so take my words with a grain of salt ... ..

I am not sure what it is. His myers brigg type is ISTP and he says the same thing, that a lot of compliments seem insincere. Or he just says he feels nothing if I compliment him, like he just feels a blank feeling and doesnt have an opinion of it. Anyway, I probably give too many compliments...

I'm definitely with katzefrau on this. Romance is discomfort. Romance = planned? There is nothing romantic to me in being an unwilling participant in someone else's romantic fantasy - especially if they are doing it because 'it's what women want'. It actually puts me off completely. If a person is not interested in being and showing themself so that I can get to know them, and is interested in knowing me, then we are unlikely to get along. And displays of affluence are just as off-putting as displays of mean-mindedness.

Tbh, in Aspie1's scenario I'm not sure what I would be expected to do. It's so one-sided that I would feel like a spare thumb, a bit-part actor in someone else's grand play, and I would just be watching, perplexed as to who exactly it was supposed to be impressing. I'm sure there are people who would appreciate those things - just not me.

Thoughtfulness is a completely different matter. If someone took the trouble to know me - to appreciate that I don't like surprises, situations which make me feel uncomfortable, overt displays of 'planned' behaviour for which I don't have an inbuilt script - and did something because they genuinely thought I would like or appreciate it - that would be wonderful.
In my experience 'romance' involves someone getting angry with me because 'You're not reacting in the way you're supposed to!', so I would prefer no romance and no anger.

I might be aromantic but I'm not cold - I'm a complete sucker for small gestures of thoughtful affection, given and received. I think that you show people that you care by the way you behave towards them ordinarily, not by saving it up for special occasions.

just passing through..
i think some of the problem is not that men don't want to be romantic but that they are unsure how to proceed especially men with AS.. someone on here, i forget who, said their solution was to simply ask and state what they wanted, examples given were 'give me a hug and kiss before leaving for work.. & upon returning' another was given regarding the male not being aware of partner's feelings (the poster was a woman) she used to think 'thoughtless bastard' when coming home exhausted and partner seemed not to notice, but when she said something like 'i really don't feel too good, could you do the dishes for me' the man was happy to oblige.. a bit off-topic perhaps but i think there is wisdom there...
perhaps the main point was that men cannot 'read minds' even well-adjusted NT men, let alone an aspie who may well struggle to understand their own feelings. some women seem to believe that romance should be intuitive, spontaneous and natural.. maybe they're right but maybe for some men this is nigh on impossible, even if they love their partner more than life itself.. anyways hopefully this is vaguely on-topic
fudo