Cool song about getting friendzoned

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People are going to end up in being down at some point, it is resentment that is the real stinker.

Friendship is also about commitment and companionship. It's just not *also* about sexual attraction and sex. These guys who complain about being 'friendzoned' wouldn't be any less offended if a woman told them, 'I'll be your best friend forever, I'll always have your back.'

The fact that it's a default position still makes it a "zone" because if there is mutual attraction and they would consider dating/sleeping with you then you move into a different position in their life.

Unfortunately, being platonic when there is 1-way attraction really doesn't work. Or when it does you're out of the picture as soon as they get involved with someone else.

My ex did this as we were breaking up. She said we could still be friends but after all she put me through along with my strong residual feelings I told her no and moved on. It's really better that way.


PS: I started this thread to advertise that kewl Kiwi band The Cleaners From Venus





The differences between friendship and romantic love is that romantic love has a sexual component. Sexual tension really complicates friendship and often prevents 2 people from really getting close if there isn't reciprocity in how they feel towards each other.

[quote="AR15000"]The fact that it's a default position still makes it a "zone" because if there is mutual attraction and they would consider dating/sleeping with you then you move into a different position in their life. [/quote

It works both ways. It doesn't need a label.

You are not begin zoned, you weren't considered.

Not a fan of the band sorry.

Thanks for the transcript, 0_equals_true.

Ok so not necessarily about sex, but still: if a girl is not willing to belong to you as your girlfriend, she's not worth spending time with as a friend.

Still objectifying women.

Still reducing the worth of a woman to what she'll do for you personally that she wouldn't do for anyone else.

Still can't be a friend with a woman, you can only have a girlfriend and all other women are just so very mean because they won't date you.

So, friendzone is still a codeword for women aren't worth anything to certain men outside of a romantic or sexual relationship.

I agree with the poster who said it's not a "zone" it's the default position. It's also not one you have no chance of moving out of if you actually act like a friend instead of a desperate blueballed predator.

No way a man could want a romantic relationship with a lady, sly279? Of course there is a chance he wants a romantic relationship. Most men and women as well want romantic relationships to develop into sexual ones as well, at whatever rate they're both comfortable wit.

The problem is that the friendzone concept means there's no way a man could want a relationship with a woman that isn't romantic and/or sexual in nature. You can't just be buds and hang out and do ordinary things with a woman who doesn't want to be exclusively devoted to stroking your masculine ego.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that friendship is about *commitment* but it is about reciprocity and sincere friendship does involve companionship...at least when you're young. But nowadays people use the term "friendship" casually and mean nothing more than an amiable acquaintanceship. And as I am discovering, as you get older and your situation in life changes you become more distant from your friends. Particularly as people shack up with their SOs and definitely when people marry and have children.

So the real issue with friendzoning is not the romantic & sexual rejection, but being used and disgarded by someone who claims to like you and want your company. I've been told this many times by women in the past who rejected me but still claimed to want to be friends with me; only to discover they put me on the back burner until they got a new bf and then I'm out of the picture.

I've noticed that quite a few straight women won't give guys the time of day unless they find these guys sexually attractive and would *consider* sleeping with them. But I dare say that many of them do tend to treat guys they don't find shagworthy as disposable friends....Or someone who be their therapist when they're having bf/husband problems but will otherwise ignore.

As far as I can tell, the friendzone concept (or the term, at least) seems to have come from people selling dating advice and trying to make their advice more palatable to their customer base.

The advice itself was good: Don't pretend you want to be platonic friends with a girl if you don't. Tricking someone into thinking you want to be their friend is not an effective romance strategy! Instead you should flirt with her or otherwise make it clear that you are interested in sex and romance, from the start.

The dating experts said the reasoning behind this was something about your initial behavior setting the tone for the relationship, and once a girl perceives you as a friend her perception gets stuck like that. Or something. The actual reasoning behind the advice is that, if a girl isn't interested in you sexually or romantically, she will turn you down right away, and you can move on to trying to woo someone else. Dating is called a "numbers game" because most people aren't mutually interested in you; you usually have to try lots of people before one works out. Spending loads of time and energy cultivating a fake friendship with someone who's not interested in you is contrary to that end. (Also, it's mean.)

I personally suspect that the dating advice guys knew the truth, but they wanted to give their potential customers a feeling of having more control over the outcome.

A gender-swapped version of this dating advice phenomenon: Women are often told they shouldn't have sex on a first date because it will make the guy have lack respect for her. Um, if a guy is willing to have sex with you on a first date but he would look down on you for having sex with him on a first date, he already doesn't respect you, regardless of whether you actually have sex. The reason delaying sex "works" to help you end up with a more relationship-oriented man is that guys who are ONLY interested in sex won't ask you on another date if you don't put out the first time! Which frees you up to date other guys who are hopefully more suited to you. Your behavior doesn't actually modify the guy's personality. (Although, I don't recommend delaying sex just to be contrary. If you want to have sex on the first date, go for it; if the guy is a dickbag, you'll have other chances to find out.)

So friendship is about using and discarding someone? I'm assuming you're referring to any friendship whether it be between two men, two women or a man and a woman.
I'm sorry your friends are moving on with their lives. Friendships may not be for life, but that doesn't mean that friendship doesn't exist.

...And " friendzoning " is ?

Friendship is *not* about using and discarding someone. The point is that there is dihonesty. Someone says they want to be your friend but in REALITY they don't treat you like a friend! They use and discard you.

For example: I've had a few situations in the past where a woman decides that she's not interested in dating me, offered me platonic friendship, I accepted her offer and then she totally ignored me. That is not a friendly thing to do whatsoever. So don't lie to someone and say you wanna be friends with them as a token of politeness when you really don't.

Last edited by AR15000 on 03 Feb 2016, 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sometimes people are your friend in a certain time and location, and sometimes it is not permanent, but this doesn't meant the friendship wasn't real. It depends I guess. Some girl saying she your new best friend at a party and then ignoring you the next day would be dishonest. But, say, a friend that you only share time at camp with would still be a friend, even though you may drift apart.

That's not a friend, that's an acquaintance. There *is* a difference. But sometimes people say they want to be your friend but totally ignore you thereafter. And that means they NEVER really meant what they said. They were just trying to be nice to you.

That's why most of my friends are guys: Because guys generally take friendship seriously even though we sometimes drift apart with time whereas with women, if they don't have feelings for you they will either ignore you or only wanna talk to you when they need a shoulder to cry on.

I have by default now 'friend-zoned' every male who is not my boyfriend...

But yes that seems to be the general idea if you're not willing to give every person of the opposite sex the chance to be in a relationship with you, then you're a mean old friend zoner.

I don't know that it has to do with gauging 'usefulness' its also quite possible she simply does not have romantic feelings she shares with the guy thus she views him as a friend and nothing more.

I mean its just obnoxious when people talk about this like the woman is always doing something wrong by not being with a guy she's not intrested in that way. Sometimes the women isn't 'using' the guy or manipulating him to do favors by using his feelings for her she doesn't share in a leading on way...sometimes they see it as a genuine friendship with that guy and simply don't have romantic feelings or a desire to take it further, they aren't then being mean by not going out with the guy. Though the guy would be mean by going on accusatory rant at the woman, or trying to sabotage relationships she might get into because he's convinced he's the only one for her.

I am not saying there aren't manipulative, women who like to play with peoples feelings....but that is not always what is going on when you have the 'I love her but she doesn't love me back' situations.

Yeah you're totally right, women with our uni-mind all ignore every guy they don't have romantic feelings for unless they want to talk to them or cry on their shoulder, there are no exceptions...for this is the law of women.

Women don't ever just hang out with male friends/aquantinces they lack romantic interest in.....no, it's just unheard of, taboo even.

"Let's just be friends" usually means "I'm not interested." It's a soft rejection, something many women have been conditioned to give because, sadly, many men don't respond well to honesty. Case in point, if any of these women had told you the truth and had been 100% about how they felt (that they just don't like you) most guys would be calling them cruel or a b***h for not "being nice" about it. It's literally a lose-lose situation for many women. My wife and every single female friend I have (without exception), has been through some form of this while dating.

The good news is you seem to be socially aware enough to know what "Let's just be friends" means. As a result, you're halfway to getting over this whole friendzoneTM nonsense thats holding you back from developing real friendships with women.

Now you just need to learn to practice a bit of Affective Empathy with women and you'll be cured of your affliction! I suggest you start by considering the perspectives of women on this board rather than dismissing them because they don't conform with your preconcieved notions.


NOTE: Before you play the Aspie card, people on the spectrum usually suffer from Cognative empathy deficites but have no issues with (or even abnormally high) Affective Empathy. You might not cognatively recognize it at first, but once you realize that being forced to hurt someones feelings because you don't feel mutual attraction towards them is actually very difficult and painful for most people (hence the tendency towards soft rejection), it becomes a lot harder to think of them as cruel b*****s.