UNDERSTANDING INTIMACY

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Thanks for your research! It sounds quite useful and promising! I personally crave both sexual intimacy with a woman and platonic intimacy with close guy friends. We really do need to make a distinction between sexual intimacy (including non-sexual contact between romantic partners) and platonic intimacy. The two types of intimacy are equally important to humans. Unfortunately, our culture often downplays the importance and necessity of platonic intimacy, especially platonic intimacy between straight males.

As a 27 year old virgin guy with Asperger's, I have recently become aware of the need for me to get both a girlfriend and close guy friends. I also believe that I have to get more close guy friends before I'll be emotionally ready to have a steady girlfriend.

Recently I kind of made this new guy friend. He's about my age and we share the same career interests. We actually met over this online forum about our career interests. My new friend insisted we meet even though doing so was outside of my social comfort zone. However, we did meet and we had an intense four hour lunch together. He was so nice and treated me as if I was an old friend. In fact, he told me that I have another friend in him. I got a really good first impression of him.

After our first outing, I felt these strong feelings of brotherly affection toward my new friend that I have rarely felt before. I wanted to pursue a more intimate friendship with him. I also really believed that our meeting was "meant to be." My new friend and I also hung out a second time the next week for over two hours. Unfortunately, my Asperger's and my strong feelings for my friend led to me coming on strong to him in electronic communications. Eventually, my friend cut off contact with me. I've been trying to make up with my friend, but it's been very difficult.

I have realized that I was coming on way too strong to my friend and not respecting his "space." However the only reason that I came on strong is that my friend came on strong during our first outing and even before we met. I wanted to become really good friends with him and I sincerely believed (and still do to some extent ) that the feeling was mutual. However, now, I'm not sure what his intentions were and for all I know, he didn't even know what his own intentions were.

My friend knows that I have Asperger's. I mentioned it on that online forum before we first met. Unfortunately, my friend hasn't been able to accept my differences, mostly because we don't know each other very well. After I sent the text that made my friend cut off contact with me, I left several text and phone messages with him in which I tried to explain myself and open up to him more. I even said that I have trouble expressing myself to others and knowing how others will react to what I say and do. I was hoping that he would understand my differences better. However, this only made matters worse and likely made my friend more uncomfortable and even scared of interacting with me.

Almost two weeks after he cut off contact, he finally messaged me and told me that he understands that I have trouble making friends, but that doesn't give me the right to disrespect his feelings. However, if he really understood me and my differences , then he wouldn't have reacted the way that he did. And by the same token, if I really understood my friend and his differences, then I wouldn't have acted the way that I did.

I also believe that my friend has some kind of issues of his own, maybe even Asperger's or a similar condition. He came on strong during and before our first outing and was enjoying himself so much that he hung out with me for over four whole hours. But after our first outing, he sure didn't come on strong. I think that he may have simultaneously wanted to become friends with me and also became scared of getting close to me.

I just know that if I got my friend to willingly communicate and even meet with me again, then we could understand each other and our respective personal issues and differences better and become good friends. I think that both of us have problems with intimacy. But my big mistake was trying to rush the intimacy between us, even if it was only unintentional. Intimacy within all relationships should never be rushed and always needs to be given time to develop. And it's even more imperative to follow this advice when it's a platonic friendship between two straight men as straight men usually fear intimacy with other men.

Last edited by futuresoldier1944 on 06 May 2017, 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

It wasn't until my daughter started showing signs of autism that I realized my husband has aspergers. Ten years of marriage and I finally starting to piece things together. I love him so much but there are a lot of issues that we havnt been able to get on the same page with. I am interested to learn as much as I can and maybe help someone else.

so many problems with all that, what's an old professor?, further the article reads quite shallow, or very nt?
insights in the special skills aspies need, all need the same?
to me its all more newagy than old professory, deep connections wtf!! relations are work for all flavors, and those who claim a particular brand of virtuous-honesty and all other virtuesignalling coverups, surely know how to make use of desires for fast virtuerecovering bandaid

for whom is it? we see some firstposters coming up, ntwomen with acceptance-virtue? next move for the aspartner?
sorry but i see no good basis for whatever (acceptance is the opposite of equility)( & talkingpoints about honesty is a usually a giveaway-clue for salesmen-talk)

So, so you think you can tell
Heaven from hell
Blue skies from pain
Can you tell a green field
From a cold steel rail?
A smile from a veil?
Do you think you can tell?
Did they get you to trade
Your heroes for ghosts?
Hot ashes for trees?
Hot air for a cool breeze?
Cold comfort for change?
And did you exchange
A walk on part in the war
For a lead role in a cage?

I agree about the importance of the HAE traits in any close relationships. However, you probably underestimate the role of infatuation for NDs. I've shown with a large data set (14,000 but currently collecting more) that for NDs, a strong infatuation which leads to obsessive thoughts creates stronger attachments. So for NDs, the lack of infatuation or the lack of a proper courtship period, is probably a good indicator of relationships that will fail. Especially with asexual people involved.

What do you think about infatuation with somebody who you aren't romantically interested in, but only want as a friend? As I wrote about in my first post, I have developed strong feelings of brotherly affection for this new friend of mine. My strong feelings for him and my Asperger's led me to come on strong to him and scare him away, at least for now. And ever since I first met my new friend, I have had obsessive thoughts about him. In fact, if I didn't continue to have obsessive thoughts about him, then I might have almost forgotten about him during the period since he cut off contact with me.

Of course, it can have drawbacks. The strong attachment is created regardless if there is a mutual interest or not. However, the thing is, once you are in a relationship with somebody, and don't bond with sex, a weak attachment means people will easily break-up, sometimes for no other reason than "I have no feelings for you".

So, the "solution" is that you must make sure that there is a mutual long-term interest before starting to obsess about somebody.

I don't think obsessing about a friend is ever a good idea. These obsessions are for romances, not friendships.

Well my strong attachment for my new friend was created precisely because there was a mutual interest, or because I thought that there was a mutual interest. He initiated our meeting and came on strong in a good way. However, I'm not sure what his exact intentions were. For all I know, he didn't even know what his own exact intentions were. I think that he did want to become friends with me, but was also scared of becoming close to me. The reason that I'm still obsessed with my friend is that I think that the "real him," even if it's deep down inside of him, wants to be friends with me. The "real him" met me and had a four hour lunch with me. But after he got to know me a little better and experienced my Asperger's-related quirks and flaws first-hand, albeit all in electronic communications, he got cold feet and didn't let the "real him" come out anymore for me to see. Because the "real him" wouldn't react to me the way that my friend has been acting recently.

Yes, but I think you do it for the wrong reason if the expectation is a friendship. Unless you two are gay and want a relationship, obsessing is not be a good idea. You will be fooling your brain that way. I've seen too many posts here about obsessing about somebody and expecting a friendship. You don't need a strong attachment with a friend, and getting one typically is asking for trouble. Especially if you have a desire for a relationship.

But if those of us with Asperger's have trouble making friends and we seem to really bond with somebody, we shouldn't reject those feelings, even if an obsession is emotionally unhealthy. I emphatically disagree that people, whether they are on the autistic spectrum or otherwise, don't need a strong attachment with a friend. As I wrote in my first post, our culture often downplays the importance and necessity of platonic intimacy, especially platonic intimacy between straight males. And while I haven't read everything that colina has written on this thread thoroughly, I'm sure that he would agree with me at least to some extent. Colina seems to really value the necessity and importance of intimacy of all kinds, especially having intimate conversations.

Well, obsessions are not always emotionally unhealthy, but they are indicators about the motives our subconscious mind has. My hypothesis is that strong people obsessions have an innate role in courtship, and thus, the brain think it is doing courtship when you obsess over somebody. That's what is likely to cause problems. But, then again, my hypothesis might be wrong.



For NDs, I think this is a safeguard. Our brain thinks we are forming a long-term bond with a romantic partner, and that is often a problem in the friend area. If the other part is ND, then they will either form a lose bond if they regard it as a friendship, or a strong one if their brain also regards it as courtship. If the other part is NT, you will simply form a too strong bond too quickly, and then you won't be able to back-off if your friend doesn't want to see you a lot anymore.



Nah, I'd mostly say it downplays platonic (asexual) romances.

If I start off with colina's definition, that works for me. The dictionary definition does mention close friendship, and even colloquial language has the phrase "physical intimacy" to distinguish the sexual from the non-sexual.

But I agree that "intimate" is mostly interpreted as having a sexual dimension. The closest relationships I have had were non-sexual, but if I called them intimate, most people would assume otherwise. Interpretation of the word depends very much on context and on who you're talking with, so it can easily lead to misunderstandings.

I once saw a technical term for very close friendships in something on psychology. I don't remember the word, but if you can find it, colina, perhaps that would be more useful for asking questions without biasing people in ways you don't want.

"As I wrote in my first post, our culture often downplays the importance and necessity of platonic intimacy, especially platonic intimacy between straight males. And while I haven't read everything that colina has written on this thread thoroughly, I'm sure that he would agree with me at least to some extent. Colina seems to really value the necessity and importance of intimacy of all kinds, especially having intimate conversations."


rdos & Gromit and others doing some serious thinking on human connection is so satisfying--no bluster about owning the truth, no instant advice telling others how to feel, no hostility born from unrecognized fear. Thankyou for the sincere exploration that this thread was born to foster.

"Platonic intimacy" or an honest, accepting, emotionally understanding friendship is not discussed in the media nearly as much as romantic relationships--(is that factual? Seems obvious to me.). If so, it's easy to hold the view that society, our culture, the media Undervalues the "necessity" of intimate friendships, close work relationships and parent-child relationships--even sibling relationships. I was a bit surprised by rdos use of the word "neccesity" because it suggests these asexual relationships are needed for good living. That term is rare outside of social science. I agree with him. All of these asexual relationships are major shapers of our mental health---even our life expectancy (tons of replicated research support that remarkable connection between all kinds successful intimacy and better health).

Actually, this body of hard-nosed research indicates that asexual intimacy is more important than sexing--especially after teen-age, well, OK, after 20-something.

OFF TOPIC; I'm still not-at-home with the forum format -especially the ordering of posts--and would appreciate a simple suggestion to work simply with it.(Yes, Im dumb about text conversations.) Also, do you folks see much of those hostile rage rants with snide name calling, and a sense of absolute certainty about being the custodian of truth? I've had a couple on WP, and guess writing attacks anonymously are a safe way to howl while suffering some vulnerability. Does ignoring/ not responding work for you?

"Infatuation" is one of those important experiences that pick up all sorts of extra meaning. Seems it's most popular meaning is immature love or short-lived love----y'know, like teens capacity to adore rock stars or the smartest, sexy girl in math class. For me, infatuation is mostly the A, in HAE. Sort of an Utter Acceptance of someone-still-at-a-distance. It's placing great value on an actual stranger or acquaintance, but I'm not quite sure of that. Infatuation seems more solo emotion that is not returned. It's without much empathy exchange. In any case, an intense, frustrated, un-fulfilled ongoing relationship seems like real one-way love to me. Awful position but as real as it feels, the imbalance and fantasy creates an incomplete intimacy. But, "infatuation" doesn't quite fit that emotion. One-way intimacy is almost an oxymoron, but not exactly because I really love a dead relationship thinker from the last century -- oops, guests arriving- to be continued in several hours.

Here's what intimacy is to me you let a woman into your life and she screws you out of everything and then uses you till she has no use for you then vanishes

Well I do seem to have developed an utter acceptance of my new friend even though we don't know each other very well and have developed a rift between us. Before he blocked me on Facebook, I found out something about my friend on Facebook. If I had known that thing about him before we met or maybe even right after we met it likely would have turned me off to him. However, not only do I accept my friend for it, I even have empathy for him. I have come to sense that my friend and I have a lot more in common than just shared career interests. I believe that he has issues of some sort, maybe even Asperger's or a similar condition. And in reality, the characteristic of my friend that I found out about on Facebook actually makes us more alike than I normally would have thought.

Do I trust women nope is that gonna change nope

Glad u no longer think of your relationship as infatuation. Didn't u name it one-way intimacy? Seems like one of the worst feelings for u involve the difficulty from misunderstood talk. Aspie style communication is real for my aspie friends, but not one of my spectrum traits. I'm strangely the opposite. And that style is sometimes the cause for anguish as they f-up conversations. Is that true for you?

Anyway, stick around because we should get to stuff useful to you--in a few months--after we get settled on the HAE in all close, personal relationships, romantic or platonic. I've got some tips that can make your flooding more constructive in taming unwanted obsessions.