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Is this attitude pessimistic or realistic?

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rdos
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10 May 2018, 10:26 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
Most people don't have that sort of patience......


You need to select your love interest carefully. There is no reason to bother with people that mass-date or have fixed timelines. Somebody's response to the eye contact game is a good indicator of their patience.



kraftiekortie
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10 May 2018, 10:37 am

Sexual desire doesn't work that way. If one sexually desires someone, one usually doesn't want to wait a year to consummate it.

I guess there is a certain thrill, at times, with one year of "knowing glances." But to most people, whatever their neurology, it can be quite frustrating to have to wait an extended period of time.



rdos
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10 May 2018, 10:48 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
Sexual desire doesn't work that way. If one sexually desires someone, one usually doesn't want to wait a year to consummate it.


Sexual desire (at least for guys) is very unspecific as most young women are sexually desired by men of all ages. Going by sexual desire at our age seems like a really bad idea as most women in their teens or 20s would not consider us as "relationship material".

kraftiekortie wrote:
I guess there is a certain thrill, at times, with one year of "knowing glances." But to most people, whatever their neurology, it can be quite frustrating to have to wait an extended period of time.


It becomes even better if games are added. And the thrill of getting their emotions or thoughts directly into your head makes it all worth it.



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10 May 2018, 12:20 pm

rdos wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
Sexual desire doesn't work that way. If one sexually desires someone, one usually doesn't want to wait a year to consummate it.


Sexual desire (at least for guys) is very unspecific as most young women are sexually desired by men of all ages. Going by sexual desire at our age seems like a really bad idea as most women in their teens or 20s would not consider us as "relationship material".

kraftiekortie wrote:
I guess there is a certain thrill, at times, with one year of "knowing glances." But to most people, whatever their neurology, it can be quite frustrating to have to wait an extended period of time.


It becomes even better if games are added. And the thrill of getting their emotions or thoughts directly into your head makes it all worth it.


Or.. if you hesitate, someone else is going to ask her out & be doing her within a month's time - max.


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10 May 2018, 12:28 pm

modernmax wrote:
Wanting to ask a girl out (being the end goal) but deciding that if she was interested she would be the one talking to you? I'm not sure if this is an excuse for not bothering to try or a way to avoid rejection.


If I were you I would propose first a friendly coffee, see if she accepts, propose to share an activity she would like, see if she accepts, etc.

...or some similar gradual invites. If you propose little things, you only risk insignificant rejections.

Is she cutting short the conversations you initiate? or does she look happy that you speak to her, does she enjoy the conversations?



rdos
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10 May 2018, 12:36 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Or.. if you hesitate, someone else is going to ask her out & be doing her within a month's time - max.


Wrong. Persistence is the key. If that happens, I know she lacks persistence, and I would waste my time, so it would be to my benefit that I found that out within a month.

And, of course, according to my experience, it basically never goes that way if you have played the game for a few months or so.

The big problem to watch out for is lack of progress. There should be some regular progress like more time used, new games or similar. It can successfully be combined with online activity too, but only as long as it is not in the form of conversations.



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10 May 2018, 12:40 pm

rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Or.. if you hesitate, someone else is going to ask her out & be doing her within a month's time - max.


Wrong. Persistence is the key. If that happens, I know she lacks persistence, and I would waste my time, so it would be to my benefit that I found that out within a month.

And, of course, according to my experience, it basically never goes that way if you have played the game for a few months or so.

The big problem to watch out for is lack of progress. There should be some regular progress like more time used, new games or similar. It can successfully be combined with online activity too, but only as long as it is not in the form of conversations.


*shrug* Sure, if that's your kind of human to have relations with, by all means, take the slow road.

Those of us who like to race will connect with different people.


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rdos
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10 May 2018, 2:15 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Those of us who like to race will connect with different people.


Of course. I leave the shallow and impatient women to you and everybody else that fancies them. :lol:



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10 May 2018, 2:16 pm

rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Those of us who like to race will connect with different people.


Of course. I leave the shallow and impatient women to you and everybody else that fancies them. :lol:


You can have all the women you want. I hookup with pretty little gay boys who are on the same page of physical pleasure that I am.


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rdos
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11 May 2018, 2:03 am

goldfish21 wrote:
rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Those of us who like to race will connect with different people.


Of course. I leave the shallow and impatient women to you and everybody else that fancies them. :lol:


You can have all the women you want. I hookup with pretty little gay boys who are on the same page of physical pleasure that I am.


Just goes to show that some gays don't have the natural courtship behavior. At least not the ND type, provided you are ND. So, do we have some cases of real romantic relationships among LGBT people that actually builds on a crush and not just on sex and intimacy?

I'd call your preference a FWB, not a real romantic relationship.



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11 May 2018, 2:54 am

rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Those of us who like to race will connect with different people.


Of course. I leave the shallow and impatient women to you and everybody else that fancies them. :lol:


You can have all the women you want. I hookup with pretty little gay boys who are on the same page of physical pleasure that I am.


Just goes to show that some gays don't have the natural courtship behavior. At least not the ND type, provided you are ND. So, do we have some cases of real romantic relationships among LGBT people that actually builds on a crush and not just on sex and intimacy?

I'd call your preference a FWB, not a real romantic relationship.


What does “ND” mean?

Of course there are gay LTR’s. I just came from helping a friend move several Tonnes of landscaping stones. Him and his boyfriend have been together for a few years now. Why would you think there aren’t gay people in relationships?

I never said hookups are romantic relationships. What have you that idea?


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11 May 2018, 3:56 am

rdos wrote:
Wrong. Persistence is the key. If that happens, I know she lacks persistence, and I would waste my time, so it would be to my benefit that I found that out within a month.

And, of course, according to my experience, it basically never goes that way if you have played the game for a few months or so.

The big problem to watch out for is lack of progress. There should be some regular progress like more time used, new games or similar. It can successfully be combined with online activity too, but only as long as it is not in the form of conversations.

The kind of relationship you want is not the kind of relationship most people want. Therefore how you go about is is not what most people should be doing but just those who want the same things you want.
If we define neorodiverse as having autism or other developmental disabilities then it's also not what all neurodiverse people want. If you have some other definition of ND then maybe it is by your definition (but then your definition doesn't apply to all autistic people on this forum).
Indicating interest by glances and eye-contact games is also not specific for neurodiverse people. It's a perfectly normal and common way for an NT-woman to signal interest - it just wouldn't go on for years before the guy approaches if he too is interested. Quite to the contrary, some autistic women get no or very little male attention because they fail to signal interest or are not fully aware that they somehow signal disinterest without wanting to.



rdos
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11 May 2018, 3:58 am

goldfish21 wrote:
rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Those of us who like to race will connect with different people.


Of course. I leave the shallow and impatient women to you and everybody else that fancies them. :lol:


You can have all the women you want. I hookup with pretty little gay boys who are on the same page of physical pleasure that I am.


Just goes to show that some gays don't have the natural courtship behavior. At least not the ND type, provided you are ND. So, do we have some cases of real romantic relationships among LGBT people that actually builds on a crush and not just on sex and intimacy?

I'd call your preference a FWB, not a real romantic relationship.


What does “ND” mean?

Of course there are gay LTR’s. I just came from helping a friend move several Tonnes of landscaping stones. Him and his boyfriend have been together for a few years now. Why would you think there aren’t gay people in relationships?

I never said hookups are romantic relationships. What have you that idea?


I don't think you answered my question. Relationships have many different definitions, and usually comes down to some exclusive talk. That is not the same thing as a crush turned into a romantic relationship. So, the question was: Are there gay people that are in romantic relationships based on an initial crush?

ND = neurodiverse (autistic, ADHD + some more).



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11 May 2018, 4:07 am

NorthWind wrote:
The kind of relationship you want is not the kind of relationship most people want. Therefore how you go about is is not what most people should be doing but just those who want the same things you want.
If we define neorodiverse as having autism or other developmental disabilities then it's also not what all neurodiverse people want. If you have some other definition of ND then maybe it is by your definition (but then your definition doesn't apply to all autistic people on this forum).


There is no definition of autism or ND that can make all people work according to some magic template, so that is just impossible. It always comes down to that more NDs than NTs function according to some definition.

NorthWind wrote:
Indicating interest by glances and eye-contact games is also not specific for neurodiverse people. It's a perfectly normal and common way for an NT-woman to signal interest - it just wouldn't go on for years before the guy approaches if he too is interested.


That's not correct. While it does occur among NT women, it is less frequent than among NDs, and NTs also would be less inclined to do it for longer periods of time.

NorthWind wrote:
Quite to the contrary, some autistic women get no or very little male attention because they fail to signal interest or are not fully aware that they somehow signal disinterest without wanting to.


Now you are talking about attention from NT males, I'm sure. That's because the NT and ND signalling systems are very different. It could also be that they have bought NT concepts too much and thus are suppressing their natural nature, which could lead to lack of attention from both NDs and NTs.



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11 May 2018, 4:49 am

rdos wrote:
There is no definition of autism or ND that can make all people work according to some magic template, so that is just impossible. It always comes down to that more NDs than NTs function according to some definition.

In this case it likely is more NDs than NTs but I doubt that it is most NDs.

rdos wrote:
NorthWind wrote:
Indicating interest by glances and eye-contact games is also not specific for neurodiverse people. It's a perfectly normal and common way for an NT-woman to signal interest - it just wouldn't go on for years before the guy approaches if he too is interested.


That's not correct. While it does occur among NT women, it is less frequent than among NDs, and NTs also would be less inclined to do it for longer periods of time.

Yet, NT men notice it if I indicate interest via eye-contact and I somehow doubt that all autistic men would.
If a woman does it for longer periods of times and does not want him to actually approach and talk to her she's likely insecure or uncomfortable about starting an actual relationship. That may be more common among ND women.

rdos wrote:
NorthWind wrote:
Quite to the contrary, some autistic women get no or very little male attention because they fail to signal interest or are not fully aware that they somehow signal disinterest without wanting to.


Now you are talking about attention from NT males, I'm sure. That's because the NT and ND signalling systems are very different. It could also be that they have bought NT concepts too much and thus are suppressing their natural nature, which could lead to lack of attention from both NDs and NTs.

Yes, glances and eye-contact are a signaling system NT men are likely to notice. What would be a signalling system NDs are likely to notice but NTs aren't?
Besides most autistic men on this forum are not specifically looking for an autistic woman and most autistic women are not specifically looking for an autistic man. Therefore those have no reason to do things that specifically attract autistics but not NTs. They're also a rare group and if someone isn't sure they're only compatible with other autistic people there's no advantage about trying to very specifically attract them and no others.



rdos
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11 May 2018, 5:14 am

NorthWind wrote:
rdos wrote:
There is no definition of autism or ND that can make all people work according to some magic template, so that is just impossible. It always comes down to that more NDs than NTs function according to some definition.

In this case it likely is more NDs than NTs but I doubt that it is most NDs.


That's rather hard to figure out given that social learning plays an important role, so many NDs that have these preferences are trying to do it the NT-way even if this is not their natural preferences.

NorthWind wrote:
Yet, NT men notice it if I indicate interest via eye-contact and I somehow doubt that all autistic men would.


If you do it with repeated (and perhaps longer) eye contact I'm sure most do.

NorthWind wrote:
If a woman does it for longer periods of times and does not want him to actually approach and talk to her she's likely insecure or uncomfortable about starting an actual relationship. That may be more common among ND women.


I'll disagree with that. At least for NDs.

NorthWind wrote:
Yes, glances and eye-contact are a signaling system NT men are likely to notice. What would be a signalling system NDs are likely to notice but NTs aren't?


How about repeated eye contact? Longer eye contact (which NTs regard as staring).

NorthWind wrote:
Besides most autistic men on this forum are not specifically looking for an autistic woman and most autistic women are not specifically looking for an autistic man. Therefore those have no reason to do things that specifically attract autistics but not NTs. They're also a rare group and if someone isn't sure they're only compatible with other autistic people there's no advantage about trying to very specifically attract them and no others.


NDs are not rare. The prevalence of ND is about 15% in most parts of the world. Therefore, it does make sense to use neurotype (but not ASD diagnosis) for partner preferences. It won't limit your potential dating pool in a bad way given that most people have access to hundreds or thousands of potential partners.