Can shyness/quietness ever be attractive to females?

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Dracula, I think this is where you need to just figure that some people have their preferences in a different place. Gwen's definitely cerebral enough that I believe her. I think the people who say one thing and do another are usually the types to blatantly deny and even call talks like this misogynistic without even questioning the possibility that the realities a lot of people see can lend that impression (ie. people who react emotionally over analytically tend to do well at hiding themselves from what they don't want to see).

Also, do remember that your talking about a fairly good sized majority but its still the 60 or 70% and unfortunately they get out so much that they're able to make themselves look like they're everyone. I've known a lot of friends of the family who were actually very nice girls, very attractive, more apt to go for the conservative guy but I still look at that and realize they aren't going for sheer up alpha, never seen them date sheer-up alpha either.

Why weird? Maybe you don't mean the same thing as I do, by "mystique". To me the word implies holding back one's real self in order to maintain mystery, like wearing a mask. It makes you want to look deeper, but it doesn't guarantee anything good is underneath. If there's something good underneath, why would it be hidden?



Oh, I agree that bullies are not really confident. I think arrogant people aren't really confident. I think that introverted guys can be secure and pleased with who they are. That sort of confidence, in my experience, is not at all related to one's intro/extroversion.

You really can't tell the difference between which boisterous, charismatic fellows are or aren't wife beaters. Not realiably. Usually it's the guy everybody likes.



That doesn't negate my assertion that there are biological incentives for preferring a mate that doesn't fit the alpha stereotype.



What was that we were saying about bullies and confidence?



Of course I have. But I assure you that my most deep-seated preferences were present long before I'd ever been mistreated. It was by going against my intuition that I had the worst experiences of my life.



I don't follow what you're saying, but I'd definitely feel a lack of self-respect if I tried to pretend I fancied someone who acts in a way that turns me off. I know what I like and when I've tried to like what -you- tell me to like, I can't quite manage it. Sorry to be the exception to your rule.



Why would I feel better about letting you fill people's heads with false information, uncountered?

These alleged preferances of men are constructs of experience, not genes. Genes override whatever you've lived as a person, because they were the cornerstone by which you even have a personality. It's the subconscious mind's lower levels that fan out and influence the rest of our brain. You fail to see the big picture because you're one of those you've labeled: a hiding person. The proof of true Alpha Males getting any woman they desire (a woman from any upbringing) is something that you're scared of because you have little faith in your own ability to be a true Alpha Male. Aspies tend to hold onto that possible chance that although they might not be on top, that chunk of woman population will always be looking for their type.

Wake up from your Disneyland dream and smell the brimstone, Peter Pan.




They've probably been making love to your enemy Alpha Males behind your back. You think women have no secrets, and that those you watch reveal everything in their love life to you. Stop lying to yourself. I see the 3-dimensions. I see that when a woman truly falls in love and gives herself to a man, it's because he embodies that necessary man that a woman needs. Anything less is a lapdog for her, whom she has no respect for. A woman wants someone to respect. That's not 60 or 70%, dude. That's 100%.

Pretty interesting assertions. Where's the evidence? Where are the studies that say 100% of people prefer xyz?



And they are. And this forum is full of those women. I really can't imagine why you have a problem with that--unless you think you're an alpha male and you feel threatened by the fact that some girls don't want you? What is your reason?



I agree. However, I disagree with the notion that all women respect the same men for the same reasons. Why are you so adamant about everybody being the same when the whole world is evidence to the contrary? Surely you must believe that homosexuality has a genetic basis. Or antisocial personality disorder. Or autism. If all those varieties in people's preferences have a genetic basis, how is it at all logical to suggest that 100% of women desire exactly the same characteristics in a mate?

Yeah, I agree, and at the same time that may well mean that a lot of women have just bred over years to like more conservative guys, geekier guys, and even when its life experience I still don't think they'll all of a sudden run off on a guy if they get a new hairstyle and realize they could do better-looking.



I'd say its lower than that, more like hypothalamus and cerebellum, the real primitive regions that have as much grip over you emotions as they do over your breathing. If anything though, that may well make a case that there are a lot of women out there inherently geared for other qualities in men.



Drac, you've gotta stop that - I'm seriously an inch from pissing myself .




You know everything I think, tell me exactly what I think, know exactly who I am and what I'm about. I think I'll just leave you to it, nothing here I really want to comment on, partly because you don't know me for anything and partly just because - I don't come here to mess with vulnerable members, that means mental health issues as much as it means the emotionally sensitive.

The way I see it, mystery is maintained for reasons that aren't always negative. Consider these: *It is a guise to make you more curious for knowledge about the masked stranger. You ever met someone you couldn't help but be excessively curious about? Sure you have. I'm sure it worked perfectly at drawing you in, making you ask questions. * Possibly the phantom holds himself in such high regard... that he only shows his form in all its splendor to those whom have earned it, and those who have proven themselves individuals of worth. Exclusivity... a challenge. We all like a challenge.



Unfortunately you can't tell right away. But without taking those chances, damn... the human race would've died out long ago. I thank those cavewomen who went out on a limb.



Those "biological incentives for etc." have yet to be discovered by me, if they do exist. Which they do not.



Ahhh, but you had that one comin'.



No big long story, but relate to me the outline of your heartbreak... but most of all, relate why you chose the men you did when you went against your intuition. By the way: I always urge a woman to go along with her intuition.



I was telling you what sort of men you like, and why you deny being drawn to them. I haven't started handing out ultimatums yet! But I always bring out admission in a woman... where she lets fall her facades and she opens up about not being happy, and not being content with her love life... it's a beautiful thing really. Message boards are kind of silly for that, though. But fun.



You're the villain here! I stopped you from brainwashing all these Aspie men. Now they actually have a chance of getting layed.

If we were total slaves to biology, contraception would not exist, period. Its very existence is hard proof that we are not entirely puppets, that we have some ability to make actual choices. Other highly 'unbiological' behaviours: homosexuality, adoption by fertile couples (and in fact, adoption of anybody not genetically related to you, even if you're infertile), making pretty much any kind of sacrifice for anyone you're not genetically related to and is not your sexual partner, anal and oral sex, refraining from rape in circumstances in which it could be committed with impunity, smoking, suicide, etc. Since plenty of people engage in these and similarly unbiological behaviours, I rest my case for us not being complete slaves to the selfish gene.

Oh, good. Then I shall.

Looks are supplement to personality. A girl will run off on a guy if the guy for other reasons than a change in hairstyle... unless it's a mohawk, then I can see immediate divorce.



You have no case. Humans are humans, of the same species, and we have the same brain blueprints. Some people are wired differently than others, as in autism. But that has nothing to do with the wiring I'm talking about.




I'm a healthy and hardened man. I knew enough about you to know you'd flaunt your insecurities by mistake. Now go back into hiding, spanked pup.

Slapping some statistics down on the table is silly. Scientists obviously are too busy (as am I for that matter) to run tests on every female on earth. Instead, open up to the happenings around you, recall your own relationships, ponder the relationships of others, and it's like a self-making puzzle that comes into place. That's not to say my assertions have no scientific standing. They do.



These forums are filled with Aspie women who the social world has forcefully descended down the social ladder, so they consciously look for men of their same level, while deep down gazing skyward for a mate.

You still haven't related your tragic love story. Answer some of my questions.



If some lunatic came along and denied that humans require oxygen, I'm sure you'd try to prove him wrong. He could apply your same thought process of "if everyone is so different why are you treating them all the same..." yet we know there's common ground in humans. There are differences, but also things we need naturally, like oxygen, or in the case we're on, a mate with predetermined components.

Good to hear.

You have no case. Humans are humans, of the same species, and we have the same brain blueprints. Some people are wired differently than others, as in autism. But that has nothing to do with the wiring I'm talking about.[/quote]

Yeahyeah I get it, I agree that we're animals first and people second. I disagree that 100%, 90%, or 80% are the same on the issues of what they need in a guy. Just suggesting that if we're wholly owned by our genes that maybe genes may be part of some of the outliers as well.




I still stand by what I said. When you talk about people, tell them who they are and what they're thinking, it goes to show that your not all there. I don't know what your doing whether its watching the Disney Channel naked or blowing lines of Exlax but none of that's really my business; just try not to run all over boards brand new, not survey the scene, and pretend you know everyone and what they're about right off the top.

What my intuition says is that you like your conversations one-sided and are entirely uninterested in my individuality. It doesn't look like it would be productive to continue responding to your claims in detail when they contradict what I know and you refuse to substantiate them.

Do you understand that you're essentially telling people that your own perception trumps all of our life experiences combined, on the basis of "because I say so"? Aspies tend to be picky about what information they'll swallow. The justifications you've supplied aren't meeting my standards.

People think a person has a few screws loose when there's no comprehension. You type like a redneck on acid. Don't try giving me your freak title. If you can't comprehend my train of thought, then that's your failure, and not my problem. Also, I'm a WrongPlanet veteran, so it's a lot of you who are newbies to me, even though I'm on a fresh account.

I backed my claims by suggesting you look around yourself. Use the mindset of what I've said, and actually stop and do a slow 360. Remember back when you went out with the men whom hurt you, the reasons you did so, and then think about other women you know that did the same things. And no, I'm not saying the hurtful men were the right men for you; but something about them was attractive, that wasn't a choice on your part. On the flipside of the coin, gwenevyn, you haven't substantiated your claims well. I remain... unmoved. Show me validity to your argument of not wanting/needing an Alpha Male.

Which has nothing to do with...any of this. ...unless you feel the need to try and undermine him using that sort of petty attack.

Comprehension and agreement aren't one and the same. Your train of thought is much easier to comprehend than you seem to believe. Or do you wish to say that nobody can know exactly what you're thinking? If that's the case, I'd like to know how you managed that same feat, if others aren't capable of it.

Another unsubstantiated claim. Care to back that up? Or are you evading a ban?

Then you haven't backed your claims. You've made a suggestion. It is easy to make a claim and tell others to look for the evidence. After all, if they can't find it, then that's obviously their fault, right?