Serious issues with L&D Forum

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androbot01
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07 May 2016, 4:02 pm

marshall wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
alex wrote:
One problem that hasn't been discussed is bad advice. I've noticed some well-intentioned but bad advice on the forums. I've been contemplating creating a guide for guys who want to get into a relationship and turning it into a sticky.

I think this is a terrible idea. Not only because it is impossible to give appropriate advice without knowing someone in real life, but more importantly, because it promotes the misconception that "the one" is attainable by modification of behaviour. This is a false path and will lead to frustration.
I really get sick of this idea that love and relationships are a rightful reward for "proper" behaviour. A partner may or may not come along. Modifying yourself to attain a relationship is a bad plan.
Changing for yourself is far more productive.

I don't see how you can deny that some people do in fact judge others on trivial first-impressions. I'm sorry if this doesn't apply to your ideal of how finding love should work, but the reality is many people are superficial, even if they aren't consciously aware of it. Because of this, people in the dating world do have to advertise themselves to some degree. If you tell people on the autism spectrum that modifying behaviors that are obvious turnoffs is futile, then you're basically telling them to give up on dating period. That always seems to be your agenda.

I did not say that people don't judge others on trivial first impressions. And I don't have an agenda. I just think it's a waste of time to try to fit some dating "model" in the hopes of attaining a partner. It's disingenuous.



Fnord
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07 May 2016, 4:20 pm

alex wrote:
... One problem that hasn't been discussed is bad advice. I've noticed some well-intentioned but bad advice on the forums. I've been contemplating creating a guide for guys who want to get into a relationship and turning it into a sticky.
"An Aspie's Guide to Dating" would be useful for men and women if it covers the basics of appropriate behavior, clothing, courtesy and manners, customs, and personal grooming and hygiene. Chapters on "Asking or Being Asked for a Date", "Pre-Date Preparations", "Activities and Venues", "Small Talk", and "Expressing Gratitude" would be helpful.

Chapters that list common variations for various cultures (African, Asian, et cetera) may also be helpful.



sly279
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07 May 2016, 4:21 pm

marshall wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
^ Was is to 'get a gf' or 'have a gf? '
I think I have seen the drama twice over each of these two (very common) english expression (have/ger a bf/gf); and if not mistaken it was by the same people.

On the other hand, real woman-hating threads are not accepted by anyone here.
There's no real woman hating problem here, this is not the puahate forum, and it never was.

Concrete example:
There was a guy who posted a thread about theatening and killing his girlfriend.

No one of the male respondents could digest his post, as any sane person wouldn't; and some of those guys had been acccused once for misogyny/sexism, often so unfairly.

Hell, even kraftie, the most gentleman around here had been called sexist/misogynst once or so.

It is crystal clear, those drama makers hate men, they want to demonize men and they are unable to accept any differred opinion coming from a man unless it is about putting them on a worship pedestal while praying "O you are always right, O you are always right".

Let's make a stand, good men, let's ingore those ones, let's stop giving their words any undeserved value. :ninja:

Who is with me?

Besides the venting that gets taken the wrong way, I do occasionally see guys posting "red pill" stuff that I have a hard time not seeing as misogynst.

I've never been on or know what red pill is. I thought it was a matrix reference.

Also never been on a PUA site or agree with how they see or treat women from what others have told me.



The_Face_of_Boo
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07 May 2016, 5:08 pm

marshall wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
^ Was is to 'get a gf' or 'have a gf? '
I think I have seen the drama twice over each of these two (very common) english expression (have/ger a bf/gf); and if not mistaken it was by the same people.

On the other hand, real woman-hating threads are not accepted by anyone here.
There's no real woman hating problem here, this is not the puahate forum, and it never was.

Concrete example:
There was a guy who posted a thread about theatening and killing his girlfriend.

No one of the male respondents could digest his post, as any sane person wouldn't; and some of those guys had been acccused once for misogyny/sexism, often so unfairly.

Hell, even kraftie, the most gentleman around here had been called sexist/misogynst once or so.

It is crystal clear, those drama makers hate men, they want to demonize men and they are unable to accept any differred opinion coming from a man unless it is about putting them on a worship pedestal while praying "O you are always right, O you are always right".

Let's make a stand, good men, let's ingore those ones, let's stop giving their words any undeserved value. :ninja:

Who is with me?

Besides the venting that gets taken the wrong way, I do occasionally see guys posting "red pill" stuff that I have a hard time not seeing as misogynst.


Those get warned, their threads get locked and aren't widely accepted here. Those are usually done by newcomer users with very low counts....they usually don't last long.



0_equals_true
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07 May 2016, 5:19 pm

The thing is with red pill, is it isn't even a metaphor it is a symbol in the film.

It is a lot simpler to say they are realists but most of the time they aren't. It is pseudo-profound.



The_Face_of_Boo
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07 May 2016, 5:24 pm

I take of these, what that makes me?
Image



0_equals_true
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07 May 2016, 5:29 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
I take of these, what that makes me?
Image

boo you need to eat actual cod liver

Image

That makes you hard core.



The_Face_of_Boo
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07 May 2016, 5:32 pm

I have never seen them before, 2500% vitmain D, impressive! will have to check the supermarket next time.



Fnord
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07 May 2016, 6:43 pm

From the WebMD website:

WebMD wrote:
"Too much vitamin D can cause an abnormally high blood calcium level, which could result in nausea, constipation, confusion, abnormal heart rhythm, and even kidney stones."
Source: http://www.webmd.com/osteoporosis/featu ... -vitamin-d



Kiprobalhato
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07 May 2016, 7:34 pm

while we're on the topic of the forum, can we add the page number thing to the bottom of the page again? :?

scrolling down to browse a subforum and having to scroll back up to get to the previous or next page gets annoying quickly.


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הייתי צוללת עכשיו למים
הכי, הכי עמוקים
לא לשמוע כלום
לא לדעת כלום
וזה הכל אהובי, זה הכל.


Astro77
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07 May 2016, 7:36 pm

I think this subforum should mostly be about getting and giving advice pertaining to romantic relationships. Sometimes someone will reply and try to make the topic about themselves, but for the most part, those kinds of threads are fine. I'd also say some of the threads asking if something was acceptable or normal are fine. Same with threads asking for people to talk about their experiences with things or situations.

It's the other kinds of threads where things can unravel. Most of those threads, even if they pertain to love and dating, belong in other subforums. The rants don't belong here at all. If someone is venting about something that happened or their current state of affairs, then it should probably go in the Haven. They're probably just looking to blow off steam or are looking for some positive emotional support. If they're looking to have a discussion about behaviors or characteristics, then I think it should probably go in PPR. Threads that are basically asking "Why do women/men do this?" or "Why are men/women like this?". I'd also add threads that are either stating or implying things like "Online dating is a scam/no good." or "Men/women only want ____."

Tl;dr: Love and Dating should mostly be about advice, support and encouragement, not about debating or venting.



sly279
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07 May 2016, 8:20 pm

If you did thst there be very very few threads in l&d.



YippySkippy
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07 May 2016, 9:44 pm

Quote:
It's the other kinds of threads where things can unravel. Most of those threads, even if they pertain to love and dating, belong in other subforums. The rants don't belong here at all. If someone is venting about something that happened or their current state of affairs, then it should probably go in the Haven. They're probably just looking to blow off steam or are looking for some positive emotional support. If they're looking to have a discussion about behaviors or characteristics, then I think it should probably go in PPR. Threads that are basically asking "Why do women/men do this?" or "Why are men/women like this?". I'd also add threads that are either stating or implying things like "Online dating is a scam/no good." or "Men/women only want ____."


I agree with this.



B19
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07 May 2016, 10:02 pm

I will toss this into the brainstorm another possibility:

Two L and D subforums, one for men and one for women. That would not mean that the rules don't apply to either. Both would need a matching set of guiding principles - a total ban on posts that make sexist pejorative statements to the effect that "all men are.." or all women are.." and no posting of categorical sexist supremacist statements like "men are naturally better at thinking" (this kind of blanket statements has hidden intimidation power, implying men's thoughts are more valid than womens) - these kinds of statements are loaded with baggage and of course they will be divisive. The same standards, rules and conventions would need to apply equally to both sub forums. Men could discuss topics raised in the womens forum on the men's forum and vice versa, within the parameters of civil communication. PMs offer a venue for discourse beyond that for debate between members on issues they wish to explore outside the two subforums.

A lot of the past conflict has issued from the regrettable fact that some men tend to automatically devalue women's statements and even their right to express them, and vice versa.

I question the assertion earlier in the thread that WP could never be made safer for members. It can potentially be made unsafer or safer depending on whether we develop strategies to implement principles that regulate forum content and perhaps also structure. It's not rocket science. Where there is a will there is a way (if there's good will) and where there isn't a will then there isn't a way because then a spirit of illwill invades to corrupt the discourse.



hurtloam
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08 May 2016, 12:31 am

sly279 wrote:
If you did thst there be very very few threads in l&d.


What does that matter? There are fewer threads in most of the subforums because people only post on topic. More isn't always better.



The_Face_of_Boo
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08 May 2016, 1:53 am

But venting or ranting about difficulties related to love, dating or a relationship is a love topic, those don't necessarily include "women are...".

What is this nonsense?