Blog post on the epidemic of forced celibacy in males

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HopeGrows
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16 Sep 2010, 11:27 pm

BPalmer wrote:

HopeGrows wrote:

Really? Every woman wants someone who will beat them?

I didn't say that. But enough of them do (especially underclass ones), that males who are more likely to treat them with respect are being left to rot.

Dude, please stop. Stereotyping is not going to change your situation, and it kind of lowers the level of discourse. A man's ability to treat a woman with respect is not necessarily something that can be determined in a chance meeting, or at a nightclub....or really, outside of the context of a relationship. There are lots of steps you have to get through before you get to proving that you're a solid, respectful guy within the context of a relationship. Getting through those steps, IMO, is what you need to focus on now.

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HopeGrows
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16 Sep 2010, 11:31 pm

Nostromos wrote:

It took a long time to process it, I meant. Much better now, happier.

Awesome. Maybe you could think about sharing what that process was like (at some point). Not talking about nitty-gritty personal details, but more about the courage, motivation, determination, etc., that it took to take on the task of processing the rage.

So, it is awesome that you've taken steps to repair the damage caused by your forays into the world of dating, etc. I still want to challenge you to take stock of your current situation, and show some more of that fearlessness and start making some changes in your approach.

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Nostromos
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16 Sep 2010, 11:34 pm

I've considered posting a video. Good Lord, it'll be pathetic.

BPalmer
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16 Sep 2010, 11:38 pm

HopeGrows wrote:

Stereotyping is not going to change your situation, and it kind of lowers the level of discourse.

Well, from what I see around me (in the hellhole of a "city" I'm stuck in), people are quite eager to live according to stereotypes. For not being willing or able to fit into everyone's neat little stereotypes, I've been treated like some sort of sideshow freak. Just for the record, I'm married these days, but it can't do anything to erase the damage that has already been done. Just because Aspies by nature have an abnormality does not mean everything in our lives should be abnormal.

HopeGrows
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16 Sep 2010, 11:53 pm

BPalmer wrote:

HopeGrows wrote:

Stereotyping is not going to change your situation, and it kind of lowers the level of discourse.

Well, from what I see around me (in the hellhole of a "city" I'm stuck in), people are quite eager to live according to stereotypes. For not being willing or able to fit into everyone's neat little stereotypes, I've been treated like some sort of sideshow freak. Just for the record, I'm married these days, but it can't do anything to erase the damage that has already been done. Just because Aspies by nature have an abnormality does not mean everything in our lives should be abnormal.

Absolutely agree. A good relationship (assuming your marriage is good) will not heal the damage from past relationships/interactions. If anything, the damage from past relationships will negatively affect the good relationship.

Each person has to work on resolving those issues him/herself. Honestly, as much as a woman can love a man (and vice versa), it is impossible for one person to heal another's emotional/psychological damage. But it is possible to heal. You won't necessarily be all shiny and new - but you can be whole again. I think each person has to come to a very deep, profound realization that holding onto the pain, rage, dysfunction, etc. of past disappointments and injuries just doesn't serve them any longer. And for better or worse, each person has to follow their own path to get to that realization (and some, like Sodini, never do).

And I wholeheartedly agree that everything in an Aspie's life doesn't have to be abnormal. Unfortunately, emotional/psychological damage is an equal opportunity destroyer....everyone can experience it - regardless of neural status. By the same token, each person - regardless of neural status - can refuse to allow that kind of damage to define his/her life.

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HopeGrows
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16 Sep 2010, 11:54 pm

Nostromos wrote:

I've considered posting a video. Good Lord, it'll be pathetic.

It could help a lot of people.

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BPalmer
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17 Sep 2010, 12:04 am

Another thing too, is that it's gut-wrenching to see so many other males have to go through years (and often their entire life) of rejection and forced celibacy. It's very damaging, and shouldn't be trivialised.

HopeGrows
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17 Sep 2010, 12:18 am

BPalmer wrote:

I'm certainly not trivializing it. I'm trying to raise the point that a person can let rage consume him/her - or not. Lots of people have lots of reasons to be angry: child abuse, sexual abuse, physical abuse....there's all kinds of abuse out there. Being unwanted (and there are lots of ways to be unwanted), ostracized, bullied, etc., is devastating. I do get the sense that a lot of posters believe the solution lies in changing the paradigm - and I don't think that's realistic. (I'm not even going to address whether the paradigm should change or not. I mean...would we all like to live in a world that really did judge us based on the content of our character? Hell yeah. But that's not the world we live in.)

IMO, it's reasonable to be angry at the paradigm. I just don't believe it's reasonable to let that anger poison you. To me it becomes a question of practicality....is anger at the paradigm solving the problem? No. Then what will solve the problem? IMO, the solution lies in redefining one's role in the paradigm. I'm not trying to be flip - I'm trying to be blunt. We can each choose to make an avocation out of our disappointment, or we can figure out how to start over, how to try something completely different.

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BPalmer
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17 Sep 2010, 12:32 am

HopeGrows wrote:

I'm certainly not trivializing it.

Oh, I wasn't saying you were, but many people can, if they haven't had to experience that sort of thing themselves. That being said, I cannot know what it's like to be someone who's undergoing treatment for cancer, or whose husband has died unexpectedly (both having happened recently to people I know). Such things must be even worse! But at the same time, being without mutual sexual attraction etc does take more of a toll on a lot of us than many may realise, especially since it's a taboo subject for some reason (whilst sexual matter of various stripes, and in copious amounts of detail, isn't anymore!).

Nostromos
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17 Sep 2010, 1:12 am

Quote:

I have to say I am genuinely shocked that anyone would think that not being able to get sex is on a par with being raped.

I have to say I'm genuinely shocked that most people enjoy the music of the Black Eyed Peas.

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17 Sep 2010, 1:15 am

It's not celibacy, it's just a pathetic anger of not getting a porn-lookalike woman in bed. It's about wanting, but not getting casual sex.

Bethie
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17 Sep 2010, 12:41 pm

Nostromos wrote:

Y'know something, even if it universally does, I would still defend it as I would be in jail or dead now without them.

Kind of like how millions of PROSTITUTES end up in jail or dead?
But who gives a f**k about them, so long as you can get off, right?

Please don't tell me you're saying you'd choose to RAPE someone if you didn't have access to a woman's body periodically.

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Dox47
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17 Sep 2010, 1:03 pm

Bethie wrote:

Kind of like how millions of PROSTITUTES end up in jail or dead?

Legalizing would do more to help them than any other single thing; in some countries that have legalized they even have unions and sick leave, plus all the protections that come with any other job. You can't stop desperate people from doing desperate things, but you can make those things much safer and less exploitative.

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Lonermutant
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17 Sep 2010, 1:08 pm

Dox47 wrote:

Bethie wrote:

Kind of like how millions of PROSTITUTES end up in jail or dead?

95% of prostitutes in Europe are still east-european or african sex slaves.

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17 Sep 2010, 3:53 pm

Lonermutant wrote:

95% of prostitutes in Europe are still east-european or african sex slaves.

Even if I were to take that statement at face value, what does it prove one way or the other? Prostitution is already illegal and stigmatized, legalization and the resulting regulation would be invaluable in weeding out human traffickers, since if nothing else they'd have an unfair advantage and would be bad for business. No one cares right now because there's no money in it for them, make it an above board business and that all would change.

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Sallamandrina
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17 Sep 2010, 4:13 pm

^
And you shouldn't as it's a gross generalisation. Plus, prostitution in not exactly legal all over Europe - off the top of my head only Austria, Germany, Netherlands, Switzerland, Greece, Hungary and Latvia and legalised it. In quite a few others it's legal to sell sex but not to buy. Prostitution will probably be around forever - regulating it is the sensible thing to do.

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