More Thought on Incels.

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I meant try to keep getting, as in try to keep getting dates, hoping that he will find success.

I'm in Continental European dating culture, which means you socialize in mixed circles and friendship-first is the most prevalent approach. So, I'd say - keep meeting people and hone valuable friendships.

Trying to get a date or not, getting care of other aspects of one's life makes one's life happier. It's so much easier to be happy with another person when you are happy yourself first.

He's not an incel. If he gives up it's voluntary celibacy.

i would beg to differ about the voluntary celibacy part, when i realized nothing was going to happen i said to hell with it, that doesn't mean i volunteered for it, it just means i faced reality just like a person who can't swim faces reality when he is dog tired from dog-paddling and just can't go anymore. i was fit and attractive like roger was when i was his age, that didn't help me just as it didn't help him. i didn't have any female friends or even acquaintances until i was in my 50s and then that was purely an accident of belated good luck and not traceable to any change in my personality and physicality. not until i found an aspie meetup group in the september of my years did things improve for me. it is just a numbers game with many of us aspie outliers, a lot more time must elapse before our number comes up, before we find somebody on our wavelength who groks us.

This is the same as Australia. The challenge for the young men here on WP is breaking the ice in joining these friendship groups.

One thing to keep in mind is that its really hard to approach a group of friends sitting together at a bar and tty and chat to one of them. Put aside being an Aspie, for any male it is terrifying to walk up to and talk to a girl who is sitting with her female/male friends.

I read about single girls going to bars never getting men hitting on them. I think this is misrepresenting, I have been to many bars over the years in Australia and I have never in all my years seen a girl sit by herself. Single girls always go in groups to bars or restaurants.

No. He still has the desire and still wants to meet someone. He's just given up hope. He doesn't see the point in persuing it anymore. I'm the same. There's no point. I was just constantly hitting walls and it was making me miserable. I spend my energy on things I actually enjoy now.

Well, I think my bro needs to find someone who is autistic or at least at his level mentally, in order for a woman to accept him. Not sure if the same thing would also help most incel men as well.

I've had most of my luck from online contacts going over to real life meet ups.

I think another problem for autistic people in general is to make sure a relationship is about themselves and not their "stuff". A lot of the women I've met over the years only loved me as far as a full tank could take them in the car.

If your car, wallet or anything else materialistic is getting more action than you are then it's time to call them out on it.

It's been such an issue in the past for me that women have to touch me before touching my "stuff" now. If they don't it's a huge red flag.

Yup, I get that. I for example, could not build a life with a raging extrovert NT.

It's difficult to meet people on the same level of you're not typical.

That's why the internet has worked for a lot of aspies. We need to spread a wider net. I'm scared of getting conned personally, but it has worked for others.

Oh okay. A lot of people on here talk about the problem being introversion vs. extroversion, but I thought that the problem for aspies was finding someone at their maturity or IQ level, if aspies have a lower maturity or IQ than NTs, rather than extroversion, unless I am wrong?

The problem is manifold:

1. Aspies seeking shortcuts to emotional or sexual intimacy.
2. Aspies seeking personal validation from being in relationships.
3. Aspies seeking formulas that will guaranty emotional or sexual intimacy.
4. Aspies seeking emotional and/or sexual intimacy before developing friendships.
5. Aspies over-thinking their relationship status (or lack thereof) to the point of obsession.
6. Aspies spending more time arguing about relationships than they do on self-improvement.
7. Aspies questioning every piece of advice or knowledge that would help them find a relationship.
8. Aspies hoping that being in an emotionally or sexually intimate relationship will solve all their problems.

Yeah. You pretty much covered all aspies. I think the most an aspie can do is be their best selves. Obsessing over any one of the points you made to the determent of ones own person development will usually end in failure. Sadly aspies have a tendency to be obsessively nit-picky and have a lot of time to do so.

I had this one female aspie who was completely vested in getting a boyfriend and would ask every single man she came across to buddy up with her including me several times over a number of years. She even posted on Facebook asking who a man she met on a train was, despite her friends obviously having no idea the name of said random man they never seen in person. She spent so much effort trying to get a boyfriend she neglected her development entirely and her lifestyle at the age of 32 was nothing to be impressed by.

I'm not the best for advice on avoiding being an incel. I've not been incredibly successful myself but even I've managed to get some tail from time to time (even without paying amazingly). Over the years I've discovered that being a basement dwelling, obsessive weirdo who spends ten times more effort into getting tail than getting a job actually results in considerably more celibacy. This applies irrespective of autism.

Well would it help if aspies do seek shortcuts to sex, and forget about emotionally intimacy at first? Like will just sex help build confidence at first and help take some of the anxiety off, because sex is easier to get than dating at first?

if this aspie when young, only had access to either a house of sex, or a good sex doll, it would have blunted the sharp edges off of my social ineptitude and loneliness. i would be considerably less warped than i am at this point. i'm just too old and born too early for some of the improvements of this age. it would not have made me what i was not born to be [socially intelligent with good TOM] but it would have made me considerably happier and feeling less defective. i wonder what the stats are for angry incels in countries with regulated legal sex work versus amuuurica? i wonder also if the violent religious fundies of whatever stripe would be quite as angry if only they had been able to get some from legal sex work?

My take is very LITERAL. An incel is anyone who is involuntary celibate. In this very thread, we have women and older men who, by definition and self-realization, are involuntary celibate, aka INCEL, regardless of their personal beliefs and world view. A rose by any other name. They are incel simply because of their lot in life.

This is why I'm disturbed by the whole redefinition of incel: Any young man who commits violent crimes, regardless of sexual status and self-identity, and lot in life.

I've seen people misappropriate the Autism/Aspeger's label to people who commit crimes, whether Aspies or not. I don't like seeing any label misappropriated. This is what I was trying to convey to cyberdad.

So, what is your conclusion?