Another question for the women...

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Except how would I go about achieving this? I can't exactly bring a third person to a date now, can i?


Are there more people like you?

This is exactly what I was told. The man I'm involved with said it would take months in his presence to feel anything romantic toward me, and we've discussed the fact that I don't have consecutive months to give him since we live on different continents. So, we're just kind of doing the best we can.



Well, we've been talking for over a year, and won't be able to even think about seeing one another until May of 2010. I think that qualifies as patient.

No, you can't bring a third person on a date. But you aren't on a date...yet. That doesn't happen until AFTER you find out that the woman you are friends with and attracted to is also attracted to you. I am not advising you to bring a third wheel on a date. I am advising you to get a male friend to watch you and your female friend(s) in non-date situations. You said you make friends easily but have been unable to get out of the friend zone with any women. I am guessing (may be wrong) that there are situations where you are with a group of friends, both male and female: at a barbecue, restaurant (where you are all eating together, not a date), at somebody's house watching TV, at some sort of event that has to do with your special interest. It is in one of these group situations that you would ask a male friend to decode your women friends' body language for you.

For some reason, asking women seems to change the outcome. This is because when they say no in order to not sound corny, I actually feel a lot less confident. The question we need to be asking is how to remain calm when you're trying to interpret what she's saying while being constantly evaluated. That sense of being put on the spot is hard to address, but that's what the real problem is if you ask me. Everyone here seems to have a solid comprehension of everything else.

One thing I do know is that it's better to move forward on your own (if you think she likes you). I start out slow (brushing fingertips to hand or something like that). One time I thought a girl liked me and I tried to make out. She turned me down, I just blamed the alcohol.

Afterwards, I stayed cool with her, she was glad to have someone to talk to and I could spend the rest of our friendship playing the whole thing off. I told her that I was a pig and that I tended to use people, then I just acted like I wasn't attracted to her anymore. That's how I handle a failure anyway.

One side note about body language and all that: Does it mean anything if a woman clutches the center of her chest (usually just below the voicebox), or am I just reading too far into something that doesn't mean anything? That's about the one non-verbal item that I actually occasionally pick up on...

I never tried the non-verbal thing because I don't understand it and I'm an aspie. It is completely ridiculous to continue non-verbal communication when its not getting anywhere, but most women make the mistake of giving up. They should just verbalize. Aspie guys if you arent aware of nonverbal stuff, just ask the girl you like if she likes you...problem solved. if she says no she's either lying or isnt interested. if she's interested and say no, then she's lying, and may possibly verbalize it in the future. if she cant find a way to verbalize things after you have verbalized it, then drop her, her loss.

It seems like a powerful emotional response to me, I can't say which emotion. She could've been shocked, or just touched (did she hear something heart-warming or shocking?)

Did she do it suddenly or slowly? Suddenly conveys more meaning, slowly may mean she did it to match the social context (not as sincere).

What really matters is where her eyes were looking.

Well, to put things in proper context, there was this woman I asked out a long time ago (in fact, the first I asked out)... while I was swiftly rejected, we were both able to laugh about it later and became friends... While we wouldn't be compatible in a relationship, there's still an awkward bit of mutual attraction left over from that, and so we still flirt with each other sometimes... and it's often when I say something that gives her an "awwwww" moment that she does that very hand motion (she's the person that I keep noticing doing that)... it's definitely quite sudden when it happens...


To be honest, I hadn't really paid attention to that. My guess would be that sometimes they were looking off in the distance, sometimes she would be looking at me (especially when she was just talking to me)...

I'll give it a shot, although it's hard to be certain without seeing it. If by an "awwwwww" moment you mean a heartfelt moment (like seeing a really cute kitten), she'd like to do a hand-to-the-heart gesture. However, her heart is right under her breast and she doesn't want to do anything that could look too sexual so she moves her hand north for the hand-to-heart gesture. I've seen men grab their chests right over their hearts to show "that got me right here, that got me in the heart" but since men don't have breasts, the gesture can safely stay right over the heart without being misconstrued.

If by an "awwwww" moment you mean shock and surprise in a bad way ("your aunt got hit by a car? that's terrible!") it is meant to convey tension and that she agrees that this is terrible, whatever it is.

Yeah this type of reaction is what I was going for... although it's often in response to me complimenting her on something (and not just something superficial like a particular body part, we're talking about something pertaining to her personality)...

But the thing I really want to know is, as this is one of the only non-verbal cues that I actually pick up on, how should I react to it?

If this is in reaction to a compliment about her as a person, then it most likely is a modification of the hand-to-my-heart gesture. If smiles come naturally to you, then smile.

I can think of two messages meant by this hand-to-the-heart gesture (I am assuming she relocated it to somewhat away from her heart just so she won't awkwardly grab her own breast). One is optimistic and one is pessimistic.

Optimistic message: "you are such a sweet guy to say that. It really goes straight to my heart. If only it could work out between us. If only if only if only" (I have no idea what the "if only" would be hanging on- I'm winging this from 2 paragraphs of text).

Pessimistic message: "you are such a sweet guy to say that. It really goes straight to my heart. It's a darn shame you're not my physical type because there is nothing I can do about who I'm attracted to. Oh well."

Without seeing this in action it's hard to tell. But it does sound like a modification of hand-to-my-heart. It's a non-verbal of saying she has taken the compliment "to heart". A small smile would be good. Not a Cheshire Cat grin, just a small smile.

A third question... The basic premise is that my desires are not the same as most other people in society these days... I desire companionship to a far greater degree than sex. I'm by no means asexual, far from it... but when searching for a woman, the idea of sex barely crosses my mind, while my mind is concentrated mostly on the companionship aspect...

Could this be interfering with my ability to find women that like me? Sexual attraction is often based in easily identifiable physical attributes, and thus easier to evaluate quickly, while the personal compatibility can only truly be determined through a more detailed examination that takes more time... it certainly would make sense, but then again I could just be grasping at false leads...

It would certainly explain why you are stuck in the friend zone. What is companionship without a sexual vibe? Friendship. So when you do match up, the woman will most likely be low libido. There are many, many low libido women out there. This is very do-able.

you guys all need PUA

if i was seeing a girl, i would have to be flirty and sexual right away FROM THE START if it was ever gonna happen. i couldnt be buddies first and then go from that to physcial. im sure its great for those who can, but i just couldnt, its too weird.

It's not that I have a low libido. Far from it. What I do see alot in the folks around me, however, is sex destroying relationships... perfectly fine relationships that start going down the tubes when the couple involved start having sex... I don't want to finally succeed only to have the relationship fail right then and there because we ended up rushing into sex... The sexual needs I can fulfill myself, but the emotional needs I absolutely need someone else...


Well, if I know that there's a mutual attraction (and I'm in a comfortable enough situation), I have no problem being flirty. Problem is, I don't get attracted to women right off the bat...