Male/Female emotional core and my own experiences

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techstepgenr8tion
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10 Dec 2009, 3:28 am

biostructure wrote:
Tori Amos sings beautifully, and I think her style is one of the most feminine I've heard. And very distinctive too--I like to think of it as a "rural" style because it evokes the sense of the country but is absolutely not "country" in the redneck cowboy sense.


It depends on what I'm hearing, with stuff like this though I tend to liken it back to trip hop - ie. Massive Attack, Archive, Tricky, etc.. Its partly the deeper jazz edges. I kind of actually think Sleep to Dream by Fiona is something like an example of U.S. trip-hop, we just haven't had anything much of the like since.

biostructure wrote:
And back to the thing of epic, in my case at least the "epic" is no less contemplative than any other state of mind, it's just more ambitious. I get in this frame where I feel like I'm capable of understanding the whole world--like I am above everything. Not literally like I understand everything--because believe me, just in my area of biology there are so many things I don't know--but it's a feeling that the world fundamentally makes sense, that I potentially could understand it. And not just in an intellectual way, but just that there's such a clear feeling of purpose to it all.


Yeah, it can go hand in hand with idealism. Ambition to fix the world and, once you realize that's a bit of an incorrigible target exploring the human psyche, exploring your own mind, etc.

biostructure wrote:
The downside of that feeling, if there is one, is that it isn't conducive to dealing with the matter-of-fact, sometimes "dirty" parts of reality. If you spend all your time looking at the horizon (figuratively), you may never get there. And, I'm thinking this may be at least some of the reason women are less prone to that, because they often feel they can't. In other words, there are many cases in life where women are "behind the scenes" helping facilitate with the more low-level things as others plan out the big picture, but fewer men are in this role, so generally a more ambitious atmosphere helps men "rise" more than women. Just a theory of course.


I think its also fundamentally a difference between single focus and difuse awareness. Single focus means that you can spend much of your time giving reality the thousand yard stare but, maintaining a hectic environment or juggling five tasks at once would be brutal. Women are just that - supreme multitaskers to where its not even multitasking but constant awareness of what's around them. I think this is also an example of just how restrictive and tight a limit of 3 pounds of brain really is for us - to have one thing really does seem to steal from another area, we see it in the sexes, we see it in peer groups, everyone seems to have a shortcoming or several to match their strengths.

biostructure wrote:
Interestingly, this thread also ties in with the thread I posted in the other forum about grad school. I'm used to thinking about science in a rather ambitious, "epic" way, in other words trying to visualize huge, complex systems as wholes and trying to wrap my brain around the fascinating complexity of it all. However, now that I've joined a lab it really hits home how many months or even years it takes to decipher even something relatively basic. It makes me realize that I will need to save the more ambitious thinking for my spare time, and in the lab learn to take more pride in the little accomplishments.


There's the complexity barrier but there's also the limit of mental fatigue. Even with my job right now - lots of multitasking, lots of juggling tasks (and even different clients), it drains me a lot to where sometimes I think it even impacts my ability to learn a bit. True, its going a lot better than I first started but still, I almost have to grab a whole system of thought at once to be able to use it and many concepts that I'm running into on the job are still things that are on their way to hitting that critical mass of osmosis-learning but aren't quite there yet.



Magnus
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10 Dec 2009, 3:54 am

It's not too late. As long as you are alive and have a strong desire to conquer this, you will. I know you will get past this neurosis, otherwise I wouldn't have invested so much time in this.

I just want to veer off the subject for a brief moment. The other day I was reading a thread that a female wrote about a male boss she works with. This man, she complained, was perverted and would often leer at women with an erection. She was wondering if he was an aspie because of other traits in which she went on to describe in him. The other posters went on to ridicule the man as would be expected. I wonder what this man would do if he suddenly came to the realization of how he appeared to others. I suspect that he was oblivious as to how he presented himself, but I couldn't believe that he didn't feel their admonishment on some intuitive level. I mean, how can they come out and say what they think? How could he not get a sense that something was not right with how people treated him at work? I'm sure he had no clue or else he would avert his eyes and be sure to wear long shirts to cover his trousers. This man is no different from other men in sexual receptiveness. Most males are easily aroused, but most of them know how to disguise it. Now, by no means am I suggesting that you are like this man, but I think you may have felt the same amount of social intolerance as he had.

At least you are aware of how you come off to people, but you went way overboard and are way too hard on yourself. How do you reprogram your brain now and redeem yourself in your own eyes? I'll tell you this and you can take it as a fact, there is nothing wrong with you and many females are way different than those girls from your youth. You are not the same person as you were back then. So, how do you become the man you want to be? First, imagine who you want to be. You can reprogram your brain through hypnosis. It will be as challenging as a fat person who wants to be slim but with enough determination and faith, it's possible to kick this neurosis. I look at your problem and it seems like such an easy fix. Get a girlfriend, be happy, have the life you want. You are very smart, kind, and interesting. The feminine side is cool, many women your age will really like it. It's easy for me to say that you can get over this because I see that it is all in your head. You have a negative imprint when it comes to love and dating. Gosh, I wish I had your problem instead of my own.


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biostructure
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10 Dec 2009, 2:27 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
biostructure wrote:
The downside of that feeling, if there is one, is that it isn't conducive to dealing with the matter-of-fact, sometimes "dirty" parts of reality. If you spend all your time looking at the horizon (figuratively), you may never get there. And, I'm thinking this may be at least some of the reason women are less prone to that, because they often feel they can't. In other words, there are many cases in life where women are "behind the scenes" helping facilitate with the more low-level things as others plan out the big picture, but fewer men are in this role, so generally a more ambitious atmosphere helps men "rise" more than women. Just a theory of course.


I think its also fundamentally a difference between single focus and difuse awareness. Single focus means that you can spend much of your time giving reality the thousand yard stare but, maintaining a hectic environment or juggling five tasks at once would be brutal. Women are just that - supreme multitaskers to where its not even multitasking but constant awareness of what's around them. I think this is also an example of just how restrictive and tight a limit of 3 pounds of brain really is for us - to have one thing really does seem to steal from another area, we see it in the sexes, we see it in peer groups, everyone seems to have a shortcoming or several to match their strengths.


That's definitely true too. So have you ever met females who seem to have a male emotional core and vice versa?



techstepgenr8tion
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10 Dec 2009, 8:34 pm

biostructure wrote:
That's definitely true too. So have you ever met females who seem to have a male emotional core and vice versa?


Yeah but its funny, I've seen that in quite a few cases where they didn't pay for it in loss of femininity (in the case of women) or outward masculinity in the case of guys - it was more wiring and thought process thing than a dominant/submissive angle to things.



techstepgenr8tion
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10 Dec 2009, 8:47 pm

Magnus wrote:
I just want to veer off the subject for a brief moment. The other day I was reading a thread that a female wrote about a male boss she works with. This man, she complained, was perverted and would often leer at women with an erection. She was wondering if he was an aspie because of other traits in which she went on to describe in him. The other posters went on to ridicule the man as would be expected. I wonder what this man would do if he suddenly came to the realization of how he appeared to others. I suspect that he was oblivious as to how he presented himself, but I couldn't believe that he didn't feel their admonishment on some intuitive level. I mean, how can they come out and say what they think? How could he not get a sense that something was not right with how people treated him at work? I'm sure he had no clue or else he would avert his eyes and be sure to wear long shirts to cover his trousers. This man is no different from other men in sexual receptiveness. Most males are easily aroused, but most of them know how to disguise it. Now, by no means am I suggesting that you are like this man, but I think you may have felt the same amount of social intolerance as he had.

The funny thing about me, no matter how grim my mind might even go sometimes - I have a natural smile to my eyes that doesn't go away, I think that's fed into things a lot historically and just looking a bit gangly, awkward, taking in my surroundings (partly because I'm mapping them when I go from point A to point B) - the worst part is I could be taking a girl in visually in the sense of trying to scope her personality but could easily have that bright-eyed ten year old "Oh my god! A girl! A girl!" kind of look - which I have to agree is obsequious enough in appearance to make someone - particularly the person who thinks they're getting that attention - throw up in their mouth a little. Its part of why I really try to go out of my way not to even look at women much - extremely difficult not to make eye contact and have them read in a superiority, partly them on the take and partly me with a facial set where, especially when I'm overloaded, neither does me any favors nor gives me fair representation as a human being or communicatively even.
Magnus wrote:
So, how do you become the man you want to be? First, imagine who you want to be. You can reprogram your brain through hypnosis.

Actually, in every internal sense - I already am the man I want to be, I like who I am and what I'm about at the core, its really about trying to adapt out some of the issues that I'm still dealing with as in that I still want to smooth my life out and get more normal reactions from people to actually have the realistic firm/solid ground to build more social confidence when I'm out and about without my friends there as social proof to negate what people instictively tend to think.
Magnus wrote:
It will be as challenging as a fat person who wants to be slim but with enough determination and faith, it's possible to kick this neurosis. I look at your problem and it seems like such an easy fix. Get a girlfriend, be happy, have the life you want. You are very smart, kind, and interesting. The feminine side is cool, many women your age will really like it. It's easy for me to say that you can get over this because I see that it is all in your head. You have a negative imprint when it comes to love and dating. Gosh, I wish I had your problem instead of my own.

Hey, neither of us lives in a van down by the river either - lets toast to that! :)



biostructure
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11 Dec 2009, 2:26 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
biostructure wrote:
That's definitely true too. So have you ever met females who seem to have a male emotional core and vice versa?


Yeah but its funny, I've seen that in quite a few cases where they didn't pay for it in loss of femininity (in the case of women) or outward masculinity in the case of guys - it was more wiring and thought process thing than a dominant/submissive angle to things.


It seems a woman with a male emotional core could relate to guys better--and would also be more open to more sexually driven relationships that are stereotypically male.



Hector
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11 Dec 2009, 5:33 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Hector wrote:
A lot of us are predictably inclined to like people who we can relate to on some level. If you have interests or traits that are not favored by your (male or female) friends, tone them down a bit in their presence.

Otherwise, I'm afraid I have no idea what anyone in this thread is on about.


No, no problems with the friends. Its about emotional style differences between genders - I'm explaining how I've noticed a guy's core self to operate differently on an emotional level, I'm trying to get a more concrete/intuitive sense of that with women - mainly in a certain tragectory of emotive communication that I feel like I've had challenges with.

If that "trajectory of emotive communication that I feel like I've had challenges with" is courtship, as the presence of the thread in the love and dating forum may suggest, then what I say applies equally in communicating with your love interests as it would apply in communicating with your friends. In the meantime we can speculate on what are "male" and "female" ways to think, but the conclusions may not pertain to reality.



techstepgenr8tion
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11 Dec 2009, 7:46 pm

Hector wrote:
If that "trajectory of emotive communication that I feel like I've had challenges with" is courtship, as the presence of the thread in the love and dating forum may suggest, then what I say applies equally in communicating with your love interests as it would apply in communicating with your friends. In the meantime we can speculate on what are "male" and "female" ways to think, but the conclusions may not pertain to reality.


"If you have interests or traits that are not favored by your (male or female) friends, tone them down a bit in their presence" doesn't apply to me. I appreciate the advice but the situation I'm in has different circumstances and obstacles that I have to deal with, more neurological than any lack of social or emotional common sense. I was asking about the female psyche more because I'm trying to figure out how it works, give it some parameters, and get a sense what I have in my power to improve or add to my own sphere of understanding. Its not urgent however, I'm not exactly the type of guy who's counting down the days on a calender that he's willing to live as a single. I just don't like to get hit with things that I don't understand - its not the input that I don't like as much as the last part, not understanding it. Having an understanding helps me put things in perspective, put other people's emotions in better perspective, put my own emotions in perspective, it makes life a lot healthier to be able to do that wherever you can.