My Way or the Highway

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^ It's good that it's mutual; this is safer for me, I hope that women like you will never see me attractive. <3

And please don't call me sweetie, only my gf calls me sweetie.

I've learnt to stop asking for any sort of relationship or people advice on the internet (or at all) because it all depends too much on individual circumstances and to a large extent the social and cultural background of the people involved. In a lot of circumstances, yes, it closes negotiations. However, Rhapsody has come across situations where they're an opener. I don't think that means either side is right or wrong, it means different bits of society use them differently, and if Rhapsody issued an ultimatum it would mean probably something different to if e.g. Who_Am_I did. Since the person in question was not anyone on this thread...who knows. Someone ought to know their partner well enough to know which one it's likely to be, so it seems more likely it was a closer rather than an opener. But if your partner does that and you're not sure, ask them, not the internet.

Another form an ultimatum may take is coupling the demand with a suicide threat.

"Say you love me or I'll jump!"

"If you print those letters, I will kill myself!"

"Call off the divorce, or I pull this trigger!"

(For added drama, just add "... And it will be all YOUR fault!".)

This kind of ultimatum makes it hard to "call their bluff", but how else to deal with people who see nothing wrong with holding their own lives as hostage against the actions of someone else?

I think any relationship that comes to this is doomed and breaking up is the only reasonable option. If power plays hallmark your relationship then you really need to consider why you are in it.

Giving the ultimatum could of been a misunderstanding of what would happen. The women thought he would do her will not realizing that the guy would see it as a way & reason out. I don't know all the rest of the details but based on this little information I support the guy leaving. It also doesn't necessarily mean the guy thought he was braking up with her; he could of took it as him just having to spend New Years away from her & that they'll be together again after; I might would of thought that if I was him.

I don't think there's actually so much disagreement on this thread as it first appeared. I don't think anyone is claiming in the most literal sense that an ultimatum opens negotiations, only that it does not necessarily close them. Nor do I think anyone is claiming that it is okay to use them routinely or flippantly to help get your way.

I also don't think many of us would claim that an ultimatum is never okay under any circumstances. For example, if someone says to their partner "Okay, I'm going to try my best to forgive you and move past this, but if I ever find out you've cheated on me again I'd never be able to trust you any more. It would be over between us", where would your sympathies lie then?

In the original scenario my sympathies lay with the man, but mostly because of the context and wording that was provided: "It seems that the woman had told her boyfriend that if he didn't spend Christmas with her at her parents' place, then he could just forget about spending New Year's with her or anytime after". The wording she apparently used was very confrontational for one thing. It showed no vulnerability or suggestion of intimacy, or expression of why this was so significant for her in their relationship. Only a cold threat of denying him her companionship. Without the expression of why this was so fundamentally important to her, it's stripped down to sounding like a demand of "do as I say or else!" And the implication behind that threat is that she has the power to get her way when she wishes, because he is more invested in the relationship than she is (an implication that is also hurtful in and of itself). So his response seems very appropriate because he effectively proved her wrong and refused to back down in the face of the threat.

However, this was a third hand account we heard, so it might have actually happened very differently. Lets make some plausible minor adjustments and see if it changes where our sympathies lie:

Man: "I'm sorry but I won't be able to spend Christmas day with your family after all. It's going to be a late night on Christmas Eve, me and my brother always stay up late catching up when we haven't seen each other in this long. I just don't think I can handle such a long trip the next day."

Woman: "I already told my family you'd be there. I thought you understood how important this was to me, and to my parents. We've been going out for nearly a year now and they haven't even had a chance to get to know you yet."

Man: "Sorry but I really don't want to. Besides, a bunch of my old mates have asked me to the pub on boxing day, and it'll be too stressful to be rushing from one place to another every day. You don't have to spend Christmas Eve with my family either if you don't want to."

Woman: "I'd thought you were as serious about our relationship as I was. Obviously I'm less important to you than everyone else. Do what you want for Christmas then, but you can forget about spending new year with me or any time after.

Man (leaving): "In that case, have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!"

Does changing the context like this change how how you judge the woman for her ultimatum?

Sounds like a run-of-the-mill sort of breakup. If her family is hugely important to her and not so much for him, then a breakup is the best thing. The issue will reappear every time her family has a gathering. I know for me, this wold be a mismatch. His quick answer suggests he may have given this some previous thought.
Its not surprising that she was upset as she abruptly discovered her estimation of power was off.
Why your wife was upset is confounding as the story is more amusing than anything else.

Also, one is never responsible for the suicide of another.

I understand Rhapsodys opinion and how it differs from others on this thread. If someone said either you do this with or for me, or the relationship is over, it may well be said as a frustrated attempt to alter someone's behaviour, perhaps said in the heat of the moment after many failed attempts to integrate him more fully into her life. She may well not have truly meant it. I think there should be give an take in relationships, but saying do this now, or it is over is disrespectful. Nobody wants to feel as though they have to do something or else. In truth this happens all the time in life, i don't want to work the hours i do at the moment, i have to. I would hope from my partner however not to be forced into doing a particular thing. She may not have meant what she said to the letter, and he may have overreacted instead of saying don't issue me threatening demands and then further discussing the situation. It may well be however that he really didn't want to spend time with her family, at least not enough to actually do it for her voluntarily (and i am sure he knew how important it was to her) so it may be for the best they split up, as she would unlikely get what she wanted, as she was perhaps not the right woman for him and vice-versa.

It must feel great to say, “My way or the highway” and mean it.

As a matter of rhetoric, an ultimatum 1) precludes further negotiation and 2) promises consequences of some kind in response to noncompliance. To issue an ultimatum is to say, "These are my terms and you either accept them or you do not--there is no negotiation, and there will be consequences if you do not agree to my terms." This is simply the semantic meaning of an ultimatum.

Furthermore, a true ultimatum implies a commitment on the part of the person giving it to carry out the consequences. That is, if the ultimatum is sincere, then the person issuing the ultimatum will follow through with those consequences. If they do not, then the request wasn't really an ultimatum, but a bluff.

So all of this confusion about whether or not an ultimatum opens or closes negotiations is born from a misunderstanding about what the word means semantically vs. how ultimatums play out in the real world. By definition, a true ultimatum ends further negotiations; if it did not, then it wasn't an ultimatum. In the real world, many ostensible ultimatums are actually bluffs or the person issuing it is somehow mistaken: they are open to further negotiation, or they aren't all that willing to carry out the threat.

As for the case in the OP, we know too little to make any judgment about the fairness of the ultimatum (if it even were a true ultimatum). That she wants to present her boyfriend as a "well-trained man-pet" is not at all implied by the details of the case and frankly comes from nowhere. It seems to me that many posters too quickly attribute motivations to the involved parties without any basis for doing so.

You could argue that, in romantic relationships, ultimatums are unfair in principle, but this seems untenable. Consider: Sam's partner, Pat, is suffering from major clinical depression. Sam has tried everything to convince Pat to see a counselor, but Pat refuses. Sam issues the following ultimatum: Pat either goes to therapy, or Sam ends the relationship. This is, in my view, a fair and even good use of an ultimatum. Note that "Sam has tried everything" includes any means you can think of, so if you think Sam ought to have attempted X before giving the ultimatum, then grant that Sam attempted X.

Always be prepared for the possibility that people call your bluff.

Every woman who has served the MWOTHW ultimatum to me has experienced my departure. The ones that used it as a "bargaining tool", used it every chance they got, and seemed to have a generally contemptuous opinion of men to begin with.

I've known men to play this game too; but only at work ("Do it or find another job!"), or on the sports field ("Take shortstop or get off the team!").

The earlier you find out about this attitude, the better; and the best way to find out is to say "No" whenever you are really not interested in what the other person has planned, whether that other person is a man or a woman.

this is a good ultimatum: if you ever hit me again, it's over.