What DOESN'T count as Nice Guy behavior?

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The word "Nice GUY" is a gendered slur. So is calling someone a "dick".

Ok, the latter is true. I consider myself a kind of old-school, egalitarian, "sexism stinks for men too" feminist. Referring to men as their genitalia in a negative way is not such a good idea, though I admit to having done so. I do prefer to use the non-gendered terms, though.

Nice Guy, though, is not a generalized slur, but rather a specific reference to a certain kind of straight (or possibly bisexual or pansexual) male (and bringing up gender is indeed relevant) who is so unable to handle rejection by women he's interested in that he (a) tries to get a woman to date him very indirectly by doing things for her and (b) if she says no or never says yes, he flies off the handle and often takes out his rage against women in general.

There's a saying, "If it's not about you, don't make it about you." If you have not engaged in the above behaviors, you are not one of these creatures and do not need to be insulted by the term. If you are...well...it might help to work on your fear of rejection if you really want to get dates.

One more thing: I think the term Nice Guy actually originates from how these rage-filled, rejection-fearing individuals commonly referred to themselves in their complaints: "But I'm such a nice guy. How can my crush have said no? Women must all want to date jerks."

The thing is and I'm going to get scorned for stating this, most women don't know what they want and thus make it hard for men to date them. This is especially true for women under 30. That's why I don't take younger women that seriously when it comes to relationships, meaning I don't expect it to last. A woman that doesn't know what she wants is not worth trying to date, TRUST me fellas. If you hear a woman say " I don't know what I want." run far, far away.

That makes little sense. A lot of ND guys cannot handle rejections well, but that doesn't necessarily mean they will rage against women in general. Besides, it's clearly people that easily can handle rejection that lack persistence and serious interest in LTRs, so it is this group that needs to improve themselves, not the former.

CommanderKeen: I agree, but think it's more complicated than that, and applies both to men and women.

For instance, some women may desire a 'fit and strong' man, yet not know what that is supposed to be.

They may be extremely attracted to young men who workout yet not realize that a man who eats unhealthy/fast food for the sake of 'bulking' and has skinny chicken legs and doesn't train his Triceps, back or abs but only chest and biceps, does not do cardio, works out only 1-3 days a week, does not care about nutrition aside from Whey Protein and eating in a calorie surplus, still drinks alcohol/smokes/does drugs, and may even experiment with steroids occasionally usually isn't very fit, healthy, or aesthetic at all.

But, of course, simply looking muscular is enough for them to find these gymbro's attractive.

Or, in high school, some teen girls tend to be attracted to skinny young boys with a low enough body fat to have visible abs, but have little to no muscle tone whatsoever.

Some teen girls actually foolishly believe a teen boy must be 'ripped' simply because his abs are visible, even if the rest of him looks like a starving African child.

Some teen girls may think dating an older guy will make them feel more 'mature', but typically the older males they date are actually IMMATURE for their age.

Usually the older males I see teen girls date are typically rude low-life wiggers.

Basic examples, but I think you know what I mean. Just as many different examples can apply to men.

Apply this to many other areas of life.

Typically, people who are ignorant about a subject will be easily impressed by someone who has the ILLUSION of appearing skilled/talented/knowledgable in said subject.

All one has to do is befriend/get to know those who are ignorant about your interests so that it will be easier to impress them as they won't know enough about the subject whether to be able to more accurately determine whether you are actually skillful or not.

I am a beginner electronic musician and even though compared to most other electronic musician's I'm relatively average, I am praised as extremely talented by those who are not musician's themselves.

It may seem bold of me to believe just because someone doesn't know much about my interests doesn't mean they can't dislike my creations, but it's generally true.

My diet is far from perfect. Healthy, but far from perfect yet I am something of a health nut/freak apparently. I guess compared to the average sedentary i am, compared to other teens who workout I am, but compaed to the adults their dedication to diet and training kick's mine's a55.

Me and all of my male friends have experienced being called "nice guys" and none of us "felt entitled to sex" or "saw women as vending machines" or was just faking being nice to get into women's pants.

Well... Your post history suggests otherwise...



Source: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=319471&p=7000523#p7000523

Perhaps your negative experiences with Nice Guy behavior (with or without trademarks) may be due to the fact ...

... that you are not very nice?

When did I say in that thread that I felt entitled to sex? Answer: nowhere
When did I say women were machines or sex objects? Answer: nowhere

Last edited by Aaendi on 30 May 2016, 5:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Fighting rumours with rumours is not a wise tactic, or one I'd associate with genuinely nice folk.

The thing is, I don't want to be nice. Being nice is what got me into this trouble in the first place.

I think you're afraid of how you will be perceived if you "act" nice.
Just don't act, be, and see what life throws at you then. Whether you're a good or bad person. people will like you - and more importantly I'm guessing to you, women will like you - if you just do your own thing.

I made a comment earlier and perhaps I shouldn't have been so quick to revamp it.

If you're dealing with people who don't really think and would rather just label everything they see instead - there's no way to win with that. If you bend yourself out of shape to dodge their accusations you'll just find out that there's no end either to their foolishness or to how much you'll have to twist yourself into all kinds of strange social contortions to compensate the difference.

That is a good describing of the nice guy types.

They are the kind of girls that get annoyed and are angry with you if you just want to be friends. As a woman I do not have to go out with you just because you are nice there must be attracttion too. Wanting you as a friend means that I like you as a person and I wish I was attracted but I'm not

Heh. I took a lot of grief for that when I was younger. Wasn't even me just 'wanting to be friends', it was them flirting with me but with the automatic expectation that a) I had to be what they wanted me to be and b) if I didn't respond as expected then I didn't like them - which meant there was something wrong with me. Knowing that I was different, and being slow-burn due to my awareness, went over rather badly in that case.

I think the OP might just want to remember - people can be rather churlish. If he finds himself noticing it more from women in this context it's most likely just due to his sexual orientation.

I tend to be very honest and blunt if someone takes an interest in me and have still gotten grief for just wanting to be friends. This is after I have not shown any interest intentionally

Over all, it's better to be honest. But an attempt must be made to be as tactful as possible.