Why are strong women seen as the enemy?

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I have usually liked the strong women I have met, but even if I didn't I never thought of them as 'the enemy'. I don't feel threatened.

They are just trying to make their way in the world like anyone else.

I'm a guy who's sort of a feminist. I support full equality, I admire some strong women in politics & my 2nd girlfriend was a feminist. However I don't like the idea of being in a relationship with a strong independent women for a few reasons. My mom is strong & independent which is an admirable attribute in some ways but she's also kind of picky about things, we clashed alot, she kind of resents taking on all the responsibility that she choses to take on & is kind of passive-aggressive about it. I do not have a dominating personality & my 2nd girlfriend took charge of our relationship & things & I felt like my opinions & ideas weren't considered. I think one of my best rel.relationship strengths is being emotionally supportive of my partner & a stronger women is less likely to appreciate it. My current girlfriend isn't strong & independent but she doesn't conform to the female gender stereotype & I'm not strong & independent & don't conform to the male gender stereotype so our relationship is more on equal terms.

Tarantula and starvingartist: Your posts aren't getting through to people because they are not reading them properly. About 95% of people do not read things properly. I agree with a lot of your arguments, and I think you're both exceptionally good at putting your points and arguments across. Just making that point clear first.

However, long, detailed posts are not going to get through to people. I'm not having a go at you - people skim long posts, especially when without paragraphs. I think you both need to shorten and make your posts much more concise, and to the point. If you do that, then there will be far less likelihood for misunderstandings.

Since people aren't even getting the basics of some of your posts, making them more basic and concise isn't such a bad idea, even if it misses out a few points.

Just to add - make your particularly importantly points at the beginning and the end of a message. People tend to skim the middle bit.

I think there may be other reasons for disagreement besides stupidity, but nice try, Smudge.

Excuse me, but there has already been a misunderstanding on this thread. So according to what I said, that makes 95% of people stupid. Does that make sense? No. Perhaps you intently misunderstood my post. It is true - people *don't* read things properly, and people are making very long posts. The information in them is practically lost on the other side, because there is too much information to take in. It is hopeless to carry on this way.

It is a very human thing to find reading difficult. It is very human to skim-read a large block of text and think, "TL:DR". It is very human, and extremely common to have a short attention span to ideas you do not like - this is not stupidity. Would you not agree?

It is human to find new ideas hard to accept. Having a wall of new ideas isn't going to make people accept them, it is likely to make them clam up even more.

^ This goes for ANYONE, me included. Anyone who claims to be otherwise is either non-human or they're lying.

I do read "large blocks" of text. I do understand the points being made.

It's a classic "battle of the sexes."

What I'm seeing is people digging in, digging trenches for the long battle ahead.

There is no amiability in these threads, no humor--only anger.

People take more extreme positions than they otherwise would so they will not appear to be weak within the debate. This is a rhetorical technique. As one provokes another, the positions become more extreme, sometimes to the point of absurdity. No one can "give in" to another--otherwise, one will appear weak.

This is the question that bothers me: sometimes sexual banter and exploration are labeled as sexism. But they are not the same thing.




For my own part, I tend to short posts, but will go on if I have to. I find the likelihood of my reading a post through has more to do with content and style than length. But everyone's different.

This is very much the case. It's probably exacerbated by Aspies in general being very literal and prone to black and white thinking. Learning to actually listen to what others are saying, and HEAR what they're saying takes even more effort for an Aspie than it does for the average person.

I've lived long enough that I can see a lot more shades of gray than I used to be able to. I've also lived long enough to have learned that unless it is a life or death matter, being violently entrenched on one side or the other of an argument is not only disrespectful to your "opponent" - it is also a waste of time. I don't bother to get angry with people who disagree with me. I do get frustrated when not a single darned thing I say is being "heard" by someone, and they resort to personal attacks.

What you've said, KK, dovetails in with my life experience in that the longer a battle goes on, the less able the people involved are able to see shades of gray.

There are some great people on this forum, some average people, and some not-so-great people. It would be nice if everyone would play nicer, because regardless of what any one person's personal opinion may be, there *is* an incredibly sexist tone to this forum, and it *is* offputting to new female members (or potential members). If anything, it is the "strong women" who argue against this atmosphere of sexism/misogyny that have been deemed "the enemy" here.

I leave you with a few of my favorite quotes:

"The more often a stupidity is repeated, the more it gets the appearance of wisdom."
François-Marie Arouet
(1694-1778, known by his nom de plume Voltaire,
French Enlightenment writer, historian and philosopher)

"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge."
Charles Darwin
(1809-1882, English naturalist)

"Absolute certainty is a privilege of uneducated minds and fanatics. It is, for scientific folk, an unattainable ideal."
Cassius J. Keyser
(1862-1947, American mathematician)

I *did* say this.

Yes, too much negative energy here, delicious!


Yummy!! !

I know I am one of those people Smudge is describing. I almost never read long posts. And anything over about 4 lines seems long. I might skim the first few lines for a basic idea, but that's it. Sometimes honestly, I don't even do that. The thing is I think long posts might be tedious, or hurt my brain trying to understand and the open forums are not where I want to expend that sort of effort. That does not go for PMs though. Those are personal conversations I am invested in.

Those quotes are most applicable, Eureka--and I'm not one for quotes. Voltaire was the Enlightenment of the Enlightenment.

Last edited by kraftiekortie on 01 Jul 2014, 5:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

My goodness its turning into a cat fight in here I almost thought I was in womens discussion! [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yuLuKaWSbQ[/youtube]

Last edited by AspieOtaku on 01 Jul 2014, 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I call black cat.

AspieOtaku, please do not call a disagreement amongst women a "catfight" -- it's not very respectful. See background on the word and its use; it was popular in porn and spectacle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catfight

I did not know that, Ive been saying it for years and never offended any woman, heck other women call it a catfight even, I dont find it kinky nor porn related, just violent and brutal and I stay out of it or I get torn to shreds! I try to cool down a fight between women I end up being the punching bag and torn to shreds! I always thought the term came from the use of claws and scratching eachother and such which is why I used to the term loosely. When women fight its a scary thing at least for me I usually try and stay out of it to avoid being crucified which has happened in the past. I guess i can be politically correct and call it a woman fight? I dunno![youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bi6maMj7jL4[/youtube]