nature of attraction

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Kurgan, i've moved all of the posts from your newest derailing over here (from the Nice Guys and Love thread). the newest off-topic discussion fits into this thread better. maybe you should continue the discussion here instead of taking other threads off-topic.

pressured by society (or the Hollywood celebrity machine).

i didn't say anything about wider hips.

Let's turn the tables: can anyone find a modern culture, with plenty of food and no shortage of men where the most feminine and fertile women are not considered the most attractive?

overweight women can be feminine and fertile, so i am not sure where you are going with that.

for some reason it is reported as obese AND overweight women who have troubles conceiving, but in scientific studies it is actually only obese women who have difficulty conceiving (along with underweight women).

All of this is basically splitting hairs.

Guys don't like it that hot girls won't go out with them.
Fat girls get angry when guys complain about this because they don't get asked out.
Guys say they don't want to settle on the fat girls.
Eating disorders, sexual frustration and bitterness ensue.
Hagen Das and Kleenex's stock jumps 5pts.

I'm 5'10" and weigh 145lbs which places me SQUARELY in the middle of my ideal BMI. I could lose 5lbs or gain 5lbs and it wouldn't really matter that much. I also realize that I don't meet societies standards of masculinity. When I go out in public I get confused for being a girl. Most girls aren't interested in having a boyfriend who might get confused with being their sister. On the other hand, lots do.

That doesn't change the fact that I consider a Woman who is 5'4" - 5'10" and weights 210lbs to be unattractive. I also wouldn't go out with a girl who was more than 2 inches taller than me. I'm a person of modest proportions and am looking for similar.

I've always been extremely honest about what I'm looking for. Any girl who is within 30lbs of me + or - is more or less acceptable provided she also has a good personality and is of the same cultural background as me (sorry, I don't date outside of my phenotype). But I don't see why I, a person who makes effort to stay within his correct height/weight ratio.. should be expected to settle on some he finds unattractive.

Geography and Socio-Economic status plays a big part in your ability to find mates.. I would argue even more so than any sort of "Darwinian" imperative. I will use myself as a perfect example. I, will not, date outside of my phenotype. I will not date a person who has a BMI which is way out of proportion. I will not date some one who is a religious fundamentalist or an arch conservative. I live in the southeast united states.

"According to the 2010 U.S. Census, Georgia had a population of 9,687,653. In terms of race and ethnicity, the state was 59.7% White (55.9% Non-Hispanic White Alone), 30.5% Black or African American, 0.3% American Indian and Alaska Native, 3.2% Asian, 0.1% Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander, 4.0% from Some Other Race, and 2.1% from Two or More Races. Hispanics and Latinos of any race made up 8.8% of the population."

The underlined Portion of the population is the only part which I am interested in dating. It effectively halves the pool of potential dates. But, Half of that 55.9% are male. Thus, further ruling them out. Leaving us with 27.95% of the population which is, White, And Female. You then have to further extrapolate what percent of that 28% are within my age range, 21-30, Wikiepedia doesn't provide Data for that, but I'd go out on a limb and say it's probably about 1/3rd. That basically cuts the total population of the state of Georgia which I would be willing to date to about 10%, or about a million people.

Estimates establish that between 25-29% percent of the state of Georgia's population is "Overweight". So we can subtract another 1/4th to 1/3rd of the million people I have to choose from. So I'm left with about 700,000 people to pick from. That's still a huge voting pool, and we have only ruled out non Caucasians, males, overweight females and females who are too young or old for me.

Then there come the "Cultural" factors.

"Like most other Southern states, Georgia is largely Protestant Christian. The religious affiliations of the people of Georgia are as follows:[33]

Protestant: 70%
Baptist: 24%
Methodist: 12%
Presbyterian: 3%
Pentecostal: 3%
Catholic: 12%
Other: 3%
Non-religious: 13%

The largest Christian denominations by number of adherents in 2000 were the Southern Baptist Convention with 1,719,484; the United Methodist Church with 570,674; and the Catholic Church with 374,185.[34]"


13% - Non Religious. across all ages and genders and races.. so we have to subtract all those other percentages from the 13%. You can fairly safely rule out politics being an issue as the bulk of people who aren't religious also aren't conservative.. that is a generalization I realize.. but this is of course all just estimates, I'm not a statistician and I'm using 10 year old data.

What I'm left with is a potential dating pool of about 3000 individuals who might be suitable.

so we go from 10 million people in a state which is59,425 sq mi and I'm trying to find one of 5-6000 people. Granted, this is some what simplified by the fact that the bulk of these people will live around one of the states many colleges. It at least narrows down the geographic search parameters, slightly. But it certainly begins to illustrate just how much of a needle in a haystack I'm really looking for.

In other states, which don't have the religious, obesity or demographic issues.. my chances of finding a potential mate would increase dramatically, even if their populations weren't as big. And that finally brings us to the economic part, rather than the societal part of the problem. I'm broke, and am stuck here.

I feel I've got the right to be a little bit angry or bitter about my situation.

^you can blame the world all you want, but you have control over several of the facets of your dilemma. By putting your foot down about 'not dating outside of your phenotype,' you are choosing to be single. It's not a great choice, but it is a choice.

Incidentally, about BMI and health: at the healthiest I ever was, I was 5'5" and 160 lbs. i was training on a rowing team, with 8 practice sessions of stair-running, weight lifting, and rowing per week, each session lasting between 1 and 2.5 hours. I looked good enough to turn a lot of heads when I walked to and from practice in uniform. 160 lbs was the *average* weight for women on the varsity team, although I was on the short end.