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Double standards in society?(offtopic discussion earlier thr

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edgewaters
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29 May 2012, 3:07 am

XFilesGeek wrote:
However, my position is that the very question of, "Who has it harder?" is beyond idiotic and dehumanizing an entire swath of the human population isn't healthy.


Well, you can think it's all some kind of competition if that's the sort of rut your thinking is stuck in; it wouldn't be uncommon around here. But there are different issues for both genders. They have different difficulties, in different areas. Your attitude just seems dismissive to certain difficulties, that you don't share. I don't see THAT as healthy.



DogsWithoutHorses
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29 May 2012, 3:25 am

Zinnel wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
Because men haven't gotten off their collective a$$es to do anything about it.

Next question.


What is your point of this thread?

Because you point out the struggles females, yet you bash males.

Nether sex has it easier or harder in the dating scene. In the rest of areas of life, yes of course!!

But in the dating scene no. Who does have it harder is the people who have a hard time socializing, people who can't understand others or they themselves can't be understood, and of course anyone who faced alot of rejection and/or are exposed to pressures that tell them they "arn't good enough".


the context of that was about cancer funding and abuse shelters, which has nothing to do with dating. It as about those rest of areas of life that you correctly pointed out, yes of course have differing levels of hardship.

I think a lot of things that are being interpreted as bashing males, are really just bashing men who complain about women on the internet, I know that's the demographic most of my ire is directed in (if my aim is imperfect at times)


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29 May 2012, 3:57 am

DogsWithoutHorses wrote:
Zinnel wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
Because men haven't gotten off their collective a$$es to do anything about it.

Next question.


What is your point of this thread?

Because you point out the struggles females, yet you bash males.

Nether sex has it easier or harder in the dating scene. In the rest of areas of life, yes of course!!

But in the dating scene no. Who does have it harder is the people who have a hard time socializing, people who can't understand others or they themselves can't be understood, and of course anyone who faced alot of rejection and/or are exposed to pressures that tell them they "arn't good enough".


the context of that was about cancer funding and abuse shelters, which has nothing to do with dating. It as about those rest of areas of life that you correctly pointed out, yes of course have differing levels of hardship.

I think a lot of things that are being interpreted as bashing males, are really just bashing men who complain about women on the internet, I know that's the demographic most of my ire is directed in (if my aim is imperfect at times)


I understand that, but if thats the case then the point of this thread was simpily to add fuel to the forest fire storm thats raging out of control. Which is only driving a deeper line between the sexes.

If you want to show that this "who has it harder" thing is hogwash then blur the lines by understanding and show the similarities of the stage by stage struggles each sex faces in the dating world. Your not going to doing anything by bashing the sex of the people who bashed your sex.


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29 May 2012, 4:07 am

I like Zinnel's point here. A detailed breakdown of the difficulties of females trying to date would be more insightful - of course, common difficulties as appearance and fashion apply to both sexes, so specific female difficulties needed only.



edgewaters
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29 May 2012, 4:18 am

DogsWithoutHorses wrote:
I think a lot of things that are being interpreted as bashing males, are really just bashing men who complain about women on the internet, I know that's the demographic most of my ire is directed in (if my aim is imperfect at times)


Some of the crazier attitudes do tend to complicate things. I find it frustrating because of the communication problems it causes.

It's too bad we couldn't create another forum for the partisan gender warriors. I'd grab some popcorn and watch, maybe troll a bit by saying something reasonable once in a while. :lol:



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29 May 2012, 5:14 am

Zinnel wrote:
DogsWithoutHorses wrote:
Zinnel wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
Because men haven't gotten off their collective a$$es to do anything about it.

Next question.


What is your point of this thread?

Because you point out the struggles females, yet you bash males.

Nether sex has it easier or harder in the dating scene. In the rest of areas of life, yes of course!!

But in the dating scene no. Who does have it harder is the people who have a hard time socializing, people who can't understand others or they themselves can't be understood, and of course anyone who faced alot of rejection and/or are exposed to pressures that tell them they "arn't good enough".


the context of that was about cancer funding and abuse shelters, which has nothing to do with dating. It as about those rest of areas of life that you correctly pointed out, yes of course have differing levels of hardship.

I think a lot of things that are being interpreted as bashing males, are really just bashing men who complain about women on the internet, I know that's the demographic most of my ire is directed in (if my aim is imperfect at times)


I understand that, but if thats the case then the point of this thread was simpily to add fuel to the forest fire storm thats raging out of control. Which is only driving a deeper line between the sexes.

If you want to show that this "who has it harder" thing is hogwash then blur the lines by understanding and show the similarities of the stage by stage struggles each sex faces in the dating world. Your not going to doing anything by bashing the sex of the people who bashed your sex.


So you take issue with the whole argument even existing, but the individual you chose to direct this to is a woman with a minority perspective responding to a problematic comment.
you do realize you're almost paraphrasing her in your last paragraph.

and J-Greens of course you think he has a point, you're the one who started the nonsense in the other thread to begin with


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29 May 2012, 5:34 am

Me? I think you'll find I only replied to somebody else's comment. Look there for blame, page 1.

edit:
I believe the term Trolling, is appropriate here especially when you read the very last part of the first post in the thread. I may have been more responsible and not of replied to such bait and that is my mistake, but I only asked for examples of what that user deemed equal "work" and got trolled again. "Bring it on" is flame-baiting and I'm still surprised that the Mods haven't done anything to stop this.



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29 May 2012, 9:35 pm

OliveOilMom wrote:

I beat the living crap out of my ex when we broke up after trying to get back together, then took a tire iron to his car. However, I did that because he slapped me first and he had also beat the crap out of me almost every day that we were together. I finally figured out that I was bigger than him. He deserved every punch. Even his mother shook my hand over that and said it was about time.

But overall, women are more often physically intimidated by men than vice versa. That's very true. Standing up to a guy thats bigger than you and possibly violent is a dangerous thing to do because it can seriously get you hurt. I know, I've been in that situation before. The husband I have now has hit me a few times, years ago. I decided I was not going to take that from him and gave it right back to him after the first few times he hit me. He never put his hands on me like that again.


Girls have punched and slapped me out of nowhere. Eventually, I wrestle them back....in public.

I haven't seen guys do that in public 8)

JanuaryMan wrote:
Why do so many people play the victim here full stop? I thought the main purpose of L&D was to listen to people, help people move on or improve, not seek pity or use said pity to excuse them for things. The L&D has to be one of the most negative boards I've sever seen!


Oh if you think THIS is bad, you should try out 4chan's /r9k/ board. You'll want to shoot yourself from the drama there :? :wink: 8O


rabbittss wrote:
Sure it does. You go to a bar, you have a few drinks, you pick up a girl who is drunk, you two have sex, she sobers up in the morning, sees you, decides you 'Raped' her in order to avoid owning up to her failings while she was drunk, you go to jail.


<_< Yeah I can DEFINITELY see that >_>

DogsWithoutHorses wrote:
I was sarcastically referring to crap attitudes like this

rabbittss....NO!


I'm sorry, but stuff like that has TOTALLY happened.....I will not go into details but I know of two cases like that where something similar to that happened (minus people going to jail).

That's not a "crap attitude" thats a FACT.

DogsWithoutHorses wrote:
The rates of male on female abuse are much higher than female on male. When you look at repeated abuse, the disparity widens. When you look at abuse that results in serious injury, the gap widens even further.


Actually a majority of domestic violence is initiated by females. The thing is, the "majority" is like 50.5% or 51% (seriously, that's what one study gives it as. extremely small difference in favor of females)


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29 May 2012, 9:39 pm

DogsWithoutHorses wrote:
Zinnel wrote:
DogsWithoutHorses wrote:
Zinnel wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
Because men haven't gotten off their collective a$$es to do anything about it.

Next question.


What is your point of this thread?

Because you point out the struggles females, yet you bash males.

Nether sex has it easier or harder in the dating scene. In the rest of areas of life, yes of course!!

But in the dating scene no. Who does have it harder is the people who have a hard time socializing, people who can't understand others or they themselves can't be understood, and of course anyone who faced alot of rejection and/or are exposed to pressures that tell them they "arn't good enough".


the context of that was about cancer funding and abuse shelters, which has nothing to do with dating. It as about those rest of areas of life that you correctly pointed out, yes of course have differing levels of hardship.

I think a lot of things that are being interpreted as bashing males, are really just bashing men who complain about women on the internet, I know that's the demographic most of my ire is directed in (if my aim is imperfect at times)


I understand that, but if thats the case then the point of this thread was simpily to add fuel to the forest fire storm thats raging out of control. Which is only driving a deeper line between the sexes.

If you want to show that this "who has it harder" thing is hogwash then blur the lines by understanding and show the similarities of the stage by stage struggles each sex faces in the dating world. Your not going to doing anything by bashing the sex of the people who bashed your sex.


So you take issue with the whole argument even existing, but the individual you chose to direct this to is a woman with a minority perspective responding to a problematic comment.
you do realize you're almost paraphrasing her in your last paragraph.

and J-Greens of course you think he has a point, you're the one who started the nonsense in the other thread to begin with


No I don't have a problem with the argument, as long as an argument goes somewhere its very healthy for a society. What I have a problem with is the method in which this argument is being handled.

When someone claims they're having it harder because of their own sex, "playing the victim" as it has been said here. The are attacked and of course they attack back, and then are attacked again, and so the cycle continues. As long as you continue to attack the "victims" the argument will go nowhere.

And yeah I know what XFilesGeek said


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techstepgenr8tion
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29 May 2012, 10:02 pm

This tends to be one of those topics that's very ego-loaded, even waxes religious, so even if it is harder for one gender or the other in an absolute sense we'll get to the bottom of it the day when Sunnis and Shiites agree on Mohammad's uncle.

Clearly there's lots of stuff that cuts both ways, lots where if we have to try and compare the hardship of things like a woman's internal experience to a man's external experience or vice a verse - there's no way of really comparing apples to apples; and when we try and one gender turns out more disadvantaged to the other there ends up being another angle of 'Yeah but' that reciprocally effects the other gender but not the former. You also have huge disparities within each gender based on looks, status, etc. which provide night and day differences regarding whether the current system is suiting them or not.


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30 May 2012, 9:53 am

http://search.bwh.harvard.edu/concourse ... exEcon.pdf

Worth a read.
Title says it all, but there are specifics that help understand the model.



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30 May 2012, 11:57 am

Warsie wrote:
rabbittss wrote:
Sure it does. You go to a bar, you have a few drinks, you pick up a girl who is drunk, you two have sex, she sobers up in the morning, sees you, decides you 'Raped' her in order to avoid owning up to her failings while she was drunk, you go to jail.


I'm sorry, but stuff like that has TOTALLY happened.....I will not go into details but I know of two cases like that where something similar to that happened (minus people going to jail).

That's not a "crap attitude" thats a FACT.



I remember a widely publicized incident like that at a college where I used to live. The girl tried to get revenge for a derogatory sexual comment somebody said about her right afterwards even though it was consensual. The case was eventually dismissed even though the guy had to spend months in jail.



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30 May 2012, 12:27 pm

Honestly this seems more like it was meant to keep the drama going, then put a stop to it and discuss a topic, though the exact topic of discussion was a little unclear in the first place. I would say it is stupid to assume who has it easier based on their gender in general, we all know not all females are the same anymore than all males are the same.


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31 May 2012, 11:45 am

Warsie wrote:
rabbittss wrote:
Sure it does. You go to a bar, you have a few drinks, you pick up a girl who is drunk, you two have sex, she sobers up in the morning, sees you, decides you 'Raped' her in order to avoid owning up to her failings while she was drunk, you go to jail.


I'm sorry, but stuff like that has TOTALLY happened.....I will not go into details but I know of two cases like that where something similar to that happened (minus people going to jail).

That's not a "crap attitude" thats a FACT.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-nort ... s-17791890
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ched_Evans



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31 May 2012, 11:49 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
Honestly this seems more like it was meant to keep the drama going, then put a stop to it and discuss a topic, though the exact topic of discussion was a little unclear in the first place. I would say it is stupid to assume who has it easier based on their gender in general, we all know not all females are the same anymore than all males are the same.


Correct, but the gender roles expected in terms of dating are usually the same in Europe and North America, regardless of the individual.



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01 Jun 2012, 8:46 pm

Kurgan wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Honestly this seems more like it was meant to keep the drama going, then put a stop to it and discuss a topic, though the exact topic of discussion was a little unclear in the first place. I would say it is stupid to assume who has it easier based on their gender in general, we all know not all females are the same anymore than all males are the same.


Correct, but the gender roles expected in terms of dating are usually the same in Europe and North America, regardless of the individual.


Which is why I don't wish to date or get married.


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