WTF is up with this "entitled to sex" meme?

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That's positivity?



That's dramatic!!

Ditto.

I come from a blue-collar family and a poor white trash town. Usually, the men didn't make enough money to support their families all on their own, so women were required to work at least part-time. I never was raised to believe men should pay for everything and working was "optional" for women.



Yeah, I didn't get the sense that you were generalizing about all women, just the women you have personally interacted with. Sometimes things don't always get conveyed clearly on these forums.

And I don't like entitled women anymore than I like entitled men. Both are obnoxious.

Have you been reading Invisible Bread today too?
I read this pretty much straight before I read your comment.

That's what it sounded like when I read it, and I'm not the only guy who took it that way.



You pegged me. I felt left out not having a fantasy hate-object. "The Patriarchy" is such a fine one.



For which I know of no good, current figures. The measure that I picked is a decent approximation: When total expenditures rise, the share of luxury goods typically rises also.



Do you have statistics to show that we don't? I already addressed this by pointing out that the era of stay-at-home mothers walking to the grocer, then the butcher, and then the baker to feed a family is long gone.



...which is why I referred to individual spending figures.



And I can think of examples of women nagging their husbands to make more money. I roomed with a couple who lived just outside of one of the most expensive suburbs of Seattle. They had a large piece of land, three cars, a nice house, and enough money to send both of their daughters to good colleges. The guy had lost his job - something that happens quite often in the cutthroat business climate there - and every night over dinner, she'd press him about work in a very hostile tone.



Let's start with a big one and go from there: All pay-gap accountings by feminists record stay-at-home moms as having no income. Now I don't know about your relationships, but I wouldn't assume that anyone would live at my house, cook my meals and raise my kids while having no play-money of their own. (I don't expect anyone to do any of those things.) The only way that you could discount that income is to claim that it's not really the dependent spouse's money (that's the issue of "control" that I referred to earlier).

That would be another retrograde 1950s stereotype. That's not how modern marriages work. If a dependent spouse isn't satisfied, he or she can walk away with half of the estate. That's quite a good bargaining position.

Legalize prostitution and regulate it and problem solved! Everyone gets laid and everyone is happy besides we are primates like the chimpanzee and the bonobo so it comes naturally also remember the chimpanzees have both a patriarchy and a matriarchy and live in equality! We humans should take notes! A patriarchy coinsiding with a matriarchy at the same time in modern societty would ensure peace, security and sexual equality!

There is a reason prostitution is illegal: it hurts women in all sorts of ways. It may seem like consenting adults, but there is a darker side for women hiding inside.

Sex workers and sex positive feminists might dissagree on that part! If the woman is making profit for it and is in complete control and is doing it out of her own free will and enjoying it why not? She might carry a gun and a tazer as well as mace for self defense!

Hmmm...I'm a sex positive feminist. And I would also tend to agree in principle that people ought to be able to sell all kinds of labour - including sexual services. But in practice I feel very differently. The reality of prostitution is violent, degrading and largely non-consensual - and certainly the vast majority of prostitutes are not in much if any control of their situation. It's at a minimum a very high risk occupation where workers are not adequately protected in their workplace.

Yep. AspieOtaku, a lot of sex workers get murdered. And in Texas, apparently, it's cool to murder your escort:

http://www.ibtimes.com/texas-man-ezekie ... go-1295593

The reality is that unless sex workers are protected by the full force of law and good regulation (and bouncers right outside the door), and are accepted as providing an ordinary service instead of building sin houses, it's a dangerous business. Too many men are too insecure about sex, and will take it out on the nearest woman, even if she's the one underneath him, and especially if she's unprotected from him.

I don't understand.

If prostitution is illegal in Texas then how can he legally retrieve what is illegal? IMHO, the prosecution was right. How can the jury logically derive to acquit based upon the logic of the law?

Honestly, I have mixed feelings on prostitution. It seems like if it was legalized it could turn into a 13th amendment issue quickly.

That is kinda what I mean by that is they are protected by bouncers and have weapons on them maybe have escort services that provide protection for the sex workers as well as train them in martial arts. If its ok to kill sex workers in Texas then all the more reason for me to never live in Texas again.[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ar8QZfrL_zQ[/youtube]

It is pretty rare that a woman is in complete control and truly choosing the profession, as v. having the profession having chosen her. And the business is highly dangerous.

The biggest dangers that sex workers face are assault and robbery, both of which are a problem because it's illegal.

As for the health risk of the acts, it's not worse than what college students do frequently. The freshman girls that I used to room with were constantly hosting keggers. What are the odds of proper barrier use when both parties are drunk? I might actually feel safer with a pro than hooking up with a 20-something girl at a bar.

If you're saying that sex itself is inherintly more dangerous than other jobs, I urge you to read up on industrial work. I've never worked in heavy industry, but even in my lab there were lots of tasks that required just as much caution as using a condom properly. You could be electrocuted if you forgot to properly lock out an instrument before opining it up to repair it. We had some extremely nasty acids for stripping aluminum deposits off of guages. My job was downright safe compared to most. It's a lot worse in the East Asian factories where most of your toys are made.

yeah, 'cause hookers never get killed on the job--never get raped, beaten, strangled, stabbed, cut up into little bits, and buried in unmarked graves or dumped in the river. that's practically unheard of. hooking is a cakewalk compared to being a pipe-fitter.

edit* to add: and surely if these illegal acts against prostitutes were happening with any sort of frequency the police would put a stop to that--that's what cops do, right? it's not like the law would look the other way if a hooker were murdered, because if people found out they would be rioting in the streets because we all know how much the average person cares about the welfare and safety of hookers.

Did you even bother to read what I wrote?

"The biggest dangers that sex workers face are assault and robbery" because (1) they tend to have lots of cash lying around, and (2) they're afraid of reporting crimes against them because they would have to tell the authorities what they were doing. If they were in a legal business, they would (a) know the names of their customers, (b) have the option of electronic payment, and (c) have no fear of dialing 911.

NobodyKnows, you are intent on ignoring the fact most women who hook, don't really WANT to hook; and once in, it is near impossible to get out. There is a lot of trickery involved.

You CHOOSE to work in a lab. You aren't tricked or forced into it. The whole sex industry is built on power v. powerlessness. How can someone keep themselves safe in a situation they have no control over, that most likely they would rather not be in?

The steps you suggest might make it safer, but they won't change the nature of the business, which is coercion, and they won't change the fact that you leave a physically weaker woman alone in a room with a physically more powerful male who may or may not be in his right mind, and may or may not feel entitled to whatever craziness his mind derives simply because he "paid" for it. Those men aren't usually all that afraid of the law; they are afraid of their wives and communities, and making things legal is not about to change that, meaning that all the secrecy and lying will still be there.