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hyperlexian
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19 Feb 2012, 3:02 am

MXH wrote:
hale_bopp wrote:
MXH wrote:
hale_bopp wrote:
Boxman108 wrote:
In my experience, trying to act confident when you don't actually have anything to be confident about only makes you look like a cocky prick. I don't know about anyone else, but I wouldn't find that attractive at all. There's much more to be said for being humble(not necessarily pessimistic).


That's why you actually get confident, not put on an act.


Confidence isnt something you buy in the drug store. You cant just say "ill be confident" and actually be it. You need to have the external aspect to support your claims of confidence otherwise you're just pretending to be confident.


I'm aware of that. When I said that, I meant start the journey of finding true self esteem.


So if you know that his success is limited by lack of confidence and confidence is limited by lack of success then why do you and others even bother to tell that to the guy? You know already theres nothing he can do to change that, its a catch22. Why not instead of all this charade tell him of ways where he can gain confidence in other manners, or ways to make up for confidence, or different places he can try where women arent looking just for the cockiest dick, etc. Why keep beating the guy with the confidence thing if you're not willing to give him advice on how to gain confidence?

i did.


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MXH
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19 Feb 2012, 3:06 am

hyperlexian wrote:
i did.

I went through 4 pages and didnt see anything. I did see you say something about confidence which then came up as confidence in a different field than what the social confidence women supposedly look for. By that logic I should go and try to approach women in junkyards since I have confidence in my knowledge of the cars there.



hyperlexian
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19 Feb 2012, 3:10 am

MXH wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
i did.

I went through 4 pages and didnt see anything. I did see you say something about confidence which then came up as confidence in a different field than what the social confidence women supposedly look for. By that logic I should go and try to approach women in junkyards since I have confidence in my knowledge of the cars there.

no, i went into more detail than that - there are probably 3 posts where i explained it further.

if you have better ideas, feel free to share them. but right now you're in a mindset of just tearing down everyone else's.


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hale_bopp
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19 Feb 2012, 3:18 am

rabbittss wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
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hyperlexian wrote:
that is an interesting strategy for getting a girlfriend.

i am fairly certain that you have not been elected into an exalted position that gives you the power to determine which people are considered idiots.




I wouldn't want the girls I'm talking about to be my girlfriend anyway. If we have nothing in common, we will never work out. Just cause she's female doesn't mean a thing.

I'm allowed to think a person is an idiot for any reason I want. I'm only speaking for myself here, In my opinion, it makes them idiots.

right, and the way you just expressed that people are idiots in your opinion makes perfect sense. it was how you phrased it as though it is an immutable fact and not just your opinion that gave me pause.

it is very hard to find people with common interests in a bar. you might want to try meeting people at an activity that you enjoy doing more than drinking and dancing, because that's pretty much all you are guaranteed to have in common with those females.

but are you really giving them a fair shot? it seems like it would be a very brief conversation for you to judge them so harshly. you really can't blame people for judging you quickly either, if that's the way you roll.


I'm sorry for the confusion.

Well, that you see is the problem. The interests I have, and the places I frequent, Females don't go to, or if they do, I'm not interested in them. I'll admit that maybe I'm a tad superficial, but I also know that I can be. Basically speaking, some of the women who go to the places which I hang out, I'd rather chew my own leg off than go home with them.

But you are absolutely right, Bars are not a good place to meet women, but I live in a place where they are the only secular place to meet attractive women. I don't go to church, there are no non church related volunteer groups, My school is to far away for me to find girls at (nearly 1.45hours each way), so I'm left with a single book store, and a slew of coffee shops. The problem is, I always feel bad about interrupting them while they are doing homework (I live in a college town, for a college I don't attend, so that cuts me off from all the college related stuff). I might not be giving them a fair shot, but I like to be upfront about what they are getting. I'm a geek. I use big words, I quote movies, I collect toys. I'll drop in a star wars or Monty Python joke.. if she doesn't get it.. then I have no interest in her, just as I seriously doubt she would have any interest in me.

I'm used to being judged based on my appearance.. I swear if I was gay.. I'd be neck deep in sex and probably have scored a few European vacations and a free car or two.


I don't understand why you complain about the reasons people reject you when you're just as bad.



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19 Feb 2012, 3:24 am

MXH wrote:
So if you know that his success is limited by lack of confidence and confidence is limited by lack of success then why do you and others even bother to tell that to the guy? You know already theres nothing he can do to change that, its a catch22. Why not instead of all this charade tell him of ways where he can gain confidence in other manners, or ways to make up for confidence, or different places he can try where women arent looking just for the cockiest dick, etc. Why keep beating the guy with the confidence thing if you're not willing to give him advice on how to gain confidence?

And before you suggest to "just keep trying until things work out" ive done that long enough to know as the success to failure ratio keeps getting lower and lower the chances of success also will drop with your now eve lower confidence. So dont bother with that argument


No, we are actually telling him to learn through trial and error, to adapt and learn from rejection and mistakes. If you approach a hundred woman and get one girlfriend or successful relationship out of it, it's still a positive experience and even if you don't, you can still take away something positive from it. I know one guy that set out to ask 400 women out in a day and by the time he got to the 70th, he had a girlfriend and that was because of perseverance and determination not to give up, that's what true confidence is, the ability to persist.

The moment you say I'm not good enough or start think about past rejection in a negative manner, you are setting yourself up for failure, it's about having the right outlook and perspective.



MXH
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19 Feb 2012, 3:24 am

hyperlexian wrote:
no, i went into more detail than that - there are probably 3 posts where i explained it further.

if you have better ideas, feel free to share them. but right now you're in a mindset of just tearing down everyone else's.


in essence its what you said, that just because a guy has one thing he is good at even if everything else in his life sucks he is able to convince himself to actually be confident. That just doesnt happen very often if at all. Like i said, being good at fixing a car by myself is in no way going to make me a confident person socially, unless im meeting other people with interest in cars. And lets be honest the ammount of women in that is rather slim. So what are my options now, to trick my head into thinking im great at something thats been a failure since i was 5? To pretend that since preschool ive been disliked by everyone that met me? forget that with 1 exception everyone that has allowed me into their lives has done it to gain something from me. I learned all of that by elementary school, when i met someone who wanted to be friends I would know what it is they wanted from me and would ask myself wether a false friendship was worth what i was giving them. And you all wonder why someone like me would not be confident. Because ive been used my whole life.

No, im in a mindset of frustration at the things that are called help. Saying "get confidence" isnt going to help. Until a real way to improve social confidence arises my point will stand.

OP and the others, since you arent getting any workable advice here ill offer some. Get into PUA tactics. Sure youll be disliked around here but its the internet, who really cares?



hyperlexian
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19 Feb 2012, 3:27 am

MXH wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
no, i went into more detail than that - there are probably 3 posts where i explained it further.

if you have better ideas, feel free to share them. but right now you're in a mindset of just tearing down everyone else's.


in essence its what you said, that just because a guy has one thing he is good at even if everything else in his life sucks he is able to convince himself to actually be confident. That just doesnt happen very often if at all. Like i said, being good at fixing a car by myself is in no way going to make me a confident person socially, unless im meeting other people with interest in cars. And lets be honest the ammount of women in that is rather slim. So what are my options now, to trick my head into thinking im great at something thats been a failure since i was 5? To pretend that since preschool ive been disliked by everyone that met me? forget that with 1 exception everyone that has allowed me into their lives has done it to gain something from me. I learned all of that by elementary school, when i met someone who wanted to be friends I would know what it is they wanted from me and would ask myself wether a false friendship was worth what i was giving them. And you all wonder why someone like me would not be confident. Because ive been used my whole life.

No, im in a mindset of frustration at the things that are called help. Saying "get confidence" isnt going to help. Until a real way to improve social confidence arises my point will stand.

OP and the others, since you arent getting any workable advice here ill offer some. Get into PUA tactics. Sure youll be disliked around here but its the internet, who really cares?

no, that really wasn't what i said. there is no pretending involved. i was talking about actually being confident about something you are good at, because it will translate into social confidence.


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MXH
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19 Feb 2012, 3:32 am

Wolfheart wrote:
No, we are actually telling him to learn through trial and error, to adapt and learn from rejection and mistakes. If you approach a hundred woman and get one girlfriend or successful relationship out of it, it's still a positive experience and even if you don't, you can still take away something positive from it. I know one guy that set out to ask 400 women out in a day and by the time he got to the 70th, he had a girlfriend and that was because of perseverance and determination not to give up, that's what true confidence is, the ability to persist.

The moment you say I'm not good enough or start think about past rejection in a negative manner, you are setting yourself up for failure, it's about having the right outlook and perspective.


Yes i addressed that, no? Trial and error is taking a shotgun to war. What the guys like me need is a sniper rifle. Something thats of more use than just blasting anything that moves. Also by your deffinition of confidence that means i have confidence, considering for the past months ive approached over 500 women in many different situations, countries, continents. Not one thing remotely close to success.

thats kinda the deffinition of having low self esteem/confidence no? Until you find a way to beat that theres nothing that can be done



MXH
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19 Feb 2012, 3:36 am

hyperlexian wrote:
no, that really wasn't what i said. there is no pretending involved. i was talking about actually being confident about something you are good at, because it will translate into social confidence.


ok then, how do you propose someone will transfer device specific confidence into social confidence? Im really curious.



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19 Feb 2012, 3:49 am

MXH wrote:
Wolfheart wrote:
No, we are actually telling him to learn through trial and error, to adapt and learn from rejection and mistakes. If you approach a hundred woman and get one girlfriend or successful relationship out of it, it's still a positive experience and even if you don't, you can still take away something positive from it. I know one guy that set out to ask 400 women out in a day and by the time he got to the 70th, he had a girlfriend and that was because of perseverance and determination not to give up, that's what true confidence is, the ability to persist.

The moment you say I'm not good enough or start think about past rejection in a negative manner, you are setting yourself up for failure, it's about having the right outlook and perspective.


Yes i addressed that, no? Trial and error is taking a shotgun to war. What the guys like me need is a sniper rifle. Something thats of more use than just blasting anything that moves. Also by your deffinition of confidence that means i have confidence, considering for the past months ive approached over 500 women in many different situations, countries, continents. Not one thing remotely close to success.

thats kinda the deffinition of having low self esteem/confidence no? Until you find a way to beat that theres nothing that can be done


Yes, you have confidence, putting your character on the line is confident regardless of what people say, an actor plays a character is putting his performance on the line to be judged and critiqued, even if the role isn't greatly played, it does still take confidence, even moreso if they are uncertain of how they will be received.

It's like any skill in life, it might take you a thousand attempts to learn one technique but once you have mastered it, it becomes second nature or instinct and you become more confident in that ability, at least you are realizing what you need to do and discerning and finding out what doesn't work.



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19 Feb 2012, 4:06 am

Not really, Ive not found out anything im doing right/wrong since i cant even get to introducing myself. Maybe i need to say something obscene or act in a rude almost perv manner since it seems to work for others



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19 Feb 2012, 8:11 am

Quote:
I know one guy that set out to ask 400 women out in a day and by the time he got to the 70th, he had a girlfriend and that was because of perseverance and determination not to give up, that's what true confidence is, the ability to persist.


A girlfriend? are you sure you didn't mean a fling?

I want to ask the females here: what do you think of a such guy?


This what I think of this guy:


He may be confident but he's desperate as well, he wants any girl as a his girlfriend.
He probably has no standards or most probably very superficial standards that can be determined in once glance.
He doesn't care for the girl's character.
He has no appreciation of individualism.
He has no depth of character.
I don't think he would have much loyalty; what made his girlfriend different from the other 400 women is that she said 'yes'.
He's just a robot pumped with testosterone, and again any girl would do.
His girlfriend is just a long term fling.

He sucks, and not a model I would follow.



MXH
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19 Feb 2012, 8:31 am

I agree and was going to mention that but decided i was getting enough flak as it was.



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19 Feb 2012, 8:46 am

and oh, his girlfriend before she becomes his girlfriend was probably just a girl who's ranked 70th in his eyes (in case he knew those 400 women in prior), meaning that he preferred to get one of the 70 girls before her. In call cases, she was certainly not the girl he most desired.

How lucky she is!! !



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19 Feb 2012, 8:54 am

MXH wrote:
I agree and was going to mention that but decided i was getting enough flak as it was.



You know, there's a certain double-standard culture in this.

Girls are encouraged to be as picky as they can, while on the other hand, guys are encouraged to be as broad in their picking as they can. You can see it everywhere in the media, forums, PUA materials, in magazines, even in the magazines for women where you might encounter advice_for_guys articles and even on this forum I recall users of both genders commenting how guys using online dating should message as much girls as they can....



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19 Feb 2012, 8:55 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
I want to ask the females here: what do you think of a such guy?


Honestly, I would be able to sniff out the fakeness, and that would make me say no. At the same time though, if he's practised it so many times he might've become good at what to say and how to say it. But I doubt it. Someone aiming to go through 400 girls or however many it was - must be in some sort of a rush/desperation, and he might not be able to word anything very well. If they're not looking for anything deep though, then I don't see why not.

I believe in numbers because it's not worth getting upset over one person who you're only just starting to find out about. It's worth starting to know a few people, or date a few people, so you have back up. That's a much more meaningful way of doing it, rather than going up to lots of complete strangers.