would love feedback: relationship with a new mom,yayornay?

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OK I would Love to get some general feedback from you out there. I will try to tell this in a nutshell so you don't have to spend too much time reading this.

About 3 years ago, i'm in my early 20's, working at this new job. I was interested in a co-worker there, she said she liked me too. She was (is) a few years younger than me. She basically spurns me for another co-worker there who is in his later 30's. I was down about this. But whatever, it happens. She has an office romance with this other guy, and a few months later he gets her pregnant (I truly believe she wanted to get pregnant but that's just my personal view based on things both of them have told me, but that's not really related to this story). Soon after this, he dumps her when she doesn't get an abortion. He really became the pariah of the workplace after this, the other ladies especially hated him for this and really rallied in support behind our female lead in this story. That last sentence, again, really added nothing of value to the main point/question of this post as you will come to see, so for any of you out there who are practicing the skill of reading a blurb of text and trying to spot which information was basically filler and was borderline pointless to include, you have my apologies for giving an answer away.

OK moving along... I am a very good friend to our female lead after this, and there remains that underlying chemistry between us. Shortly before she gives birth to her daughter, I move out of state to attend law skool. We are talking often though despite her time being occupied with new motherhood, mine with new skool. I see her a couple of times in the next couple of months, once over Thanksgiving and I spent New Year's with her at her house with her parents, brother, and her 4 month year old daughter. It's at this time that she wants for the two of us to get serious in our relationship. She wants to be physical together (for lack of a better way of putting it) and to become even further a source of emotional support for one another. At some level I very much wanted this, but at another level I just didn't feel it would be right. Timing and distance had a significant amount to do with it. On my end I knew I was on the verge of dropping out of law skool and needed to kind of address that and what I wanted to do with my future, and on her end, not to say it's wrong to be in a relationship if you have just given birth and the relationship is with someone other than the child's father, but I just felt like emotionally that wasn't the best time for her either to dive headfirst into something like that while adjusting to being a mom. Would this have been best for her daughter? I very much cared for her though and expressed this, and basically hinted at not closing the door on that prospect, but more so to view it as a down the road sort of thing. But I never once told her to wait for me. I don't think that would have been fair of me to do. For me it (the prospect of "us") was certainly worth waiting a little while longer for. And I felt that, if she was meant to be for me and I for her, that she would be able to understand this as well and wouldn't mind waiting.

Hope you're still reading, still with me!! Well, a couple of months later I discover that she is now romantically involved, this time with a new co-worker who is in his 40's! I'm like, "huh? wtf?" And she's all like, "well ummmm you said 'no' before." No I did not! I said, "not right now" essentially. I felt the timing was awful for both of us but we could have still been there for one another in the interim if we were to really build a foundation together that would have lasting potential. Also, I felt like she owed me/herself that extra time. I needed proof from her. For starters, she spurned me once before for some random co-worker and it hurt badly the first time. And I needed to be able to see if I could trust her again, with that past and our distance. I then later in a fit of fury pointed out to her that she was incapable of being alone, which she didn't agree with. But I said it because, back around New Year's, I needed to see if she liked me for me, or if it was b/c I was her only option at that point. If I was worth it to her, I felt like she would have had no problem waiting for us and to hold back on the office charm and (in my view) purposely trying to get on with another older lad at the office (I thought work was supposed to be for work after all, not for romps during breaktime!) So I basically shut her out after this, not talking to her, ignoring calls, texts, etc. Currently the ice has thawed somewhat and we talk now and again, but it's shaky. Who knows what is in store in the future.

OK I'll close now, I'm very sorry I did not keep my pledge at the outset to try for a nutshell account. Brevity is not my forte! But what I am basically asking for is some feedback, do you agree with her in the black and white sense that since I said "not right now" that it was perfectly reasonable for her to then get involved elsewhere? Keep in mind, She's obviously not here to tell her side of things and feelings but I have mentioned all of the key facts. And keep in mind, I realize that technically she wasn't cheating on me. But by and large, is it reasonable to think that it's bad timing to be in something serious with a new mom? Or was she right for thinking, as she put it, that I should have been with her at that time because we both wanted it, and I should have not cared about other factors? Any comments/insights/observations would be most appreciated. Thank you!

I think that technically it was ok for her to look elsewhere, but I have my doubts about whether she actually had any real feelings for you in the first place... The way you describe her makes her sound like she will just bounce from guy to guy to guy, perhaps hoping to find a guy to help her materially support her baby or something. You also told her of your concerns about where you were in life at the time you told her no, and in the end she wasn't willing to wait. Sure, you didn't ask her to wait for you, but if she really were interested in you, she could've easily suggested that she could wait for you if she felt you were worth keeping around. Thus it doesn't seem like there's anything remaining now in terms of a relationship with her. Of course you know her better than I do, but the impression I get from how you describe her is that she is a user. I would beware if I were you.

Interesting ideas. Thank you for your feedback.

I'd also be interested in getting some female opinions on my thought that it's probably best for a guy to generally not get involved seriously with a gal who has just had a baby, agree or disagree? (And more guys' opinions of course welcome too).

Too many weird details. It appears you're just a fallback position for her at best. You'd be better off with another mom about whom less is known than this one, it seems. Keep in mind, that many women you meet will be moms already, and many women get the opportunity to have kids with more than one guy, so don't hold it against them. But is it too much for her to show a little restraint, or at least use protection, and not be so quick to go past you to all these older guys? How many more kids will she have before she gets back to you, says "eh" and goes for yet another older guy? I would be saying "not that one", at least for the fact she's already been choosing these other guys over you.

Female opinion? Nay! Do not try to get into a relationship with her for the reasons others told you. This bouncing around from man to man is a bad sign.

Also you need to know that when you have a relatinship with a mom, you also have a relationship with her child. They are a package deal. If you aren't up for that, pick childless women only.

Quick personal story (sorry if it's a bit muddled):

When we broke up, my ex-boyfriend told me he'd 'ask me out after his exams were over'... fair enough. The thing is, when we broke up the first time, he said he'd 'ask me out on a proper date some day...'. When that day didn't seem to be forthcoming, I asked him out again. Shortly afterwards, he told me that actually, he probably wouldn't have bothered trying to get me back at all! (what if I had waited for months, thinking he meant it?)

I was very hurt by this and as a result, when we broke up the second (and final) time, I decided not to ask him out again. He seemed perfectly fine with this, until a couple of weeks later, he saw me having a good time at my birthday and regretted ending the relationship. He tried to pretend we were just 'on a temporary break' and that he would 'ask me out again after his exams'....

Thing is, this time I didn't believe it for a second, and I moved on. When he found out I had begun seeing someone else, he acted like I'd betrayed his trust and that 'he'd waited for me', but I honestly believe this was total bull. He hadn't 'waited'; nobody else had come along in the meantime, and I was supposed to be his 'back up' girlfriend, waiting patiently on the shelf for him to come back again...

This is why, when a guy tells me 'not now', I take it as 'no' and refuse to hang around. It's now or never (unless the current relationship ends). I'm not saying you were going to act like a d*ck, but plenty of people out there do; your friend may have met a few of those in life, and it's not a trick anyone wants to fall for more than once.

If she is a single mum, she may be in quite a vulnerable state, financially and emotionally. Your friend might have made the wrong choice going out with her current boyfriend (or they might be just right for each other). Either way, I think it would have been foolish if she had waited around for you; what if you had met 'true love' away in law school, and she was hanging around with a baby on tow, waiting for you to come back?

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but the saying 'carpe diem' definitely applies to love; if you don't seize the moment, don't complain when someone else does.

Last edited by Lene on 21 Sep 2009, 10:21 am, edited 2 times in total.

I would definitely move on...this woman is obviously, a "tramp" to put it bluntly. She was never interested in you and never will be.

There are plenty of worthwhile, young women in this world...so give it time and keep looking. You will find the right one for you.

Agreed. This girl is a typical user, and she doesn't even have you at the top of her list to use. She latches on to older guys who she thinks has money, gets pregnant on purpose, is only interested in you when no one else is available, etc.....

The warning signs are there -- keep this loser out of your life before you end up financially responsible for her kids, your kids by her, and are paying alimony.

You may think there are no better opportunities out there, but there are -- this person is fool's gold.

This.



and Imo you should just be friends and nothing more

Ditto. Train's a-comin'. Get off the tracks.

Well OK so you didn't immediately jump in right that minute when she came back to you, your fault perhaps, but this was after she already rejected you once and got pregnant by someone else. It's only natural that you might have already crossed her off your list, let alone give her consideration now. Hesitation may be considered a virtue here. Going from man to man, and then telling you about it, even getting pregnant is such an extreme way of getting your attention, and seems to be her intent. Why didn't the first man want to keep her and the baby in his life? It's reasonable for him to want to keep a woman who has his child, unless he saw that there was something seriously wrong. What do you think he saw?

You said you needed to see if you could trust her.

What did you find out?

Maybe she loved the other guy more? Maybe he actually asked her out? If the 'older' man was in his 30's, she can't be that old herself; it's not just aspies that are naive in relationships. Who's to say there was anything wrong with her? The OP thinks she got pregnant on purpose, but even he admits it's just a guess.

The OP says that the first guy dumped her because she refused to get an abortion, and that the rest of the staff rallied around her when she needed help. To me, this suggests that it is the first guy who had something seriously wrong; demanding someone kill their child 'or else' is sick; he used her and then ran when things got messy (I'm pro-choice btw, but I believe it should be a choice). The fact that the rest of the office supported her makes it difficult to believe that she is perceived as the 'office slut'.

Unless I've missed something, this post has only mentioned 2 relationships that this woman has had. How is that 'hopping' from relationship to relationship? From what I can gather from the text, there was a period of at least 6 months between the two boyfriends (I'm not counting the OP, who turned her down). 6 months. Maybe you consider that bed-hopping, but to me, that's a respectable amount of time to meet someone new.

I don't know the ins and out of the OP's story; I could be completely wrong, but so could all the people here criticising her just because she didn't wait long enough to 'prove' herself...

I agree with everyone here though; this 'friendship' sounds like a bad idea. Who wants a friend that bears a grudge like that?

Wow thank you everyone for taking the time to read my story and further taking the time to give me some feedback. I appreciate all of it. I will be back in a little bit to add a few further comments, provide some answers to some questions, but first, I need to have at a PB&J sandwich, doritos, Amp energy drink, and some Who Wants to be a millionaire. I'll be back l8rs. Hope you all will be too!

WTF? Do you have any self respect? When a woman spurs you, don't look back, just keep going. She doesn't have feelings like you or me. She's more like an animal with a built-in drive to find suckers with an income, that way someone besides her can support her young and she can feel like a good mother. Ever watch the discovery channel?

Whether there's anything wrong with these people or not one thing is certain:

The OP distrusts her, and the woman apparently won't tolerate any delay incurred in the process of rebuilding trust, or just a normal part of getting to know someone. Justified or not, the trust issue is there.

The OP's hesitation is quite natural, given that the woman rejected him and then went from zero to pregnant in just a few months with another guy, presumably without getting to know him well enough to know where he stands on having kids, abortion, etc., whatever her intentions. Impatience with running the normal course of building trust and familiarity is a red flag.