The Path Forward
05 Feb 2022, 8:48 am
When one has harboured a desire for romantic experiences and relationships for so long and not been able to meaningfully obtain anything of the sort, the natural reaction is to fear that those relationships and experiences are unattainable. It's easy to get caught up in the despair of "I'll never have a girlfriend", and fret about the implications of that notion on one's future.
I think despair and depression are reasonable, and I'd dare say expected, reactions to this situation, and it's easy to get effectively paralysed by such emotional turmoil, but I think it's also important for an individual afflicted with such circumstances to try to figure out what barriers they're facing, and how those could be mitigated.
In my situation, two major problems that are quite apparent to me at the moment are a lack of confidence, and recurring emotional turmoil.
My lack of confidence with women is largely a product of my lack of success with women, but there are other factors that weigh pretty heavily into my lack of confidence. Among the most pervasive of these are my weight (I'm about 45lbs heavier than I'd like to be) and my posture. While I don't think improving these things will negate the effect that not being able to have romantic experiences and relationships has had on my confidence, I think improving these things will still boost my confidence significantly. If I'm feeling less insecure, I'll be more optimistic about putting myself out there, and that leads to a greater likelihood of achieving that elusive romantic success.
As for the second issue I mentioned, emotional turmoil, I'm not sure how I can independently address this. What I mean when I say emotional turmoil is that I frequently feel depressed about my lack of romantic experience and lack of romantic prospects, and my mind frequently goes to this place because it's very important to me, and because I have no way of getting any closure with regards to it.
With relationships and sexuality being a prominent part of life and media, I find myself inundated with reminders of what I'm missing out on, and each individual reminder is likely to redirect my thoughts to my romantic situation, which in turn often results in feelings of, sadness, depression or despair. So this is on my mind a lot, and it weighs on me pretty heavily emotionally.
The only defence that's ever worked against the negative emotions brought on by thinking of my romantic situation is having a connection that at least somewhat fills that void. There have been a handful of instances where I've developed connections online with women that had overt romantic connotations, and oftentimes these connections have had the capacity to shield me from, or at least dampen the emotional impact of, being conscious of my lack of real-life romantic experience.
Basically, if I have any kind of romantic connection with someone I'm also drawn to, whether online or in real life, whether it's got legs to turn into something real or not, so long as it's something I'm currently engaged in, it gives me something positive to focus on as it relates to romance and dating, and that grants me some protection against the negative emotions I'd otherwise be enduring when my mind goes to the topic of dating.
So I feel that the ideal path forward for me would be working on improving myself in ways that will empower my confidence, while also somehow finding a romantic connection that will fill the void in the mean time, allowing my efforts not to be sabotaged by despair, and helping me endure stimuli that would otherwise derail my emotional state.
I think finding a romantic connection like that will be the most challenging part of this, if it's possible at all, but it's the only way to give me something positive to focus on when confronted with the topic of romance. I don't know how anyone can expect me to move forward when I'm constantly confronted with stimuli that evokes such distressing emotions, and I don't think there's anything I can do to stop feeling this way except finding some kind of romantic fulfillment.
05 Feb 2022, 9:29 am
Part of this is mindset. If someone is 105 pounds overweight and loses 60 lbs, they'll get a surge of confidence. But someone who is 0 pounds overweight and gains 45 pounds will feel terrible, even though both are the same weight.
There are people out there who are overweight and still have happy relationships/marriages. There are also people who are low income, less attractive, short, etc. in relationships.
Work on fitness and social life simultaneously. Yes, cut calories and go the gym. But don't feel like you have to do that before you can start dating.
I used to suffer severe depression and I used to have the same exact crippling mindset you do. You may think your depression is based purely on your lack of romantic experience. But it's the other way around. It's your depression that's coloring how you view romantic relationships.
I've tried everything: therapy, meds, etc. TMS is eventually what worked. Currently, I'm single and I'd like to be in a relationship at some point, but I still know
I'll give you perspective. During my depression, I felt like the core aspect of validity and self-worth was my romantic experience. But as my mental health improved, I realized, that's just 1 component of life. Not it all. Career/finance, fitness, leisure, social life and creative endeavors matter too.
What are you going to do with your life after you get into a relationship? What is your purpose? Start working on those things now. Don't try to cure your depression by getting into a relationship. Improve your mental health and sense of purpose first, and then it'll help you find a relationship.
The guy who is just fun/happy/positive and doesn't care if they get rejected or not, will be much more successful in dating than a guy who is nervous and feels like his self-worth is riding on the outcome.
05 Feb 2022, 10:32 am
Those aren't mutually exclusive. My lack of dating success could be a significant contributor to the origins of my depression, but to some extent my depression has probably taken on a life of its own over the past 10+ years I've been dealing with it. It's probable that depression is influencing how I view romantic relationships, but that doesn't change the fact that receiving some inkling of romantic satisfaction, in the very rare instances I do, makes me feel better about my situation.
I think it's completely natural for people who've never had a relationship into adulthood despite a persistent desire to feel less valid and have a deflated self-image.
Just because romantic relationships aren't the only important component of life, doesnt mean they’re not very important for most people. Just because other things matter also, doesn't mean that romantic relationships don't have an inflated importance for most people.
I'd characterise trying to neutralise insecurities in order to become more confident as a way to address my mental health. If I feel better about myself, I'm probably going to feel better in general.
Likewise, receiving some romantic validation would help build up confidence, whilst offering some degree of emotional appeasement that would mean a lot to me.
05 Feb 2022, 1:18 pm
I think despair and depression are reasonable, and I'd dare say expected, reactions to this situation, and it's easy to get effectively paralysed by such emotional turmoil, but I think it's also important for an individual afflicted with such circumstances to try to figure out what barriers they're facing, and how those could be mitigated.
In my situation, two major problems that are quite apparent to me at the moment are a lack of confidence, and recurring emotional turmoil.
My lack of confidence with women is largely a product of my lack of success with women, but there are other factors that weigh pretty heavily into my lack of confidence. Among the most pervasive of these are my weight (I'm about 45lbs heavier than I'd like to be) and my posture. While I don't think improving these things will negate the effect that not being able to have romantic experiences and relationships has had on my confidence, I think improving these things will still boost my confidence significantly. If I'm feeling less insecure, I'll be more optimistic about putting myself out there, and that leads to a greater likelihood of achieving that elusive romantic success.
As for the second issue I mentioned, emotional turmoil, I'm not sure how I can independently address this. What I mean when I say emotional turmoil is that I frequently feel depressed about my lack of romantic experience and lack of romantic prospects, and my mind frequently goes to this place because it's very important to me, and because I have no way of getting any closure with regards to it.
With relationships and sexuality being a prominent part of life and media, I find myself inundated with reminders of what I'm missing out on, and each individual reminder is likely to redirect my thoughts to my romantic situation, which in turn often results in feelings of, sadness, depression or despair. So this is on my mind a lot, and it weighs on me pretty heavily emotionally.
The only defence that's ever worked against the negative emotions brought on by thinking of my romantic situation is having a connection that at least somewhat fills that void. There have been a handful of instances where I've developed connections online with women that had overt romantic connotations, and oftentimes these connections have had the capacity to shield me from, or at least dampen the emotional impact of, being conscious of my lack of real-life romantic experience.
Basically, if I have any kind of romantic connection with someone I'm also drawn to, whether online or in real life, whether it's got legs to turn into something real or not, so long as it's something I'm currently engaged in, it gives me something positive to focus on as it relates to romance and dating, and that grants me some protection against the negative emotions I'd otherwise be enduring when my mind goes to the topic of dating.
So I feel that the ideal path forward for me would be working on improving myself in ways that will empower my confidence, while also somehow finding a romantic connection that will fill the void in the mean time, allowing my efforts not to be sabotaged by despair, and helping me endure stimuli that would otherwise derail my emotional state.
I think finding a romantic connection like that will be the most challenging part of this, if it's possible at all, but it's the only way to give me something positive to focus on when confronted with the topic of romance. I don't know how anyone can expect me to move forward when I'm constantly confronted with stimuli that evokes such distressing emotions, and I don't think there's anything I can do to stop feeling this way except finding some kind of romantic fulfillment.
The problem with online things is it isn't real. It is just words. People on here talk about their weird interests. They are all online. I don't even see those as interests.
You probably need to do real things with real people. Do you do anything real with real people? You do learn how to be a man from men. Women do look at your status among men as well as women.
I can understand if you don't do real things with real people. It is ok. But at least it can put some perspective on the matter rather then living in an imagined fairy tale told by the household maid that cleans the diapers.
That may or may not apply. I am just expressing a thought.
06 Feb 2022, 3:48 am
I wouldn't be likely to get involved in a serious relationship with someone from online who lives far away, but having someone to talk to and flirt with, having that kind of connection would be greatly beneficial for my well-being. I think the prospects of me actually finding a relationship right now are significantly lower than the prospects of finding a romantic penpal of sorts, and at the moment I really need some kind of romantic fulfilment or I'm going to continue feeling like crap when I'm beaten over the head by triggers that cause me to think about my situation.
My main focus at the moment is what I need in order to move forward, and the way I see it, I need to work on improving things about myself that I'm insecure about in order to build confidence, and I need a way to cope with my situation as it currently is so I'm not derailed by depression and despair. Getting some semblence of romantic fulfilment on an ongoing basis is the only way I've ever been able to effectively cope.
I can understand if you don't do real things with real people. It is ok. But at least it can put some perspective on the matter rather then living in an imagined fairy tale told by the household maid that cleans the diapers.
That may or may not apply. I am just expressing a thought.
I'm not meeting many people, and I don't have much of a social life outside of family. I'm trying to work on that too. I'll likely start attending a few new groups soon that will expose me to people, but I think the chances of me finding a romantic partner right now are slim based on low confidence and insecurities.
I'd be in a better place to start seriously dating if I could mitigate the most pertinent insecurities I have, and having a romantic interaction online would not only help me not get derailed by depression and despair while I work on my insecurities, but it would also make me feel more confident about being able to replicate that success in real life.
06 Feb 2022, 10:15 am
I wouldn't be likely to get involved in a serious relationship with someone from online who lives far away, but having someone to talk to and flirt with, having that kind of connection would be greatly beneficial for my well-being. I think the prospects of me actually finding a relationship right now are significantly lower than the prospects of finding a romantic penpal of sorts, and at the moment I really need some kind of romantic fulfilment or I'm going to continue feeling like crap when I'm beaten over the head by triggers that cause me to think about my situation.
My main focus at the moment is what I need in order to move forward, and the way I see it, I need to work on improving things about myself that I'm insecure about in order to build confidence, and I need a way to cope with my situation as it currently is so I'm not derailed by depression and despair. Getting some semblence of romantic fulfilment on an ongoing basis is the only way I've ever been able to effectively cope.
I can understand if you don't do real things with real people. It is ok. But at least it can put some perspective on the matter rather then living in an imagined fairy tale told by the household maid that cleans the diapers.
That may or may not apply. I am just expressing a thought.
I'm not meeting many people, and I don't have much of a social life outside of family. I'm trying to work on that too. I'll likely start attending a few new groups soon that will expose me to people, but I think the chances of me finding a romantic partner right now are slim based on low confidence and insecurities.
I'd be in a better place to start seriously dating if I could mitigate the most pertinent insecurities I have, and having a romantic interaction online would not only help me not get derailed by depression and despair while I work on my insecurities, but it would also make me feel more confident about being able to replicate that success in real life.
I think that perhaps after people get to a certain level they see things as overrated. And, the people that are at a certain level are doing so effortlessly.
I can imagine that having a semblance of romance online makes you feel better. I imagine that you are in a deep dark place. The semblance of romance probably seems like attention, understanding and acceptance.
I imagine there are romantic pen pals like that. But... I am not sure. Is that all you can manage? In my opinion that isn't any better than a platonic relationship. Maybe someone else in a dark place might see it as romantic. It just seems kinda dark to me.
07 Feb 2022, 2:13 am
I imagine there are romantic pen pals like that. But... I am not sure. Is that all you can manage? In my opinion that isn't any better than a platonic relationship. Maybe someone else in a dark place might see it as romantic. It just seems kinda dark to me.
Having more platonic relationships would probably be good for my well-being, as I currently have few, but platonic relationships do little to address the romantic void in my life. A "romantic penpal" does a lot more to fill that void than even a real-life platonic connection. The connection has to be romantic in nature to fill that void.
If it was social isolation I was most concerned about, a real-life friend would probably be better, but a platonic connection can't offer me the kind of validation and romantic fulfilment that a romantic connection can.
I'd prefer to find something in real life, but I just can't see how that could happen given that I'm insecure and not very confident or outgoing. It hasn't happened before despite the fact that I've had more confidence and been a bit more outgoing at earlier stages of my adult life.
The bottom line is that having some kind of romantic connection is the only way I can see that would allow me to not be quite so distressed about my romantic situation, history and reminders of it. I need that kind of validation.
The_Face_of_Boo
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07 Feb 2022, 4:04 am
Yeah, I'm not going to try to cultivate a romantic connection here. Certainly not with someone who hasn't expressed any interest in one, anyway.
My feeling is that it's more likely that none of the women here have read this post and felt compelled enough to contribute something, which is fair enough. Not every post is going to receive a ton of engagement, and I guess the topics of discussion here are relatively narrow.
07 Feb 2022, 7:34 am
I don’t see anything wrong with seeking relationships here.
Problems arise when people don’t take “no” for an answer. That’s what at least some women are scared of here. Not necessarily the seeking of relationships, per se.
Saying “no” might have absolutely nothing to do with the “worthiness” of a guy at all.
I’m glad you’ve decided to take the “high road,” Grand Inquisitor. I feel like you will be successful, ultimately.
07 Feb 2022, 10:23 am
OP, this is something you could consider when you're a little older if you continue to be unsuccessful with women in your 30s.
I have a distant family who is my Grandpa's, brother's, son to be exact. He was a "different" kind of guy and I suspect that he's on the spectrum too. Growing up, he didn't really have a lot of success with girls due to a combination of his personality, poor social skills, and not so great appearance.
Anyways, the story goes is that when he was in his 40s, he met a girl from the Philippines on an online agency site that was designed for foreign men to meet filipina women. After talking for around a year, he took a trip to The Philippines, met her, and agreed to marry her so she could come back to the US. Obviously, it wasn't all out of love, but at least he would get a loving companion. 25+ years later and they're still together.
Now there are several factors to why the marriage lasted so long. His standards were reasonable and he married a woman who is around the same attractiveness level and within a reasonable age gap as well, he didn't go after some smokin hot 22 year old who was much more likely to use him or cheat on him. He's also not rich; he was a truck driver who lived in a small country town, so he had to find a woman that was okay with this lifestyle.
07 Feb 2022, 3:55 pm
I mean....that you're thinking about yourself in more objective terms.
That you have good aspects of yourself, and that you are seeking to broaden yourself, rather than confine yourself to one objective.
If I went solely by my "past" when I was your age, I probably wouldn't have had much of a future. We all have to start from somewhere. If that "somewhere" happens to occur a little later than for some people, it really doesn't mean anything. I didn't START going to university until I was 36. I didn't start driving with a license until I was 37. This is WAY after age 25. I had to START from somewhere.
Imagine if I used my "past" as my "precedent"? I did very badly learning to drive in my early 30s. Does that mean that I should have just given up?
07 Feb 2022, 6:18 pm
That you have good aspects of yourself, and that you are seeking to broaden yourself, rather than confine yourself to one objective.
I can recognise that I have good traits. I'd probably be a pretty good partner for the right person.
I've always sought to broaden myself, I guess now I'm just thinking about how much things that are negatively affecting my confidence are holding me back. I feel like I'll be in a better position to date once I address them, but I'm also recognising that I'm in a position where I'm being worn down by negative stimuli that I can't avoid. That seems to be more difficult to figure out how to deal with.
Imagine if I used my "past" as my "precedent"? I did very badly learning to drive in my early 30s. Does that mean that I should have just given up?
No, it doesn't mean that you should have given up, but I wouldn't blame you for doubting yourself.
07 Feb 2022, 10:34 pm
True. However, from a practical point of view, the only thing that matters is what you're doing to solve the problem. Your mindset is bad purely because it's not causing you to get the outcomes that you want. And therefore it's wrong for that reason.
This is the problem. You feeling like you need positive feedback in order to pursue something is what's holding you back.
I'm sure there are a lot of obese people who feel like it would be easier to maintain their weight if they all of a sudden woke up in tip-top shape. And there are people who say they'd do this and that if they had more money, but aren't making enough steps to advance their career.
