confidence

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Many people say that confidence is sexy in men-that its a useful way to meet and attract women. The thing is this: I find confidence to be sexy in a woman and thus I tend to like women who are confident themselves. Trouble is, this is an Extremely hard thing to find-well maybe for me it is cuz 99% of the women I run into are NOT confident. I want a woman who is bold enough to come up and introduce herself to me not because shes a gregarious person but becaus she's SERIOUSLY attracted to me! Thats my attitude . If you *like* me in that way then YOU(ladies)must at the very least be direct about it!
F*CK all that BullSh1t about "be a man and take the lead"! I HATE indirectness; which is one of the reasons I dont get along well with women.

well, it's a good possibility that there are a lot of women who want the man to 'take the lead'.

The sad fact is that the women are the choosers. They want to see how interested you are in them (well, some of them, anyway). They'll send subtle signals to you, and want to see you take the initiative. The important thing is that you came to them. What happens next is entirely up to them.

Many women don't just approach guys flat out because they feel that they're seen as desperate, or worse, as a slut. You have to put forth the effort, first.

Not much help, I'm afraid, but that's often the way it is. Try being friends first, it's less 'threatening', and eventually may develop into something more interesting.

That's what I used to think. However, unless the woman is interested in you from the get, all that will get you is locked in the "friend zone" with no way out. Any attempt will result in not only rejection, but loss of a friend and complete avoidance on her part.

You're absolutely right. I am a woman with AS, and I used to approach guys that I felt interested in. I have no idea how to be subtle, or give off non verbal cues to show interest. And they did treat me like a slut. It was so humiliating.

I've had similar experiences in the past. Whenever I've pursued a guy, it's resulted in rejection, and the perception that I'm slu*ty, desperate, crazy, etc. And yet I do get enough attention from guys in general to be sure that it was my actions, not my appearance. I've found that most men will only remain attracted to a girl if they have to pursue her; otherwise, they lose interest.

On the other hand, I've noticed that there are some women who are extremely outgoing, charming, and flirtatious. They seem to be able to approach any guy they see and get exactly what they want from him. Maybe that's the kind of girl you're hoping to meet? If so, I think your chances are pretty good because they seem to be abundant, even though they're certainly not the majority.

Its not an outgoing person who I seek as much as it is someone who can at least let me know in a very direct way that she's interested and maybe isnt overly paranoid about rejection. Here's the problem: whenever I take the lead women tell me that Im being "aggressive" and coming on too strong. The only thing I can really do is just to test the waters but that opens me up to being rejected. A lot of women complain about guys who they're NOT interested in hitting on them and then expect guys to take the lead . How the HELL are we(men) supposed to figure out whether someone is interested or not? If you expect US to take the lead than dont f*****g get *creeped out* if you get unwanted approaches-just make it clear you're not interested...its another matter all together though when a guy takes the lead, gets rejected and STILL persists. Now That actually is legitamately creepy .

If you look a woman in the eye, you will see whether she is attracted to you. You can also tell by her body language. It's really hard to hide your sexual attraction for someone. It's taken me a while, but I know whenever I approach a woman, how she feels about me most of the time. If she doesn't like me or finds me creepy, I get the vibe and stay away. I don't waste my time anymore on women who don't give me the cues.

I too, hate playing the masculine role, but I realized recently, I have to risk rejection. That's the only way I'm going to get the type of woman I want. I have to learn how to date like normal people date. Otherwise, I'm not going to get any. Nobody is going to change the unwritten rules for me, because I am uncomfortable making the first move.

I've had the most success flirting with women who give me the cues, letting them know I am kind of interested right from the start. Then, when she sees I'm not a stalker or serial killer, I bring up the topic of dating or sex, and try to hang out with her. One thing usually leads to another. This usually gets her to see me as a potential suitor rather than a friend. In fact, this approach is the only approach that has ever worked for me.

It's really hard to get a woman to date you after you become good friends. It's not impossible, but it is really hard. Then you have to decide if you want to maintain the friendship or risk it for a romantic relationship. It hurts. I know, because that is my M.O. I say friendship when really I want more than that. I've learned from not making the first move that it's better to do it and do it relatively quickly before the woman loses interest. If you wait too long, all you have is a friend, and you're frustrated, because you want a girlfriend. Then there are aggressive women who go after you, but you aren't really compatible with them. I've been in relationships like that. They suck.

Of course. application is better than knowledge. I got this advice about cues and making the first move quickly from an NT's who are successful with women. if I can just find the courage to use it. I don't think I have enough self-esteem just yet. Almost there, but not quite. I do know, I have to play by society's rules or I'm going to keep getting rejected. I can't do it my way anymore, because it doesn't work very well.

HellOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!! ! Im an Aspie, which means I DONT EFFING PICK UP NONVERBAL/SUBTLE CUES Bro!
I hate it how you *normal* "Guys" try to give advice to people about this sort of thing without bothering to understand that this is an area where knowledge does NOT automatically beget application!

D1nk0, one thing on that... when and if you do meet someone who's right for you and particularly if you really do know what you want - if she sees it in you, and if you can at least read that sincerity in her like she really sees you in the best light; it'll be natural progression. That sort of event I think is when two people can actually have a rare moment to ditch ego and defense just because it seems like something bigger is at stake. Those moments of course are rare but you want to do your best to recognize them when they're there.

Exactly. Women are always trying to gauge how interested you might be in them. Never, never let them be aware you're even casually interested in them. Showing interest is also known as dating suicide.

I think that's why when you see women who operate like that, don't try to hide interest for the sake of game but rather don't take any interest at all (I'd go as far as saying don't date em even if you can - they aren't worth the headache). They flat out aren't like you and when you do meet women who are, the qualitative difference in terms of mutual respect, altruism, and everything in the exchange makes you realize that your better off tuning out the Machiavellis completely.

What happens when I seriously can't get attracted to women unless I know them for long enough? If I saw a beautiful woman at some random club somewhere, I could acknowledge that fact that she was beautiful right away, but I wouldn't actually be attracted right then and there...

That only leaves me with the option of trying with any female friends I may have...

IMO, I think that men aren't taking some important things into consideration, when considering women as dating partners. From a woman's point of view, I would say that we stand to lose a lot more than a blow to the ego, if we show interest in the wrong man. Here's a list for you: Rape, disease, pregnancy, loss of reputation, as well as other physical dangers, such as assault, robbery, etc. I am speaking from my own experience. When I tried to make the first move on what I thought was an eligible male, I put myself in a position to experience most of the things on that list. Because of my being an Aspie. Cut us some slack, guys, Okay?

My experience has been it's hard to tell which women are "Machiavellian" and which aren't, but showing interest in a woman almost universally results in some negative outcome: her becoming more aloof, her playing mind games or otherwise messing with you, her being creeped out and uncomfortable around you, etc. One thing it does not result in is her becoming more interested in you or more open to things with you.

We are liked for our non-NT mannerisms, but we are engaged socially like an NT as soon as we infer attraction to someone. It's not our fault, this is conditioned from birth, barbie/ken and the endless consumerism, upgrade your SO with a new car, plastic surgery, a second home- etc. We are not mind controlled as such, we have other issues and concerns. They freak out when we respond with honest emotions, and expect the same reciprocation.

If thats the case, tell me WHY women feel perfectly comfortable flirting with guys they're not seriously interested at parties, clubs, bars, and sometimes in ordinary public places??? Isnt there a danger of sending the wrong message to a guy by flirting with him-that he might pursue you aggressively and even try to (sexually)attack you later on? Why is flirting, especially when the woman takes the lead, just play to women? So hartzofspace, I guess what Im saying is that Im NOT all that keen on ordinary women. Confident women DO exist and Ive met some of them but unfortunately in one case, she was taken and was from out of town . I HATE it when women flirt with me just to stroke their egos or to *play* cuz they're in the mood and my stock response is to pretty much ignore them and give'em the brush-off to let'em know that I am NOT into playing games! Women like men who are confident and I like women who are confident; WTF is wrong with that???