Page 1 of 1 [ 10 posts ] 

Mootoo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 1 Oct 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,942
Location: over the rainbow

19 Dec 2013, 6:34 am

Posting this here since it relates to having (or lacking) company.

And... well, as mentioned in an earlier post of mine, I just ended up all alone, and no amount of effort on my part will, it seems, relieve me of this. But... I noticed something, the short amount of time when I had everyone and everything, during my first relationship... I had very little urge to experiment with any substances, as I did quite a bit before that period. He did, but he seemed like a natural depressive (or, as the ending may indicate... just wasn't as happy with me as I was with him). As soon as he left, though... I did more than I ever did in the past (of just a particular substance, though, not a variety like in the past, in the name of pure curiosity... no, I just wanted to numb myself of the inevitable pain... in the past I used to use it to reach up to the heavens of the mind and perceive the best in anything I watched... this time it was just to get lost in my own mind without a trace, dissociated from the fact that I had just lost the single best thing I ever had in life).

But I have been thinking for a while... suspicious over the possibility that chemicals may simply be a replacement of what people lack (well, some - and this doesn't necessarily imply escapism). Specifically, though, something that occurs while people socialize... and I think it's more clear in the view that entactogens, a particular type of drugs that very much facilitate social interaction, purportedly enable the release of oxytocin, which is also very much involved in the closeness (the 'glue') that makes people desire such an interaction.

...discuss.



StatsNerd
Raven
Raven

User avatar

Joined: 10 Dec 2013
Age: 44
Gender: Female
Posts: 111

19 Dec 2013, 8:27 am

The research is shaky on self-medication w/r/t illegal drugs. I still think it happens.



em_tsuj
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Mar 2011
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,786

19 Dec 2013, 1:36 pm

It is simple behaviorism. Drugs are natural reinforcers. They reinforce in two ways: they give you euphoria and they numb emotional pain. When a person is in emotional pain, it seems natural to me that they would have an urge to use drugs. There are any number of problems that drugs can be used to alleviate. However, the drugs themselves are why people use drugs. It is the way that they work in the body to create "feel good" chemicals.

With other addictions (food, sex, etc.), I have to conclude that you are right. From research and my own personal experience, these everyday soothers are just that. They are substitutes for having a person there to love you and soothe you and help you process emotional pain. If a person is taught alternate ways to deal with emotions and problems, they will act out on addictive behavior less.



Mootoo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 1 Oct 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,942
Location: over the rainbow

19 Dec 2013, 5:13 pm

em_tsuj wrote:
If a person is taught alternate ways to deal with emotions and problems, they will act out on addictive behavior less.


Which alternate ways? Is it merely behaviour indeed, and no amount of physical chemistry?

In other words, are relationships not absolutely necessary, and drugs necessary in the absence of such relationships? Also... not sure if people have a different definition of 'addiction', but I wouldn't term my own usage as such... whenever I suddenly got relationships in my life I had really no problem just ceasing their usage. I use them in the way knives are used to cut carrots... clearly no one gets addicted to cutting vegetables. (I am, of course, mainly referring to the possibility of psychological addiction... my usage doesn't generally involve substances that make the body physically dependent... just hallucinogens, generally.)



jloome
Tufted Titmouse
Tufted Titmouse

User avatar

Joined: 19 Dec 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 35
Location: Edmonton

20 Dec 2013, 7:22 pm

If you study neurotheology, neurobiology and sociology there's a fair amount of evidence that what we term "addiction" when it comes to drugs is very much the same thing we term "belief" or "ideology" when it comes to group behavior.

They both affect the brain, which is neuroplastic, the same way: they reduce anxiety and replace with happiness. And because the brain adapts to what it thinks will do exactly that, we become addicted (if it's a drug) or believers (if it's group security).



Mootoo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 1 Oct 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,942
Location: over the rainbow

20 Dec 2013, 8:05 pm

Well, then... it's no wonder I'm not religious!



MjrMajorMajor
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Jan 2012
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,804

20 Dec 2013, 8:26 pm

It sounds very plausible in some cases, but perhaps slightly oversimplified. The biggest draw of my largest addiction (cigarettes) was the socialization that came with it, compounded later with physical and emotional dependency.



jloome
Tufted Titmouse
Tufted Titmouse

User avatar

Joined: 19 Dec 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 35
Location: Edmonton

20 Dec 2013, 9:02 pm

MjrMajorMajor wrote:
It sounds very plausible in some cases, but perhaps slightly oversimplified. The biggest draw of my largest addiction (cigarettes) was the socialization that came with it, compounded later with physical and emotional dependency.

I would say you probably drifted away from the social group before you quit smoking, if you have aspergers, as you'd have found those relationships trivial and therefore in rational terms unlikely to contribute much to your life, particularly security.

The neurotypical brain treats group activity as if it's a guarantee that the strength of numbers will be protective instead of self-harming, which we know often isn't true.



MjrMajorMajor
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Jan 2012
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,804

20 Dec 2013, 9:27 pm

jloome wrote:
MjrMajorMajor wrote:
It sounds very plausible in some cases, but perhaps slightly oversimplified. The biggest draw of my largest addiction (cigarettes) was the socialization that came with it, compounded later with physical and emotional dependency.

I would say you probably drifted away from the social group before you quit smoking, if you have aspergers, as you'd have found those relationships trivial and therefore in rational terms unlikely to contribute much to your life, particularly security.
.


I think there was a level of security in the feeling of inclusiveness, and regular intervals of it. Not so much a mentality of "security in numbers", but a security of an available acceptance and a set place to sit a spell.



em_tsuj
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Mar 2011
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,786

23 Dec 2013, 2:34 am

Mootoo wrote:
em_tsuj wrote:
If a person is taught alternate ways to deal with emotions and problems, they will act out on addictive behavior less.


Which alternate ways? Is it merely behaviour indeed, and no amount of physical chemistry?

In other words, are relationships not absolutely necessary, and drugs necessary in the absence of such relationships? Also... not sure if people have a different definition of 'addiction', but I wouldn't term my own usage as such... whenever I suddenly got relationships in my life I had really no problem just ceasing their usage. I use them in the way knives are used to cut carrots... clearly no one gets addicted to cutting vegetables. (I am, of course, mainly referring to the possibility of psychological addiction... my usage doesn't generally involve substances that make the body physically dependent... just hallucinogens, generally.)


My definition of an addiction is any compulsive behavior a person uses to numb emotional pain or feel euphoric. This behavior might involve the use of a drug of abuse or it might not. Why the person engages in the activity and the fact that it is an automatic behavior is what makes it an addiction. If somebody drinks moderately, that is not an addiction because it is not compulsive behavior. If a person buys a gallon of ice cream and binges on it deal with a break up, that is definitely addictive behavior. It is compulsive and it is used to numb emotional pain.

In regards to whether it is just behavior or has to do with chemistry, everything that you experience and everything you do corresponds to activity in your nervous system (chemical activity, communication between brain cells), so there is no distinction between chemistry and behavior. Reinforcement is chemically produced. People get high because a large amount of feel good chemicals are quickly released into the brain after ingesting a chemical. The body learns over time to associate the release of feel good chemicals or the lessening of unpleasant sensations with use of the drug. This is not something that you are necessarily conscious of because it takes place in your brain stem, not the rational part of the brain. It is automatic. All you experience is unpleasant emotion (loneliness, boredom, anxiety, sadness) and an urge to use a substance. Then you act on that impulse.

I agree with your statement that you use drugs like a tool. They are a tool. They are a tool for regulating our emotions. Humans are smart. We figure out ways to feel good and not feel bad. Because this is how or brains work, I think it is only natural that people would use more in times of loneliness, boredom, or grief. The drugs make these feelings more bearable. It only becomes a problem when a person loses control over when or how much they use and their use of a chemical impairs their everyday functioning.

I don't know why some people can control their drug use and others can't. It has something to do with brain chemistry and brain structure. For example, some people only lose control over their drug use after some major trauma. The trauma changes their brain chemistry in such a way that the high from the drugs helps them function (perhaps it numbs the constant anxiety). Some people seem to be born addicts. I am such a person. I several generations deep into drug addiction and alcoholism. I was addicted the first time I got high. I could not control it from the very first time. The percentage people on my dad's side of the family with addiction problems is unbelievable. There something in our brain chemistry that makes us susceptible to addiction in all of its forms. I think it might have to do with impulse control or the inability to delay gratification. Science hasn't figured it out yet. Other people gradually become addicted to a substance because they use it on a regular basis over long periods of time. Perhaps a chemical change occurs with continued use of the substance that leads to less control.

As to dealing with emotions, mindfulness, talking about or writing about feelings, staying busy, exercising, relaxation exercises, CBT, all of these things help me deal with emotions. I also take psych meds to deal with anxiety and depression. They help a lot.

I don't think relationships are essential. I also don't think you need drugs to deal with not having relationships. I think people do use drugs to deal with loneliness, but they don't have to.