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Well I guess Israel and Iran are at war now.

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kokopelli
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Yesterday, 9:07 pm

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:
I think Trump is going to exploit this crisis to try and convince the public that he's needed in power. :|


We should always assume that the Orange Taco is only acting for his own aggrandizement.



CherokeeDeathRose13
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Yesterday, 9:44 pm

kokopelli wrote:
CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:
I think Trump is going to exploit this crisis to try and convince the public that he's needed in power. :|


We should always assume that the Orange Taco is only acting for his own aggrandizement.


Yeah... I guess I didnt need a card reading to tell me that. :P



kokopelli
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Yesterday, 11:41 pm

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:
kokopelli wrote:
We should always assume that the Orange Taco is only acting for his own aggrandizement.


Yeah... I guess I didnt need a card reading to tell me that. :P


What always shocks me is the way his supporters consider his unpredictability to be some kind of virtue. I think that what it really means is that Trump has no basic philosophical grounds on which to base his ideas and decisions. It's like we elected a very deranged AI as President.



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Today, 1:10 am

kokopelli wrote:

What always shocks me is the way his supporters consider his unpredictability to be some kind of virtue. I think that what it really means is that Trump has no basic philosophical grounds on which to base his ideas and decisions. It's like we elected a very deranged AI as President.



I think a lot of it is celebrity worship that grew way out of control. Trump was considered somewhat of an American icon for decades and he grew a fanbase from the 1980's by styling himself as a successful businessman who supposedly got rich by being an a**hole to everybody, and he became famous for reality shows like "The Apprentice".

Basically he built his support from such fanboys who thought he could do no wrong because he was like a celebrity. It's like whenever other Hollywood types commit a crime and instead of the public wanting to see them held accountable they're quick to defend their idols.

Celebrities are to Americans like what the Aristocracy was to the Europeans. A status that comes with way too much privilege and wealth than some of these people clearly deserve.



MatchboxVagabond
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Today, 1:38 am

kokopelli wrote:
MatchboxVagabond wrote:
The only hope that Israel has is that the US decides to get bogged down in another war in the Middle East. Iran has roughly 10x the population of Israel, and Israel is using a bunch of weapon systems that they get from the US. There' no way that the Israelis can topple the Iranian government in any meaningful way with so few citizens. If the US pulls the plug, the Israelis would fold pretty quickly. Not to mention that while I do agree that Israel has the upper hand in a lot of ways, the Iranians were able to hit a couple of important IDF buildings during one of their rocket attacks and the proportion of missiles that are getting through has been increasing.

It's hard to say if that's a reflection of the Israelis throttling back so they have more in reserve, the Iranians getting smarter about how they use their missiles, or something else entirely.


I've yet to be convinced that the Israelis are trying to destroy Iran. They are certainly trying to destroy Iran's ability to attack them and that seems like an immensely good idea.

If Iran were to put their effort toward building their country and making it peaceful, then would Israel have attacked? Of course not. Israel attacked because of Iran's warmongering and their pursuit of nuclear weapons. They have every right to try to stop them on that.

I can't imagine that Israel has any expectation of taking or controlling Iran. That just won't happen.

Why are they attacking TV broadcast studios then? That's something that really only makes sense if you're trying to have a change of regime. The people can still get their news online, taking out the studios is a war crime and serves no purpose if you're not trying to have a change of regime. Then again, the Israelis have no issue murdering journalists. At least the Iranians are targeting legitimate military infrastructure rather than trying to murder as many civilians as possible.

Whether you care to acknowledge it or not, the Iranians are effectively the good guys here. They aren't the ones engaging in unprovoked attacks or intentionally killing civilians. There are a bunch of issues that I have with the way their government treats their own people, but for the most part, they aren't prone to wars of aggression the way that Israel and the US are.



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Today, 2:02 am

MatchboxVagabond wrote:
Why are they attacking TV broadcast studios then? That's something that really only makes sense if you're trying to have a change of regime. The people can still get their news online, taking out the studios is a war crime and serves no purpose if you're not trying to have a change of regime. Then again, the Israelis have no issue murdering journalists. At least the Iranians are targeting legitimate military infrastructure rather than trying to murder as many civilians as possible.

Whether you care to acknowledge it or not, the Iranians are effectively the good guys here. They aren't the ones engaging in unprovoked attacks or intentionally killing civilians. There are a bunch of issues that I have with the way their government treats their own people, but for the most part, they aren't prone to wars of aggression the way that Israel and the US are.


Methinks you have been listening to too much propaganda.



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Today, 2:11 am

kokopelli wrote:
MatchboxVagabond wrote:
Why are they attacking TV broadcast studios then? That's something that really only makes sense if you're trying to have a change of regime. The people can still get their news online, taking out the studios is a war crime and serves no purpose if you're not trying to have a change of regime. Then again, the Israelis have no issue murdering journalists. At least the Iranians are targeting legitimate military infrastructure rather than trying to murder as many civilians as possible.

Whether you care to acknowledge it or not, the Iranians are effectively the good guys here. They aren't the ones engaging in unprovoked attacks or intentionally killing civilians. There are a bunch of issues that I have with the way their government treats their own people, but for the most part, they aren't prone to wars of aggression the way that Israel and the US are.


Methinks you have been listening to too much propaganda.


One of you clearly has, although it doesn't seem to be MV. :chin:


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CherokeeDeathRose13
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Today, 2:17 am

Actually any time we see something in the media that provokes an outrage, that's propaganda.

All of us are being subjected to propaganda on all sides.



MatchboxVagabond
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Today, 2:39 am

kokopelli wrote:
MatchboxVagabond wrote:
Why are they attacking TV broadcast studios then? That's something that really only makes sense if you're trying to have a change of regime. The people can still get their news online, taking out the studios is a war crime and serves no purpose if you're not trying to have a change of regime. Then again, the Israelis have no issue murdering journalists. At least the Iranians are targeting legitimate military infrastructure rather than trying to murder as many civilians as possible.

Whether you care to acknowledge it or not, the Iranians are effectively the good guys here. They aren't the ones engaging in unprovoked attacks or intentionally killing civilians. There are a bunch of issues that I have with the way their government treats their own people, but for the most part, they aren't prone to wars of aggression the way that Israel and the US are.


Methinks you have been listening to too much propaganda.

Of course you think that. That's what anybody that's been propagandized would think. I take my information from a combination of sources and think about it critically. I don't know how you can come to any other view than that the Israelis, at least at a government level, are horrible. They've just done an unprovoked attack on Iran after countless crimes against humanity targeting the Palestinians. It's not even like they themselves aren't posting about this publicly. And that's the thing, it's not even me taking Hamas, the Palestinians or Iranians for it, the Israeli information that they're spreading about their own activities is absolutely damning.



cyberdora
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Today, 3:01 am

MatchboxVagabond wrote:
Then again, the Israelis have no issue murdering journalists. At least the Iranians are targeting legitimate military infrastructure rather than trying to murder as many civilians as possible.

Whether you care to acknowledge it or not, the Iranians are effectively the good guys here. They aren't the ones engaging in unprovoked attacks or intentionally killing civilians.


hmmmm..no..don't think so...
https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases ... bled-human
https://www.unitedagainstnucleariran.co ... ts-history
https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2025/c ... pters/iran
https://www.state.gov/reports/country-r ... 2021/iran/



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Today, 8:36 am

You're just helping manufacture consent for a war of aggression against Iran CD. You're being a stooge for Israeli extremists.


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Today, 8:43 am

kokopelli wrote:
MatchboxVagabond wrote:
Why are they attacking TV broadcast studios then? That's something that really only makes sense if you're trying to have a change of regime. The people can still get their news online, taking out the studios is a war crime and serves no purpose if you're not trying to have a change of regime. Then again, the Israelis have no issue murdering journalists. At least the Iranians are targeting legitimate military infrastructure rather than trying to murder as many civilians as possible.

Whether you care to acknowledge it or not, the Iranians are effectively the good guys here. They aren't the ones engaging in unprovoked attacks or intentionally killing civilians. There are a bunch of issues that I have with the way their government treats their own people, but for the most part, they aren't prone to wars of aggression the way that Israel and the US are.


Methinks you have been listening to too much propaganda.


no u



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Today, 1:23 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
You're just helping manufacture consent for a war of aggression against Iran CD. You're being a stooge for Israeli extremists.

Pretty much and as bad as Iraq and Afghanistan were, Iran would be several orders of magnitude worse. They aren't a particularly failed state, they have a massive population, one of the largest militaries in the region and rugged topography that makes invasions particularly hard.

I don't think that anybody that's thought things through wants to invade Iran. The terrain may not be quite as bad, but it's still bad and I'm not sure that they've yet got proper drone technology, which as we saw in Ukraine can spin up rather quickly compared with other types of weapons.



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Today, 5:06 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
You're just helping manufacture consent for a war of aggression against Iran CD. You're being a stooge for Israeli extremists.


If you remember the map of resistance I posted earlier, Iran's clerics are both fermenting instability by supporting terror and trying to expand their sphere of influence.

the last three clowns who tried this (Bin laden, Saddam and Gaddafi) were also left alone for years despite known support for terrorism. the west's inaction/apathy eventually emboldened Gaddafi to blow up a US plane over Lockerbie killing 270 Americans and Scots, Bin Laden and the Saudis we know were responsible for planning 9-11 and finally Saddam steam rolled independent Kuwait and dropped chemical bombs on Kurdish women and children. eventually all three were "deemed" a risk to the western security and had to be taken out
1. US bombed Libya
2. US special forces entered Afghanistan and Pakistan (the latter is America's so called friend like the Saudis)
3. US forces invaded Iraq

trump is currently threatening the clerics in Iran with troops and 3 warships warning them they are on borrowed time. I am not stooge for anyone, I am just observing how the US and Israel are being consistent in using pre-emptive strikes in order to neutralise a regime who threaten western lives in your country and mine.