WardenWolf why ban me?
When two users are trolling each other, if the mod is going to ban the second user, he will mind as well ban the person who started it too just to make it fair or else he obviously had something against the second person.
It's like a teacher only punishing the student who fought back to his bully but yet doesn't punish the bully too, only the victim. I have had that a lot in my school and the teachers just loved picking on me. But yet when I was younger, both of us get in trouble and they wouldn't care who started it but as I got older it be only me in trouble because the school had gotten so bad by then.
I can tell you from experience that plenty of people just plain don't trust the moderators, and think the only way they'll get a fair hearing is if they do it in public with people watching. It's one of the downsides of the silent bans around here, people are afraid of offending a mod in PM and getting banned without any recourse or anybody even knowing, let alone knowing why.
While I understand the feeling, just how often has posting a conflict worked? I can't think of any time it has (if there are holes in my memory, though, I'm sure you will find them
_________________
Mom to an amazing young adult AS son, plus an also amazing non-AS daughter. Most likely part of the "Broader Autism Phenotype" (some traits).
I can tell you from experience that plenty of people just plain don't trust the moderators, and think the only way they'll get a fair hearing is if they do it in public with people watching. It's one of the downsides of the silent bans around here, people are afraid of offending a mod in PM and getting banned without any recourse or anybody even knowing, let alone knowing why.
While I understand the feeling, just how often has posting a conflict worked? I can't think of any time it has (if there are holes in my memory, though, I'm sure you will find them
Made things worse?
Like members read about this stuff and get afraid of the moderators and not trust them being afraid they might be their victim?
That was why I never trusted mods here and why I hardly contacted them because of all these horror stories I'd hear by banned members or former members who left here. But I am afraid to say they were proven true because of my own experience. But I am finding out maybe I shouldn't trust not all mods just because I hear horror stories about a few of them.
It's like this, people go to a mall and shop, if they have one bad experience in a store, they assume the mall is bad and never want to go there again, not that one place.
Or someone goes to Burger King and didn't like the customer service there so they never eat at a Burger King again than realizing it was just that Burger King and it was flawed and the workers were just bad there and the manager wasn't following the franchise rules and the health department rules.
Taupey
Veteran
Joined: 24 Feb 2010
Age: 64
Gender: Female
Posts: 7,168
Location: Somewhere between juvenile and senile.
Moderators do show favoritism to certain members, for example, when seanmw started harassing me because I wouldn't send him money. He created a post in the adult section using another name and then proceeded to say horrible things about an older woman which was directed at me. So DW_a_mom comes to the rescue and deletes my comments and leaves the nasty offensive one's. She also states that I have made false accusations and how she knows everyone is happy to see them go, without questioning me first about what was happening. She completely ignores the evidence that I speak about in my comments that this guy has more than one member name (sock puppets).
Makes me wonder what her hurry was to rush in there to delete my comments as fast as she could and allowing that disgusting post to exist. It's appears she was protecting seanmw at my expense.
Everytime I am assertive and stand up for myself and the truth, I am accused of having a meltdown or being hysterical or my account hacked, why because I am an Aspergian and a Woman so I'm not allowed to stand up for myself and tell the truth of what is really going on and yes I have the evidence, what do you think, I'm stupid!?! I am 48 years old and I'm talked down to like a little child who can't control herself. How dare anyone throw the fact that I have Aspergers in my face and patronize me just because I stand up to someone who is behaving badly.
There is something going on here that's really messed up and someone keeps going out of their way and to a lot of trouble to cover it up everytime I expose exactly what it is.
What is he trying to hide? I know.
_________________
Whatever you think you can do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, magic and power in it. ~Goethe
Your Aspie score: 167 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 35 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie.
Makes me wonder what her hurry was to rush in there to delete my comments as fast as she could and allowing that disgusting post to exist. It's appears she was protecting seanmw at my expense.
Everytime I am assertive and stand up for myself and the truth, I am accused of having a meltdown or being hysterical or my account hacked, why because I am an Aspergian and a Woman so I'm not allowed to stand up for myself and tell the truth of what is really going on and yes I have the evidence, what do you think, I'm stupid!?! I am 48 years old and I'm talked down to like a little child who can't control herself. How dare anyone throw the fact that I have Aspergers in my face and patronize me just because I stand up to someone who is behaving badly.
There is something going on here that's really messed up and someone keeps going out of their way and to a lot of trouble to cover it up everytime I expose exactly what it is.
What is he trying to hide? I know.
I am surprised to see this post of yours. You are accusing me of conclusions I never reached and actions I never took. I can well document that with every pm I ever sent you, and everything posted on the moderators forum if I have to. There is a middle ground between saying I know with 100% certainty that everything you posted is accurate and saying you are 100% wrong. It's called, I don't know and I don't have the means to find out, but I should be as discreet as possible to keep her options open. That has been my position and you KNOW it. You can't accurately cry conspiracy just because you did not get the specific action you wanted, and that is what you are doing at the moment. I used my judgement best I could in trying circumstances to what seemed best for WP as a whole, and you as an individual. If I missed one post that should have been edited that doesn't make me biased, just fallible.
I'm frustrated. I spent HOURS with you on all of this. HOURS. I didn't get paid for that; in fact, I ignored my kids and my paid work to do it. I did it because I CARED.
Thank goodness I'm not a moderator anymore. What to make of all this is no longer my problem. But, geez, you really make me wonder why I bothered.
_________________
Mom to an amazing young adult AS son, plus an also amazing non-AS daughter. Most likely part of the "Broader Autism Phenotype" (some traits).
Like members read about this stuff and get afraid of the moderators and not trust them being afraid they might be their victim?
Well, hadn't thought about that, but there is a very valid point.
More specifically I'm thinking of the times a member managed to make themselves look so bad that anyone considering advocating for them behind the scenes basically had to write it off as a lost cause.
People who feel desperate have a horrible habit of not caring or noticing when they break the rules. So, what should have stopped at one broken rule and a warning, turns into 4 broken rules and a ban. What might have been a ban open to reconsideration after a reasonable amount of time, gets thrown into the permanent heap when the banned member can't restrain his anger and has to come back under a sockpuppet (which is against the rules) to rant about how unfair he's been treated. Which starts to look a lot less unfair when the person has just demonstrated a disregard for the rules by breaking the sockpuppet rule in order to rant. And so on. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.
_________________
Mom to an amazing young adult AS son, plus an also amazing non-AS daughter. Most likely part of the "Broader Autism Phenotype" (some traits).
That one in particular just kills me, though it's good that some of the mods have started setting up outside email accounts for the purpose of interacting with banned members. You know how things were when I got banned; the only reason I didn't go the sock puppet route was that I was clever enough to track down unlisted outside emails for some of the mods and communicate directly. I never liked the "well we might have lifted your ban, but now that you created a sock puppet just to ask why you were banned..." justification for permabanning people, we are talking Aspies here, and often it is not clear what precisely drew the ban in the first place. That you can't get into your PM box or communicate in any way once banned really seems to make the sock puppetry seem kind of inevitable, heaping extra punishment on those people just seems kind of sadistic. I mean without any communications ability how are you even supposed to know whether your ban is revocable or not? Don't even get me started on not even being allowed to ask about banned members when there's no way to know who's been banned either, I think my position there is more than clear.
_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.
- Rick Sanchez
That one in particular just kills me, though it's good that some of the mods have started setting up outside email accounts for the purpose of interacting with banned members. You know how things were when I got banned; the only reason I didn't go the sock puppet route was that I was clever enough to track down unlisted outside emails for some of the mods and communicate directly. I never liked the "well we might have lifted your ban, but now that you created a sock puppet just to ask why you were banned..." justification for permabanning people, we are talking Aspies here, and often it is not clear what precisely drew the ban in the first place. That you can't get into your PM box or communicate in any way once banned really seems to make the sock puppetry seem kind of inevitable, heaping extra punishment on those people just seems kind of sadistic. I mean without any communications ability how are you even supposed to know whether your ban is revocable or not? Don't even get me started on not even being allowed to ask about banned members when there's no way to know who's been banned either, I think my position there is more than clear.
Obviously, there was a problem. Which has been partially addressed but not fully, I know.
If someone does what superboyian just did, and says, "sorry but I couldn't think of what else to do," it is seen differently. But often people who create the sockpuppet to communicate just come and rant. They aren't asking questions, they aren't trying to get to the bottom of it. They're just hurling anger, and making themselves look worse and worse and worse.
_________________
Mom to an amazing young adult AS son, plus an also amazing non-AS daughter. Most likely part of the "Broader Autism Phenotype" (some traits).
I don't think it's uncommon to create a new account to reach the mods. Lot of people don't know how to contact the mods outside the forum and alex just doesn't respond when you use "contact us." There have been users that said they tried contacting alex and never heard back so they give up. Some others create a new account here to reach the mods and it doesn't occur to them to not make a post out in the open. Use the PM feature and talk to the mods. But what doesn't make sense is they make a huge fuss about it even if the user hadn't even made one post under their multiple account.
If I were a mod I would correct the mistake I made and ban their new account and unban their old one and apologize for my mistake like wardenwolf did. Lau should have done the same with justmaxx when he misunderstood his post because he thought he said he trolls here. I am not that literal with the rules.
I also think even though some people read "No multiple accounts, only one account per person" I don't think it registers in their head it also means you cannot create a new screen name if you want to start fresh and wanted a new name just because you got tired of your old one. People interpret rules different when they read them. Just as long as they aren't using two accounts at once, they don't see how they are breaking that rule. That's how I had it interpreted when I first joined here. Also the fact sometimes people create an account and they never get a email activations so they create another account and this time they do get that email and activate their account and they're in. They may not also see that as a violation they did because they never got a email with their other account to activate it. I don't think they should be punished for making that move. I think it's taking that rule too literal when you go that far to punishing. Even alex didn't have a problem with a user here creating a new account and was able to finally get on here because she never got a email to activate her account.
Funny story, when I created this account, I got told by one of the mods this was a multiple account but I told him because my two other accounts were deleted this is my only account and I have no multiples. But he still said the same thing so it was like talking to a brick wall and I just wanted to scream and throw my computer across the room because I couldn't get to his head this was my only account now because my other two no longer existed so therefore I have no multiple accounts. I think he was just giving me a hard time because he doesn't like me or he was just being that literal with the rules so to him it didn't matter if your account was deleted or not. But to me it's no multiple account if your others don't exist anymore and I do feel a meltdown coming when I keep trying to explain something to someone and they just don't listen. But then I realize it's not that they aren't listening, they just have their own perception on things, their own opinion and I don't always realize that because I keep expecting people to have the same thoughts at me and see things the same way as me and when they don't, I think they aren't understanding me and I think they are missing the point and then I go on thinking they are stupid because they aren't getting it when to me it's so simple to get. People have to explain their thinking to me for me to realize it's their perception so I do see we are on the same page but we just don't agree. And people have told me in the past "I do understand what you are saying but......" and they also say "I get what you are saying, I understand but...." and that is when they explain their own opinions and perception. Gosh no wonder aspies argue
But I did end up creating two more accounts because I found myself banned and I created league_Girl2 to reach the mods but that was banned before I even activated it so I created another account and I reached one of the mods but I saw alex was on IM so I reached him there and he uplifted it and told me who banned me. It was another mod for "multiple accounts" and I thought that was BS because this was my only account at the time. But now thanks to that I have three again and they are banned except this one. Now tinky has a email in her sig so I know who to reach if anything happens. But I know not all members are going to see it so they will continue creating new accounts to reach the mods.
I think there would be less of that if there was better communication with banned members, and it was clearer whether or not they would have a chance to come back or not. I view a lot of the posts you're describing as "parting shots", like they don't see any way of coming back anyway and want one last shot at who they view as their persecutors. I remember a poster who was a PPR casualty during the "crackdown" there who'd occasionally resurface explicitly to harass the mods who he felt had treated him unfairly; in effect bad modding technique created more down the road problems than it solved.
_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.
- Rick Sanchez
I have been aware that sometimes banned members will come back and spam this place or troll because they felt they were treated unfairly by the mods and banned unfairly. Same as when some come back and troll the mods in PM. I have heard that's what some did with sinsboldly. Maggiedoll told me and I recall someone else saying it too.
Every time I see a spammer here or a troll, I know it's most likely a banned member who is just upset and they felt they were treated unfairly. But to me it looks like that is why they were banned in the first place so I can imagine that is what other members would think than thinking that member probably felt he was treated unfairly so he or she is doing revenge. But the reason why I would know this is because I go on other forums and about every aspie forum you go to, you will always see a thread or a post on this forum and it's usually negative. You will even see some saying they were being harassed by the mods or got banned unfairly. I have asked a few of them how were they harassed and what exactly happened but they won't tell me. Either because they don't want to talk about it because it was too tragic or they blocked it out and they don't want to remember. Or they just don't remember the details because they blocked it out and moved on and they don't really want to discuss it because it's in the past. I would think they be straightforward and direct by telling me that but they don't. But some have said on the forums why they were banned.
I know of another user here who was banned and she said she let her husband use her account because he was banned and then she was banned because she let him use her account. I told her that's why she shouldn't let others use her account.
The thing with a ban is, no one ever feels it was fair when it happens to them.
I do think full explanations in the past were horribly lacking, and there has been a lot of work to improve that. Even so, no matter how clear you make it, people can have wonderful tunnel vision when it comes to their own behavior and they will still feel it is unfair.
I gave one poster every chance and every explanation possible, and he still came back just to spam me with porn. Some in this thread have the personal experience to know that I'll invest a LOT of time trying to get communication through, and I did with that poster as well. Unfortunately, sometimes there is nothing that will be enough.
I think the problem is that too many experiences like that can leave a moderator jaded, and you start to figure it is never worth it. A moderator needs to experience some successes in order to have the incentive to keep up that level of work. I was fortunate to have that, enough times I felt I really did acheive communication in the midst of conflict. But the effort takes a huge emotional investment, and sometimes the team just doesn't have it to give.
_________________
Mom to an amazing young adult AS son, plus an also amazing non-AS daughter. Most likely part of the "Broader Autism Phenotype" (some traits).
I do think full explanations in the past were horribly lacking, and there has been a lot of work to improve that. Even so, no matter how clear you make it, people can have wonderful tunnel vision when it comes to their own behavior and they will still feel it is unfair.
I gave one poster every chance and every explanation possible, and he still came back just to spam me with porn. Some in this thread have the personal experience to know that I'll invest a LOT of time trying to get communication through, and I did with that poster as well. Unfortunately, sometimes there is nothing that will be enough.
I think the problem is that too many experiences like that can leave a moderator jaded, and you start to figure it is never worth it. A moderator needs to experience some successes in order to have the incentive to keep up that level of work. I was fortunate to have that, enough times I felt I really did achieve communication in the midst of conflict. But the effort takes a huge emotional investment, and sometimes the team just doesn't have it to give.
I would not say that this is always the case. I mean I can only speak for myself here but I used to get upset getting banned and righteously indignant. It does stop after a while.
I have been banned for stupid reasons, for good reasons and for vague insensible reasons. I recognise this.
I will say though having been behind the other end of the mod panel that the imagine "power" simply is no there. Yes you can ban but you are accountable for everything. There is no position where you are allowed to be fallible. You have to get it consistently rights and be fair with the patience of a saint.
Taupey
Veteran
Joined: 24 Feb 2010
Age: 64
Gender: Female
Posts: 7,168
Location: Somewhere between juvenile and senile.
Makes me wonder what her hurry was to rush in there to delete my comments as fast as she could and allowing that disgusting post to exist. It's appears she was protecting seanmw at my expense.
Everytime I am assertive and stand up for myself and the truth, I am accused of having a meltdown or being hysterical or my account hacked, why because I am an Aspergian and a Woman so I'm not allowed to stand up for myself and tell the truth of what is really going on and yes I have the evidence, what do you think, I'm stupid!?! I am 48 years old and I'm talked down to like a little child who can't control herself. How dare anyone throw the fact that I have Aspergers in my face and patronize me just because I stand up to someone who is behaving badly.
There is something going on here that's really messed up and someone keeps going out of their way and to a lot of trouble to cover it up everytime I expose exactly what it is.
What is he trying to hide? I know.
I am surprised to see this post of yours. You are accusing me of conclusions I never reached and actions I never took. I can well document that with every pm I ever sent you, and everything posted on the moderators forum if I have to. There is a middle ground between saying I know with 100% certainty that everything you posted is accurate and saying you are 100% wrong. It's called, I don't know and I don't have the means to find out, but I should be as discreet as possible to keep her options open. That has been my position and you KNOW it. You can't accurately cry conspiracy just because you did not get the specific action you wanted, and that is what you are doing at the moment. I used my judgement best I could in trying circumstances to what seemed best for WP as a whole, and you as an individual. If I missed one post that should have been edited that doesn't make me biased, just fallible.
I'm frustrated. I spent HOURS with you on all of this. HOURS. I didn't get paid for that; in fact, I ignored my kids and my paid work to do it. I did it because I CARED.
Thank goodness I'm not a moderator anymore. What to make of all this is no longer my problem. But, geez, you really make me wonder why I bothered.
Don't boo hoo to me about your family responsibilities. You are the one who made that choice not me. I never asked you to be a moderator and I sure as Hell didn't benefit by you being one either. Your little MANIPULATION attempt FAILED. I do NOT feel sorry for you and I certainly do NOT feel obligated to you.
I presented evidence in my comments, evidence that at the time existed in the WrongPlanet.net website and still might. You chose to ignore that evidence when you quickly DELETED my comments in that post.
Saying and implying I am paranoid in that PM, and that my paranoia is the whole problem here, PROVES exactly what I stated above in my first comment in this post. That is rather immature and irresponsible of you to say and suggest something like that. You may get other people to believe and buy your BS, BUT I DON'T. Thank the Gods you are NOT a moderator anymore because someone like you has NO business in a position of authority.
So tell me, WHO are you really trying to protect here? You sure the Hell didn't delete that disgusting post DID YOU? Again WHO are you really trying to protect here?You have done NOTHING to protect me. My comments were deleted because I pointed out evidence. All you had to do was look at it and know what I was saying was true and YOU KNOW IT!
I have already offered to have my psychiatrist send a statement about my mental health through the postal service, to Alexander Plank, to verify that I'm not imagining things and I am certainly not paranoid. I have no problems with verifying who I am with proper identification or in person if he so desires either.
Unlike you, I have nothing to hide.
And one more thing DW, do NOT send me a PM like that ever again.
_________________
Whatever you think you can do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, magic and power in it. ~Goethe
Your Aspie score: 167 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 35 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie.
Last edited by Taupey on 29 Sep 2010, 9:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
