Everyone getting punished due to one person.

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There are 3 types of discipline:
1. self discipline
2. group discipline
3. imposed discipline.

The theory is you cannot have self discipline unless you know some other type of discipline. They are not allowed to impose discipline on individuals (or its too hard, at least in Australia) so they go the group discipline route.

Standard procedure. The military do it too.

Do you mean in Australia, they don't punish individual students in schools, they just punish a whole class for one's indiscretions? That is indeed the lazy way to do things in my opinion. Like most other lazy shortcuts, is it all that effective?

My example of the coach who used this method had possibly the worst football team in the area, which literally went 5 years without winning a single game. The records of the other teams he coached weren't much better. There could be other factors involved but still, his discipline methods could have been a part of it.

I think it's a stupid procedure that does nothing more than breed animosity amongst members of a group and towards the leader.

No, individuals do get punished, but I think a number of teachers want to use peer pressure/group discipline to do thei rjob for them.

When I was at (private) school, corporal punishment was common and regular (not really that long ago). Nowdays teachers can be reprimanded for sending a kid to a coner. To some extent I think its like "passing the buck"

I have a case worse then all of yours, one time back when I still played football my helmet got stolen from my gym locker and because my locker was already slightly broken and I didnt move (because I didnt figure anyone would use a crow bar too get into my locker) I got blamed for it. So when the coach made our entire team run up-dows (if you dont know what these are good) he made sure that everyone blamed me for it when it was someone else on the team that stole it!

That's completely ludicrous! How can you steal your own helmet?

It's a funny thing how hypocritical school officials and parents are. On one hand, they want kids to be immune to peer pressure so they won't drink, do drugs, get into trouble ,etc., yet they try to use peer pressure for their own agendas. That doesn't make much sense to me.

No, he wasn't in a wheelchair.

I rememberd his name. Mr barrow,

barrow, wheelbarrow.

Wheelbarrow, mean.

"Meanie Wheelie"

A lot of people were immature jerks then,

Oh every NT's an immature jerk nowadays.

It wasn't because I stole my own helmet it was because I didnt leave the broken locker that they could break into :-/.

This isn't really the same situation, but reading this thread reminded me of it and now I want to vent.

In first grade, we were eating lunch inside because it was raining, and we had a couple of 5th graders watching the class while the teacher went to the staff room to eat (that's how they did it in my school, seems weird that they would take that risk now). Well, when the teacher came back, one of the 5th graders told her I called him stupid. Now, that's an absolute impossibility. I didn't call anyone stupid, at all, and I didn't bear any ill will whatsoever to said 5th grader.

So the teacher brought me up to the front of the class and asked everyone to raise their hands if they heard me call the guy stupid. About 10 kids raised their hands. I ended up getting in trouble, and that's when I started to question myself and my memory all the time. I still have problems with that. Not to mention trust issues, since some of the people who raised their hands were pretty friendly to me, and I would have expected them to not raise their hands even if I DID call someone stupid. But there were a lot of other things that contributed to that besides this particular incident.

Most people perceive only what they are told they perceive. It's much like that episode of star trek where Picard is imprisoned and tortured by the Cling ons. The Cling on leader tries to make Picard perceive a certain number of lights that do not exist. That is, he tries to force Picard to say he perceives these lights, even though that number of lights do not exist. It's mind control. That is what the educational system is all about. The educational system was created to indoctrinate the masses and make people suitable for employment in the context of industrialization. Fortunately, some teachers are skilled and competent enough to interact with students in a way that teaches critical thinking, but such teachers are not the standard model.

I had a similar experience to you when I was a child in grade three. The teacher slapped me around a couple of times even though I had done nothing to deserve such treatment. I believe I have come out stronger for it because I know not to place an unquestioning trust in institutions or authority figures. Your experience was compounded by the fact that your teacher got the whole class to participate with her while she inflicted brutality and injustice. It sounds like she had such influence over the class that she was able to make the students believe something happened when it did not. I'm sorry that happend to you, or that such an experience would happen to any child.

One positive way to reflect on that experience is to think of it as a lesson in injustice that can make you stronger, and that you are now, as depicted by Captain Picard, one of those rare individuals who can't be forced to perceive so called realities that do not really exist.

I remember being in 8th grade (Kindergarten to Gr. 8 attended the same school) and there was this group of about 3-5 guys who would get other boys to do stupid things (about 10 idiots in this group). The straw that broke the camel's back is when some a--h--- stole the funds for the graduation trip and (sorry, I guess I should change that to straw_'s_) four boys were charged with vandalism. Their idiocy ended up getting the entire senior division's (All senior students were in 7&8th grade) afternoon recess cancelled. There were quite a many who were even willing to chip in to keep the offenders in a classroom. The teachers responded by saying it wouldn't be fair to the teacher's, firstly becasue they didn't want to be locked up with these kids (Fair enough, one of them was (is) my brother, and I wouldn't wish my worst enemy staying with him), and secondly because they wanted recess too! It was even worse for the Gr.8 kids because the offenders were in Grade 7! Talk about a screw job... There was also a teacher who used to (and still does) make a habit of punishing all the students over stupid things. The only thing she seems to get right is that it should be an individual thing. Things as simple as clicking a pen could get you in trouble with this one. There was also another teacher who substituted French. I got kicked out for showing her a grammatical error, along with all the boys for "pen clicking", which was odd, because there were only three students with click pens, and they were girls...

I think I come from a very odd district...

Oh, and sorry about ranting...

I've got a sense of deja vu because I'm sure I posted this somewhere on WP already but here goes.

In my High School days, someone allegedly stole 50p from a cash box in a classroom, I don't know who. It could have been anyone, from any class, but for some reason the blame was put on my class.

It caused a lot of trouble over a long period as the teachers made a big investigation into who could have stolen the money. Trouble hung over the whole class for a long period because of it, we were all tarred with the same brush. For example, the whole class was called to special meetings where they tried to get the truth out. Nobody admitted to taking the money.

But... it was a ridiculous situation, all for 50p. It was only 50p for goodness sake. The teachers at the school really badly needed to get a life.

This one didn't happen to me, but a friends class at high school.

Somebody alledgedly threw a pin at the teacher while she was working at her desk, head down, couldnt see anyone. My guess she saw the pin land. She said that if nobody owned up the entire class would miss out on their lunch times until someone did own up. This was at the start of the year. Around mid year, my friend pointed something interesting out to the teacher. There was a poster right above her desk held up by the same pins that was thrown at her, and one was missing, straight above her.

That was the end of that problem

I so so SO hated when they did that in school.

Zim: THE HATE!! !! THE ANGER!! !! !

G.I.R: I like paste!

One time we didn't get to go to this thing they did every so often in my school. Where they had what looked like a plastic inflated igloo, and they had a projector in there and it was like a mini Omnimax thing about the stars. Well I didn't get to see it cuz the kids wouldn't behave. I really think it's dangerous for the one kid. I certianly felt if I knew who the kid was, I'd teach them a lesson about behaving.

Actually you're wrong. I've heard Splinter, of the Ninja Turtles series, has done alot of advocating for his fellow rats. Even representing them in court.

Yeah, I'm joking. Still, the idea would be hilarious. Like Harvey Birdman: Attourney at Law