Toxic Positivity- "One Book Destroyed Western Civilization"

Page 2 of 4 [ 63 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

aghogday
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Age: 66
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,333

04 Oct 2023, 3:25 pm

KitLily wrote:

I think the article is click bait but it's the idea of toxic positivity that is doing damage to society. It's not just one book, it's got everywhere now in all the self help books. I've seen it in so many places, it's getting ridiculous. Hopefully people are moving on from it and realising positive thinking and the law of attraction isn't foolproof.




Trying to Brush the Shadows of Life Away By Repressing Negative Emotions,

According to A Study i Read Just today, Leads to Disease And Disorder For the Internal Stress That Creates;

It's Often Transformed into Somatic Disorders Ranging From Headaches to Even Dangers of Auto-Immune Disease.

All Human Emotions Serve A Purpose For Change, DarK Thru LiGHT; Regulating Emotions and Integrating Associated

Senses Are Surely Possible Through Meditative Activities Yet Trying to Repress Emotions as The Study Indicates

Is A Real Present Danger; Additionally, Hiding From the Darkness Won't Continue to Work; And Folks Who

Don't Develop A Spine Enough to Face it, Generally Speaking, Are Much Likely to Crumble When the Real

Dark Days Come; Of Course, Some Folks Just Don't Have the 'Hardware and Software' To Do it; Yet When

Possible, Becoming A Stronger Human Being though and through is Beneficial to Not Only Surviving

Life Yet

Thriving Together too;

i am Neither Afraid of the
DarK Now or Cynical of the LiGHT;

Yet Obviously, Other Challenges Are
Still Waiting for me to Adapt to As Well;

And That's Just Life For Everyone; No Pie
in the Sky Guarantees; Work Indeed Left to Do...

And
Play Too..:)



_________________
KATiE MiA FredericK!iI

Gravatar is one of the coolest things ever!! !

http://en.gravatar.com/katiemiafrederick


Mona Pereth
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Sep 2018
Gender: Female
Posts: 9,089
Location: New York City (Queens)

04 Oct 2023, 11:44 pm

Back in the 1970's, there was a fad known as Erhard Seminars Training (EST), which was one of the many historical embodiments of the larger mostly-American cultural trend that has been referred to by its critics as "toxic positivity." EST had slogans like "You create your own reality," and "You, and only you, are responsible for everything that happens to you."

It also gave rise to the following joke:

Did you hear the one about the gunman who robbed an EST seminar? After he took everyone's wallets, he said, "Now everyone, don't complain! Remember, you create your won reality! You, and only you, are responsible for everything that happens to you! Good night!"


_________________
- Autistic in NYC - Resources and new ideas for the autistic adult community in the New York City metro area.
- Autistic peer-led groups (via text-based chat, currently) led or facilitated by members of the Autistic Peer Leadership Group.


KitLily
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jan 2021
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,074
Location: England

05 Oct 2023, 4:23 am

aghogday wrote:
Trying to Brush the Shadows of Life Away By Repressing Negative Emotions,

According to A Study i Read Just today, Leads to Disease And Disorder For the Internal Stress That Creates;

It's Often Transformed into Somatic Disorders Ranging From Headaches to Even Dangers of Auto-Immune Disease.

...And Folks Who

Don't Develop A Spine Enough to Face it, Generally Speaking, Are Much Likely to Crumble When the Real

Dark Days Come;


I agree with you! Repressing negative emotions is not healthy whatsoever and we need to feel them all.

And I agree that people who don't go through difficult experiences won't have the strength to cope when real problems hit them.

Well said!

Also, I only just realised that you centre your writing don't you! I thought you were just trying to make a pattern. I didn't understand the centring til now! Talk about me being oblivious! :lol:


_________________
That alien woman. On Earth to observe and wonder about homo sapiens.


aghogday
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Age: 66
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,333

05 Oct 2023, 10:12 am

KitLily wrote:

I agree with you! Repressing negative emotions is not healthy whatsoever and we need to feel them all.

And I agree that people who don't go through difficult experiences won't have the strength to cope when real problems hit them.

Well said!

Also, I only just realised that you centre your writing don't you! I thought you were just trying to make a pattern. I didn't understand the centring til now! Talk about me being oblivious! :lol:




Thanks Dear KitLily, Hehe As Far As Conscious Pre-Planning
In writing Free Verse Poetry in Flow in Left Justification View

i Am Also Oblivious to What i Am Doing in Creating the Shapes

That Naturally Come The Way Some Folks Force Their Poetry into Shapes

That Way Yet mine Automatically Flows Deep Within FLoWeR UNFoLDinG More in Tune

With Deeper Reservoirs of Subconscious And Right Hemisphere Processing of Reality...

When i First Started Writing Free

Verse Poetry in a Meditative Flow

Like This in 2013, my Wife Asked If i Was

Using A Program on Google to Create The Shapes

And i Said No, They Just Flow as Waves on the Ocean

Creating Continuously New Shapes of Shores And True the Free

Public Dance i Do Plays in the Same Way of Letting Go of Pre-Planning

Choreographed Control And Truly The Experience is Blissful, The Reward is All

in the Flow

of the

Present

Gift of the Moment Now

And It's Always Fun to Put it into
Center Justification to See What Shapes

Come Next As They Are Still Unique Snowflakes

Unfolding Not Much Different Than the Rest of Nature Set Free FLoWinG

ThiS Way

Spiraling

As the Milky Way Does

Above As Nautilus's Build

Their Homes Below Left in the

Fossil Record For 300 MiLLioN Years;

Just A Finger Print of Above Below Again,

Getting in Touch With Nature Becoming Truly
Free Like the Other Animals, Fish, Plants, etc... ALL

WHere So-CAlled 'God' is A Tiny Three Letter Word in

Comparison to the Six Letter Word Nature in Flow For Real...

The Other Way of Life is Conforming to

A Truly Evil Three Ring Circus of Reality (NO THANKS) WHere

Currently, 'The Orange Joker' off the 'Batman Series of Movies'

(Another Artful Archetypal Story)

Is Doing His

Best to Blow

Up All That is Great About Life

Where LoVE iN Peace Still Truly Exists...

Not Much Different Than the 'Non-Sense Poem'
At the End of 'Revelation' in the Old Bible; It's A

Human Archetypal Story of the Villain Versus The Hero
That Continues

on in the

Battle

of
'DarK'

Versus 'Democrats' Hehe...

Yet The 'DarK' is Necessary
As it Stimulates the 'Democrats' to
Help Those Who Are Marginalized and Oppressed More..;)



_________________
KATiE MiA FredericK!iI

Gravatar is one of the coolest things ever!! !

http://en.gravatar.com/katiemiafrederick


KitLily
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jan 2021
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,074
Location: England

05 Oct 2023, 10:31 am

It's nice to see a creative person, Katie! :)


_________________
That alien woman. On Earth to observe and wonder about homo sapiens.


Summer_Twilight
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 Sep 2011
Age: 44
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,323

05 Oct 2023, 10:42 am

The sad thing is that we have a lot of therapists today who use toxic positivity. I feel like people are in pain and need to talk through their problems. However, these therapist ignore the feelings of the individual and assume that a silver lining can me found in every storm cloud. They also let someone talk about an issue once but then sweep the issues under the rug.



aghogday
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Age: 66
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,333

05 Oct 2023, 11:48 am

KitLily wrote:
It's nice to see a creative person, Katie! :)



Thanks Again, KitLily,
Pleasure All mine With SMiLes..:)


_________________
KATiE MiA FredericK!iI

Gravatar is one of the coolest things ever!! !

http://en.gravatar.com/katiemiafrederick


KitLily
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jan 2021
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,074
Location: England

05 Oct 2023, 2:23 pm

Summer_Twilight wrote:
The sad thing is that we have a lot of therapists today who use toxic positivity. I feel like people are in pain and need to talk through their problems. However, these therapist ignore the feelings of the individual and assume that a silver lining can me found in every storm cloud. They also let someone talk about an issue once but then sweep the issues under the rug.


Oh that is so true. A good summary.


_________________
That alien woman. On Earth to observe and wonder about homo sapiens.


KitLily
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jan 2021
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,074
Location: England

05 Oct 2023, 2:23 pm

aghogday wrote:
KitLily wrote:
It's nice to see a creative person, Katie! :)



Thanks Again, KitLily,
Pleasure All mine With SMiLes..:)


:heart:


_________________
That alien woman. On Earth to observe and wonder about homo sapiens.


vividgroovy
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 20 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 399
Location: Santa Maria, CA

08 Oct 2023, 1:17 am

Personally, I can't imagine picking up a book that un-ironically calls itself "The Secret." That's a huge "SCAM" red flag to me.

I do try to remind myself to think of positive things in my life when my anxiety gets me down.

However, I've also had my run-ins with "toxic positivity." During my struggle to find employment in my 20s, I was told that it was all my fault nobody would hire me because prospective employers could "sense that you don't really want the job." One person literally said this to me while reading a newspaper with a headline about the recession causing hiring freezes. Because it wasn't enough that I was willing to do low-paying entry level jobs. It had to bring me unbridled joy as well :P.

HOWEVER, some parts of this article have an agenda too, which has just as little appeal to me as "The Secret" does. Demanding ceaseless good vibes or else all your problems are your own fault and demanding ceaseless moral outrage or else all global problems are your fault are pretty much the same message to me.



KitLily
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jan 2021
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,074
Location: England

08 Oct 2023, 3:39 am

vividgroovy wrote:
However, I've also had my run-ins with "toxic positivity." During my struggle to find employment in my 20s, I was told that it was all my fault nobody would hire me because prospective employers could "sense that you don't really want the job." One person literally said this to me while reading a newspaper with a headline about the recession causing hiring freezes. Because it wasn't enough that I was willing to do low-paying entry level jobs. It had to bring me unbridled joy as well :P.

HOWEVER, some parts of this article have an agenda too, which has just as little appeal to me as "The Secret" does. Demanding ceaseless good vibes or else all your problems are your own fault and demanding ceaseless moral outrage or else all global problems are your fault are pretty much the same message to me.


Yes that is the attitude I mean- people telling you things that are out of your control are your own fault because of your negativity or whatever. That is harmful and ridiculous.

I didn't get the idea that the article wanted us to be morally outraged constantly. I agree with this bit (below) from it though, I've been thinking it for a while. If people are only out for themselves, focusing on their own wants, and never working together with others for a united goal, society will indeed fall apart.

Quote:
Society can't run with millions of individuals secretly trying to manifest their own personal desires, with zero thought about what their own personal desires mean for someone else.

That's exactly what's happening.

Indeed, millions of individuals are trying to manifest their own personal desires without the slightest concern for anyone else. It's driving the collapse of our institutions, from public health to education.


_________________
That alien woman. On Earth to observe and wonder about homo sapiens.


vividgroovy
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 20 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 399
Location: Santa Maria, CA

08 Oct 2023, 10:12 am

KitLily wrote:
vividgroovy wrote:
However, I've also had my run-ins with "toxic positivity." During my struggle to find employment in my 20s, I was told that it was all my fault nobody would hire me because prospective employers could "sense that you don't really want the job." One person literally said this to me while reading a newspaper with a headline about the recession causing hiring freezes. Because it wasn't enough that I was willing to do low-paying entry level jobs. It had to bring me unbridled joy as well :P.

HOWEVER, some parts of this article have an agenda too, which has just as little appeal to me as "The Secret" does. Demanding ceaseless good vibes or else all your problems are your own fault and demanding ceaseless moral outrage or else all global problems are your fault are pretty much the same message to me.


Yes that is the attitude I mean- people telling you things that are out of your control are your own fault because of your negativity or whatever. That is harmful and ridiculous.

I didn't get the idea that the article wanted us to be morally outraged constantly. I agree with this bit (below) from it though, I've been thinking it for a while. If people are only out for themselves, focusing on their own wants, and never working together with others for a united goal, society will indeed fall apart.

Quote:
Society can't run with millions of individuals secretly trying to manifest their own personal desires, with zero thought about what their own personal desires mean for someone else.

That's exactly what's happening.

Indeed, millions of individuals are trying to manifest their own personal desires without the slightest concern for anyone else. It's driving the collapse of our institutions, from public health to education.


How about a passage like this:

Quote:
...When you start talking about climate change and your friend changes the subject, they're doing the same thing. They're indulging the superstition that thinking negative thoughts can make bad things happen. It's better to ignore them.


The author demands their friends be interested in listening to their political diatribe. If the friend dares to change the subject and tries to have a say in the direction of the conversation themselves...well, they're DOOMING WESTERN SOCIETY.



PhosphorusDecree
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 3 May 2016
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,722
Location: Yorkshire, UK

08 Oct 2023, 10:27 am

The_Walrus wrote:
My mother believes in the law of attraction, to the extent of outright blaming children for their cancer.

I don't think it's nearly as commonplace a belief as the author states. Yeah, it's sold a lot of copies, but people don't read everything they buy, they don't believe everything they read, and they don't even remember everything they believe. I suspect the "soft" versions about optimism generally being more productive than pessimism (which sucks for a natural pessimist like me!) are more widely believed. Also, think it's worth pointing out that The Secret's readership is not evenly distributed throughout the population - it's much more popular with women, for example. I don't think those traits that the author picks out, like behaving inconsiderately or as if they are invincible, are more commonly associated with people who have read The Secret.

And in any case, its ideas are really easy to debunk.


I also don't think these ideas all stem from one particular book. They seem like just a modern spin on the very, very old idea that worldly misfortune is caused by lack of spiritual faith.


_________________
You're so vain
I bet you think this sig is about you


KitLily
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jan 2021
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,074
Location: England

08 Oct 2023, 12:30 pm

vividgroovy wrote:
How about a passage like this:

Quote:
...When you start talking about climate change and your friend changes the subject, they're doing the same thing. They're indulging the superstition that thinking negative thoughts can make bad things happen. It's better to ignore them.


The author demands their friends be interested in listening to their political diatribe. If the friend dares to change the subject and tries to have a say in the direction of the conversation themselves...well, they're DOOMING WESTERN SOCIETY.


I thought that was a metaphor for if your friend constantly changes the subject from real life things which are worrying you to something that's unrealistic and fake positive. I didn't get the idea that doing that was dooming western society.

Climate change isn't political anyway, it's facts.


_________________
That alien woman. On Earth to observe and wonder about homo sapiens.


KitLily
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jan 2021
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,074
Location: England

08 Oct 2023, 12:31 pm

PhosphorusDecree wrote:
I also don't think these ideas all stem from one particular book. They seem like just a modern spin on the very, very old idea that worldly misfortune is caused by lack of spiritual faith.


Yes these ideas are in loads of books now. The author of the article has just chosen the modern book that started the fashion for toxic positivity.


_________________
That alien woman. On Earth to observe and wonder about homo sapiens.


techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 46
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,692
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi

08 Oct 2023, 12:45 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Look up Rob Henderson and his concept of Luxury Beliefs.

I did, just now. Henderson's concept is actually quite different from the main topic of this thread, and not something I can respond to here without going off-topic. Maybe one of us should start a separate thread about "Luxury Beliefs" according to Henderson.

Okay.

Law of Attraction is a Luxury Belief, so I guess it's both on-topic and off-topic.


_________________
The loneliest part of life: it's not just that no one is on your cloud, few can even see your cloud.