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nominalist
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28 Sep 2007, 4:46 pm

GoatOnFire wrote:
Our courts I think work too much with precedent. It should be treated more on by a case by case basis. Nothing would stop them from trying, but is that really wrong?


On one level I agree with you. However, I can think of a couple of problems. First, court dockets (at least in the U.S.) are already overburdened. Limiting precedent would only compound that problem. Second, there is a controversy regarding differential justice. The same offense might be punished in vastly different fashions in various jurisdictions. Your suggestion would increase that differential.

Cheers,

Mark



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28 Sep 2007, 5:22 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
GoatOnFire wrote:
Can you prove that statement?

Absolutely prove that statement? I cannot absolutely prove most things, however, most people do work within a thought system riddled with bias, and that is logically an element of our nature. Without external forces to create or reveal dissonance then it seems logical that we will always react to data within the interpretations of our current biases. Moral biases seem to be the strongest if we merely look at the world and its workings as we are most likely to call moral biases truths without evidence.


I'll juxtapose these to keep it clear. Well stated here. ^^ But how does it address this? vv

Awesomelyglorius wrote:
Most people are not really really going to reflect that deeply or honestly unless there is a way to put their ideas to a test and through a fire. Most people will follow whatever answer they have already basically conceived for problems of this nature. It becomes more of an outwards statement of internal biases, which is not often a source of much good.


This is a board for aspies, I wouldn't exactly call us most people. We seem to tend to be more introspective than your typical John Doe. If there's a place for this discussion, this should be a good place. That last sentence ironically is somewhat of an outwards statement of your own internal bias. Whether that's really not good is once again a moral question.

nominalist wrote:
On one level I agree with you. However, I can think of a couple of problems. First, court dockets (at least in the U.S.) are already overburdened. Limiting precedent would only compound that problem. Second, there is a controversy regarding differential justice. The same offense might be punished in vastly different fashions in various jurisdictions. Your suggestion would increase that differential.


I'm not convinced that increasing that differential is really all that bad. Injustices would inevitably occur, but they already do anyway, and there is no way to prove whether that differential would increase or decrease the rate of injustice because injustice is in the eye of the beholder. The courts are overburdened, though. My statement was not calling for an elimination of precedent, I was just suggesting that we currently use the wrong level of it, for it can be abused.


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nominalist
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28 Sep 2007, 6:11 pm

GoatOnFire wrote:
I'm not convinced that increasing that differential is really all that bad. Injustices would inevitably occur, but they already do anyway, and there is no way to prove whether that differential would increase or decrease the rate of injustice because injustice is in the eye of the beholder. The courts are overburdened, though. My statement was not calling for an elimination of precedent, I was just suggesting that we currently use the wrong level of it, for it can be abused.


Such cases are few and far between. Pragmatically, the problem with the U.S. court system is its three-tiered system of "justice." There is justice for those who can afford the top legal representation; justice for those who just hire a lawyer; and justice for those who must rely upon court-appointed attorneys.

Regarding that last category, I tell my students a few stories which invariably leaves a few of them weeping.

Cheers,

Mark



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28 Sep 2007, 11:34 pm

GoatOnFire wrote:
I'll juxtapose these to keep it clear. Well stated here. ^^ But how does it address this? vv
By looking at the logical underpinnings of the system that I based these thoughts.

Quote:
This is a board for aspies, I wouldn't exactly call us most people. We seem to tend to be more introspective than your typical John Doe. If there's a place for this discussion, this should be a good place. That last sentence ironically is somewhat of an outwards statement of your own internal bias. Whether that's really not good is once again a moral question.
We are more introspective, but we are not so incredibly different from most boards. The last sentence isn't so much a statement of bias so much as a colloquial expression, the use of "good" there was not done with so much moral intention, but rather an indication that I believed that not much would result of this. I am not denying that I am biased, however, we learn our language patterns before we learn our thoughts, it is similar to how an atheist might still make references to God or a theist mention "mother earth".



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30 Sep 2007, 4:03 pm

GoatOnFire wrote:
Almost all of the threads on here are either politics or religion. I throw a philosophical one out there just for fun.

Imagine this scenario. A man commits horrible atrocities with frequency, including murder and rape. This man before he is caught has a bump on the head from which he gets amnesia and does not remember who he is. After the bump on the head he stops commiting these horrible atrocities and does not remember even doing them. Here's the question. He is caught because his amnesia made it so that he stopped covering his tracks because he forgot who he was. Should he be punished for his past misdeeds that he doesn't even remember?


If a man commits atrocities with frequency(murder or rape) that would mean that this fellow is a serial rapist/killer.
Such people belongs to category of sociopathy and psychopathy.
If a man gets amnesia,that wouldn't change his personality,just his memory.
So he will remain psychopath,but with amnesia.
Highly likely that,as such he would continue to rape and murder.

Many killers in history didn't remembered all of their victims.
But lack of memory does not imply lack of crime.

Killer with amnesia is still the same person.


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01 Oct 2007, 6:31 am

GoatOnFire wrote:
After the bump on the head he stops commiting these horrible atrocities ... He is caught because his amnesia made it so that he stopped covering his tracks ...


But there's nothing to cover up for after the bump, right?


If indeed the bump stopped him doing anything bad, the only remaining reason for punishment would be revenge.