Anti-Nazi Riots

Post Reply New Topic

Deleted

Last edited by Ante on 09 Nov 2005, 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Isn't there a line between 'free' speech and 'hate' speech? I thought there were laws against the latter

Yes the difference is that the nazis can call for the forwarding of white people living amongst other white people and even (as far as i know) pledge to 'repatriate' ethnic minorities if they get into power but they cant call for any violence or lawbreaking upon ethnic minorities as the law stands. This is to my knowledge though so as ever correct me if im wrong.

Id like to see nazi rallies and religious rallies that play music about the killing of a certain religion or ethnicity kept to a bare minimum of a few every year and no music played and less acceptance of the police from their rowdy behaviour, drinking and acts of provocation but dont think they should be banned as i think every group should be heard no matter how distasteful their view is to the majority.

It does get a bit sickening when every year i have to pass groups of people making music about killing the Irish and catholics and the drinking out on the streets (which is ilegal but the police seems to turn a blind eye to it) several times and it is intimidating and provoking.

The past has shown us however that a surefire way of increasing any groups membership is to ban their voice and not have the law protect them. Id also ban counter rallies or protestors because lets be honest they often use it for a punch-up and the nazis do protests and counter rallies themselves here throwing bottles and causing trouble.

What had happened though if the police turned a blind eye to the attack on the nazis and the nazis won the clash in the article, beating the women and the children into the bargain? Would the people complaining about the police presence be congratulating the police on a job well done? Mob rule is tempting but certainly no the answer.

Last edited by eamonn on 19 Oct 2005, 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The line of distinction between free speech and hate speech can be different for each person.

I have seen Christian groups picket about how certain people are 'unsaved' and will burn in hell. Is that free speech or hate speech? Some vegetarians have protests saying that people who eat meat and wear fur are murderers. Is that free speach or hate speech? Neo-Nazis say that white people are superior to all other races and that races should stay separate. Is that free speech or hate speech? There are groups who say Bush is evil because of the war in Iraq. Is that free speech or hate speech?

My point is there is no definite place where the line can be drawn between free speech and hate speech. What I consider hate speech, others might consider free speech. I certainly don't want my idea of free speech to be limited because some people consider it hate speech. If people want the right of free speech preserved, then they should stand up for it and protect, even if they disagree with what is being said.

Um, how about no Nazi rallies? "Oh, they just want to repatriate ethnic minorities and terrorize black people, that's all". And yes, they do still commit acts of violence, one of them against my parents by blowing up their's and other's brick mailboxes in their mostly black neighborhood because it was a wealthy one and they didn't like "uppity n-ggers who think they can act like white people."

I don't care what their official name is. It's all hatred and what better way to incite violence towards a group of people than persuading people to hate them? You know? The more I'm on this site, the more I think many of the people here subconsiously condone hatred toward people that look like me and I feel like I'm not welcome here.

And if you don't speak out against something, you might as well be condoning it because remaining silent and complacent allows Nazis, Skinheads, the KKK, whatever your hate group, to flourish. What happened in Nazi Germany and in the southern US was allowed to go one because people didn't speak out against it. Please, don't think just because this is the new millenium that people are all enlightened and this couldn't happen now. That's exactly what the Jews thought.....right before they were sent off to the camps.

Very true. Unfortunately people are afraid to speak up on the subjects that really matter for fear of ridicule. (Perhaps that's why smalltalk was invented?)

You are welcome here, by me at least ! ! As you have probably seen over the last couple of months, I have done my best to argue against various racist and homophobic members of this site (resulting in me being moderated a few times). I see it as unacceptable and I will continue to argue my point, even if it means overstepping the bounderies of civility!! !

arguing against racism, homophobia, etc. is fine, and is part of the TOS. personal attacks are not, they violate the terms of service, and will be "moderated".

one can argue against a point of view without attacking the person.

just so everyone is clear.

Sorry, Vivi, perhaps I should make myself more clear . I do not intend to insult Sean and Ascan, but I am not going to let Sean's threats intimidate me into inaction. I will stand and fight against people who I see as unreasonable and who advocate "unadultarated violence" as Sean puts it himself.

fair point. as long as you are fighting what is advocated rather than who is advocating it.

Come on then RobertN, explain exactly how you think my views are one of the above?

Neo-Nazis pay their taxes and are citizens of our society, just like homosexuals and femminiests, wheather we like it or not. They are entitled to their free speech, no matter how little we like it.

I'm not a big fan of them, but law is law.

/me shrugs

let them speak out. you can't argue against something if you don't know what the argument is. until you know why people think they do, you can't have any sort of debate.

and if you don't listen to the "oppo", it's fanaticism, fundamentalism and bigotry, just the same.

besides which, if neo-nazis are allowed to speak out, people can hear how bloody ludicrous and illogical their so-called arguments are.

That'd work if people thought logically

What worries me is that the current lack of racism is fashionable. And that someday the fashion might change, and all the people who aren't racist because it isn't politically correct will become racist when it is politically correct...

I don't mind them having their say, but they must live with the consequences. The fact that decent people feel inclined to throw stones at them shows that their views are almost as disgusting as those of paedophiles. Now you don't get police escorted paedophile marches do you......

Basically, they can say what they like, but I don't see why we should waste precious resources protecting them. Also, consider all the animal rights campaigns that have occurred over the last few months in the UK. Now, that seems to me a righteous cause, but the police are coming down on them really heavily, accusing them of "economic sabatage" of animal testing companies. What s**t!! !! !