Aspergers Vs Borderline Personality Disorder?

Post Reply New Topic

My ex had BPD. Her BPD and my AS conflicted constantly. I hated being her best friend in the world and knight in shining armor one moment, and the bane of her existence and the wellspring of all evils, the next.

How was she quantitatively different? People with AS can be hurt by their partners from lack of undertanding and that could seem like being the bane of one's existence. I just want to clarify this in my mind.

No, she would pretty much come right out and say things like that. You were either her greatest friend or her worst enemy. The swings would be sometimes violent. It wasn't just me feeling like she thought that way. It was kind of like having PMS 24/7/365.

I couldn't live with someone like that either. Erratic personality swings would drive me crazy, and I thnk would be bothersome to most aspies.

I have been DXed by someone who is "listed" as an expert in adult AS....and still have occasional doubts about the DX.(Other times,I am certain,I vacillate)I have a history of "psychological interventions from 17 for depression and at 26,chemical dependency.Most of the counslors have just DXed me with anxiety,depression.Though I have heard other terms being used as possible explainations....attachment disorder,abandonment issues,black and white thinking,intellectualizing of emotions.I found most of this psycho babble interesting but unhelpful.

When I stopped drinking....the majority of my worst depression lifted.I stopped cutting and stopped trying to socialize.My relationships stabelized(though there were few of them).Drinking from 17-26 had changed me from the socially disinterested person I had been through out childhood to someone looking for a "group" to belong and a fear of being alone and "stuck in my head" all the time.

Point being....there are things that can influence your "natural inclinations and personality".I drank to try and "be normal".People seemed to except me more when they and I were drinking,(this is obviously not just an AS issue,as our society has a long history of socializing and alcohol).It decreased my hyper awareness and personal insecurities enough to allow me to talk to people.The longer I stayed sober,the less I cared about having "friends" and the more time I spent with the special interests I had enjoyed as a kid and put aside(some what)to be "normal".The long I stay sobber the more "authentic" I feel I have become and I no longer fit any of the criteria of BPD.......it's not considered so easily "cured" not something that you "grow out of".


I did fit some of the "actions" of BPD.I cut,I drank,I had sex without love,I couldnt maintain a friendship for more then 6mths to a year.....the latter was not devalueing the person.They either left me or I stopped being "obsessed with them" but I never stop liking them as people or thought they were "evil"....I knew it was Me not them,that was at fault.I drank to overcome social anxiety,I cut because when stressed and depressed I would become so totally numb I could no longer stand it,I attempted suicide because I really thought it was a way out of the pain...not as a "cry for help"....I didnt think there was any help and believed my attempts were going to be effective.I slept with people because I thought they actully liked me and I needed a friend and it seemed the only time I wasnt invisable.I was never a drama queen and was very quit and reserved when not drinking.


So,perhaps it is AS,perhaps BPD,perhaps a mix of both?

If you have a neurological developmental difference, it will show up on a neuropsych eveluation. I look at NT personality disorders as disordered thinking not arising from a neurological cause. That is the gist of the difference. AS is apparent from early childhood whereas personality disorders develop later.

My ex-husband has BPD. I started going to a therapist who specialized in it because I thought it might help us and she ended up diagnosing me with "very mild" BPD. I never really agreed with her diagnosis.

Although we had some similarities, the differences were more apparent. My ex couldn't stand to be alone whereas I was always feeling very smothered and fighting for any and all alone time I could get. He had a really hard time understanding my obsessive interests and would get jealous that they took time with me away from him. I've always had a strong sense of who I am (what you see is what you get with me) and he seemed to change depending upon who he was around at the time. He was also a lot more emotional than I was. In fact, he called me a "cold b***h" more than once.

I suspect that many therapists tend to diagnose according to what they're most familiar with. The therapist I saw was familiar with BPD, so even though I didn't completely fit the bill, that's what she diagnosed me as. If I had gone to a different therapist who specialized in AS, I probably would have been diagnosed with AS. Many disorders listed in the DSM have overlapping criteria, which is why you'll see someone who was previously diagnosed with 8 different disorders before they finally found the right therapist and the right diagnosis.

What does the evaluation consist of?I have head that it doesnt show up on MRI consistantly enough,(some differences are seen in family members who dont have AS....)although there are some differences in severe autism(LFA)such as areas of the brain that are smaller.I know they are discovering some mirror neuron differences as well,but not sure if this is statistically proven as a marker.

Are you refering to "tests"(written or physical task orintated) or looking at what areas of the brain "light up" under different stimulation(seeing faces and such)?

As far as children having personality disorders.....I think some can under enough negative environmental stressors?I was in foster care from 2-5 and wonder what effects that had on me.I was very much a "strange kid" according to the family that adopted me....they tried to "train" it out of me....but I am still a pretty "odd" adult,although functional.

A neuro difference will show up on a standard IQ test like the WISC where the performance IQ will be lower - sometimes much lower - than the verbal IQ in AS and NVLD. It is somewhat harder to DX in an adult so having an account of your early childhood is also needed. There are specialized neuro tests involving lines and blocks to see if you have right hemisphere damage and other types of brain differences. These are adminstered 1 on 1 having you do various tasks or look at things to see if you can find embedded figures and such.

A therapist is usually not qualified to administer these kinds of tests so you need to see a developmental or neuropsychologist instead.

It would be so fascinating to do an fMRI study on people with ASD and NTs, though, to see if the same areas of the brain light up while they're looking at faces vs. objects, or if there is the same amount of activation. Also to see what the areas of activation are in people while they are thinking about/working on their special interests. Maybe it's the same as in NTs who are having a really positive social encounter, or something like that.

.


They have done some research in this area.Try and goggle "Sciencedaily"....they have listed some interesting studies (look under .........."autism"

One thing they discovered that a different area lights up when autistics see faces.....they see them in the area of "objects" and NT see then in a special area.There is also recent research indicating that the "mirror neurons" are effected in autism...they call this the..."monkey see,monkey do" nurons.It is believed that NT's learn by modelling behavior of other NT's and Au/AS do not.
Anoth recent indicator appears to be that people with AS tend to have a smaller area that connects the two hemispheres but use more areas of their brains.(more white matter,less grey ares?something like this......)

Anyway,dont rely on my poor memory....goggle.....Dailyscience,great web site.

I had similar problems picking up on guys' motivations, and ended up coming up with tests that other people thought were silly before I'd sleep with a guy. Of course, I was much more prudish than most people around me, because I knew that I couldn't have sex without it affecting me emotionally.

I'm suspecting that my therapist also has me down as having a history of drug abuse when the reality is that I just went along with what everyone else was doing unless there was a good reason not to (ie, needing to drive, or having to pass a drug test at work), and I was always the one who would nurse one beer all night, or take one hit when everyone else was taking 2 or more. I was never an addict, but I was frequently surrounded by people who had substance abuse issues, because they didn't care if I wasn't quite normal.

Switched, the type of social echoing you are describing is common in women with AS. Have you read Attwood's "The Complete Guide to Asperger's Syndrome?"

Yes, that's actually the book that first gave me a clue I might be an Aspie.

I posted about the BPD vs AS issue in my lj, and here's what people said in response:
"when i met you a couple of times i honestly felt you had Aspeger's. i know a couple of folks with BPD and that's not the impression from you at all. However, you tended to avoid eye contact and could sometimes miss social cues from other people. Some of your speech and at times seemed detattched emotionally from what you are saying. These behaviors cued me to Asperger's. Please don't take that as an insult, but an observation. And its not like you do it all the time, but enough that its notable. And its okay, I love you inspite of quirks."

and

"I'm pretty familliar with BPD, and from what I remember that just doesn't sound like you. The people I know with BPD issues have boundary problems but tend to be manipulative in a calculated way that I've never seen you display... and, I don't mean this to sound mean, but I'm not sure you pick up on subtle social signals well enough to behave in that way even if you wanted to."

The first comment is from a friend who I mostly know online but have hung out with several times in real life, the second is from a former co-worker. Both of them have spent more time with me than my therapist has, and have seen me in different situations, and aren't just going by what I say about things. I just hope I can get my therapist to take my questioning seriously and not just dismiss it as me being in denial and thinking I don't need help.

how could you be two people at once? can someone please explain it to me?????? you wake up one day and your name isnt john anymore its paul?

I am waiting fot them to call me, will take part in that kind of study