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Kilroy
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19 Aug 2008, 11:37 am

Ishmael wrote:
I'm actually quite serious about this... and possibly mad.

The Catholic church asserts there is a god; the pope is the representative of god.
God, by their claims, is responsible for everything on Earth - good and bad.
So, to what ends are god responsible?

I am endeavouring to determine a financial amount that god would owe humanity in suffering. After all every rape, pillage, war, death, injury, disability, etc. would be caused by him.
The church cannot contend with this and still claim god exists. By claiming an omnipotent, all-powerful being, and ackowledging themselves as reprsentatives of this being, they admit responisibilty.

Ladies and gentlemen, I am going to sue god. Wish me luck.


good on you man-sue that sob



Sand
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19 Aug 2008, 11:57 am

Naw! Don't blame God. He doesn't control tree roots - or very much else, it seems.



Kilroy
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19 Aug 2008, 12:03 pm

true...

hmmm well maybe Cernunnos could do something
or Odin...Rhiannon
there are all sorts of better Gods and Goddesses out there, who don't do that much but they are not there too
and that's what you are expected to know going into paganism



monty
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19 Aug 2008, 1:41 pm

Keith wrote:

4) The world NEEDS suffering. Think about this one long and hard and maybe you will see how true it is


No, we don't. Does a symphony need a cacophony of noise to be beautiful? Would some nails on the chalkboard improve Mozart's best work? I don't think so.

More Good, Less Bad. Turn it up to 11!



greenblue
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19 Aug 2008, 2:15 pm

slowmutant wrote:
We have free will and as such we can make all sorts of claims as to why we do the horrible things we do. In these cases, God is the convenient excuse, the handy pretext for sanctifiying bloodshed, for beatifying war and making saints of warmongers.

well, how about this other convenient excuse,
"The Devil made me do it"


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i_Am_andaJoy
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19 Aug 2008, 2:27 pm

yeah, why not sue the devil?


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TallyMan
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19 Aug 2008, 2:48 pm

i_Am_andaJoy wrote:
yeah, why not sue the devil?


Apparently the devil has got better lawyers :lol:



skafather84
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19 Aug 2008, 3:07 pm

Ishmael wrote:
I'm actually quite serious about this... and possibly mad.

The Catholic church asserts there is a god; the pope is the representative of god.
God, by their claims, is responsible for everything on Earth - good and bad.
So, to what ends are god responsible?

I am endeavouring to determine a financial amount that god would owe humanity in suffering. After all every rape, pillage, war, death, injury, disability, etc. would be caused by him.
The church cannot contend with this and still claim god exists. By claiming an omnipotent, all-powerful being, and ackowledging themselves as reprsentatives of this being, they admit responisibilty.

Ladies and gentlemen, I am going to sue god. Wish me luck.



something has to exist first before you can sue it. target the organization of the catholic church if you wanna go for a source. i think you may even have some legal points under italy's laws with regards to teaching stated lies in relation to what the catholic church teaches about contraceptives and disease prevention with regards to sex.



slowmutant
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19 Aug 2008, 3:46 pm

greenblue wrote:
slowmutant wrote:
We have free will and as such we can make all sorts of claims as to why we do the horrible things we do. In these cases, God is the convenient excuse, the handy pretext for sanctifiying bloodshed, for beatifying war and making saints of warmongers.

well, how about this other convenient excuse,
"The Devil made me do it"


That's another perennial favourite. Another cop-out.



Barracuda
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19 Aug 2008, 8:05 pm

TallyMan wrote:
i_Am_andaJoy wrote:
yeah, why not sue the devil?


Apparently the devil has got better lawyers :lol:
Well, Daniel Webster beat him...

I think jurisdiction is the greatest problem. Followed by the charges. How many counts of what?


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Ishmael
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20 Aug 2008, 8:38 am

Perhaps if I were to replace the word god with Lenny it might help.
The church say lenny is real. The church says we can't see nor hear lenny, but lenny authorizes them to speak on his behalf. As official representatives of lenny, they are liable.

It's really about teaching the church a lesson. The Nazi pope labelled my research as evil in his "new seven sins" speech. These people have no right to comment on my work.
They cannoot claim the things they do without accepting responsibility. I don't believe anybody sitting in a palace and wearing a dresshas any right to tell me what is right or wrong without living my life. They've no right to preach about a loving all powerful god with a plan with genocides rapes and murders going ok. They claim to speak for that god.
Erego: by suing them, I'm suing god.

I don't believe in god, but I do believe anybody who says all things are with a purpose, should pay if that purpose involves destruction. If I just decided to blow up a building or kill someone, I would be held responsible. So why.
Wlold a being supposedly greater than me get off scot free?

Btw; that was really hard to type on my iPhone!! !


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slowmutant
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20 Aug 2008, 8:45 am

Ishmael wrote:
Perhaps if I were to replace the word god with Lenny it might help.
The church say lenny is real. The church says we can't see nor hear lenny, but lenny authorizes them to speak on his behalf. As official representatives of lenny, they are liable.

It's really about teaching the church a lesson. The Nazi pope labelled my research as evil in his "new seven sins" speech. These people have no right to comment on my work.
They cannoot claim the things they do without accepting responsibility. I don't believe anybody sitting in a palace and wearing a dresshas any right to tell me what is right or wrong without living my life. They've no right to preach about a loving all powerful god with a plan with genocides rapes and murders going ok. They claim to speak for that god.
Erego: by suing them, I'm suing god.

I don't believe in god, but I do believe anybody who says all things are with a purpose, should pay if that purpose involves destruction. If I just decided to blow up a building or kill someone, I would be held responsible. So why.
Wlold a being supposedly greater than me get off scot free?

Btw; that was really hard to type on my iPhone!! !


You have a child's understanding of religion.



Sand
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20 Aug 2008, 9:34 am

One must become as a child to grasp the full depth of reality.



Ishmael
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20 Aug 2008, 11:08 pm

"a chillds understandingu of religion"
You know me so well, eh?
Then by your logic could children be considered religious?
Besides which; I knnow a pretty high level of intelligen e
Is required to undErstand quantum particles, how smart must you be to stubbornly stick to the beliefs whatever culture you are a part of has inndoctrinated you with?
Personally I prefer a mathematical universe than one manipulated by sky people.
You realize the notion of heaven was not a deeply thought out concept but the imaginings of primatives when they saw cloud structures of heavy and liight cloud interspersed with sunlight?
How smart must you be to cling to the belieefs of savages? Ever read the bible, or do you just mimic what your preacher tells you? Read the part where god f***is with job, or when he tells people to go and rape the little babalonyan girls.
How much understanding, as you put it, is needed to whitewash that bit and pretend your god is loving and benevolent? Dixd you know the bible says Jesus and a group of virgin Jews were the only ones allowed in heaven, or do you conveniently "undersattand"hey, you k ow god was just kidding.
I'd say you've a childs understanding, the same you've had since you were a child. You've just yet to grow out of it.
Next time try to make an argument that amounts to more fthan "na-in"


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20 Aug 2008, 11:30 pm

problems
a) Jurisdiction.
b) summons
c) immunity
d) fall out

end effect
a) You'll find it remarkable hard to sue people in another country.
b) the legal system in your area must pay transport costs and must convince the remote authorities there to enable your legal action.(ie: they have to be willing to extradite). The loser will end up paying these costs.
c) the representatives you would be suing would have diplomatic immunity. The state of new york cannot even get diplomats to pay parking tickets, though they try.
d) your law suit will imply you are under the aegis of those religious authorities who will promptly use their hot shot lawyers and billion dollar war chest to sue your puny ass.

In short, good luck.. ha!


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Ishmael
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20 Aug 2008, 11:39 pm

I never said I'd succeed, but if I can at least educate some people on the fallacies of chrch and religion, all the while thorougly embarrassing the church that a lowly scientist dares challenge magic men and sooth Sayers at logic, should be fun.


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