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Henriksson
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20 Mar 2009, 2:27 am

Pook wrote:
Science has been wrong before and still will be. Scientists are still finding new species and have found animals later once thought extinct. So how can science be the only measure one uses to determine truth when I suppose you would say its' truth is relative.

8O

Unbelievable...

Let me ask you, how many times have unsupported belief been correct?

Scientists operate on the prospect of perhaps being incorrect, assuming science must ALWAYS be correct is a distortion.


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Henriksson
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20 Mar 2009, 2:28 am

Henriksson wrote:
phil777 wrote:
Meh, i believe in it, why not? Science isn't as perfect as the humans who create it. There is often bound to be some things that we cannot explain by pure logic and deduction. Every way of thinking has its limits, science is mostly used because it is a useful tool. If we are smart, we won't turn it into a dogma that it is the penultimate way of seeing the world and that all others are void, doing so would be no different than going back to the middle ages and proclaiming religion is the only way. <.<

So you just submit to ignorance? That seems silly to me. Understand this: Science isn't perfect, but it's the most correct way we have to understand the world around us. Granted, our means of observation aren't fault-free, but it's really the only thing we can rely on. I mean, the world might be destroyed and recreated every thursday by a cat, it's just that noone notices. We might be brains in a vat for all I care. But the bottom line is that science is the most reliable way of observing reality we have. Do you know why science is a useful tool? It actually yields results, which beliefs cannot substantiate.

Also, nobody has addressed this yet.


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monkees4va
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20 Mar 2009, 4:19 am

TallyMan wrote:
monkees4va wrote:
my grans urn keeps moving around the glas shelf on the wall. my grandad, convinced it kept moving, marked it with a red mark using a marker. The next day it had moved one centimeter. It keeps moving, and my grandfather cannot reach the shelf without help (he is very old) from the people who take care of him (he lives in an apartment block 'home' for stable independant seniors). They have to get a stepladder and do it themselves now, as his back is really bad. Its still moving, and has been for years.
So, let science give me an infallible explaniation and ruin my beliefs huh?
Nobody has been able to so far.


It is this sort of thing that gives people a belief in magic instead of logic. I would expect that if the urn was monitored with a video surveillance system the urn would either not move, or move in predictable ways e.g. when someone slammed a door which made a vibration in the wall which made the urn move on the slippery glass surface. The shelf may not be exactly level either which could aid its movement in such circumstances. Typically when such events are monitored in a controlled scientific way the causes tend to be very mundane.

As for the world being a dim and frightful place without magic, the real word and science have their own beauty without need for fantasy. The more science penetrates into the true nature of reality the more profound, fascinating and beautiful the world reveals itself to be.

Stick with your delusions of religion or magic though if it makes you feel happier. Don't let reality spoil it for you.


considering it moves in a circle, and the laws of physics would not allow that unless it was moved by something, I will. I care not for reality half the time, it's too predictable and takes the fun out of life. I never said anything about fairies :roll: :lol:


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Fnord
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20 Mar 2009, 10:08 am

phil777 wrote:
Making people laugh is magic too, don't you think? (not directed at above poster)

No. It's called psych-social manipulation. There is no such thing as magic.


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greenblue
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20 Mar 2009, 1:32 pm

Yes, there is....

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBQLq2VmZcA[/youtube]


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Fnord
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20 Mar 2009, 1:36 pm

I am not fooled by trick photography and cheap special effects.

You might be, but I'm not.


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history_of_psychiatry
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20 Mar 2009, 6:31 pm

I'm not quite a wiccan but I'm rather pantheistic and believe in many aspects of paganism.


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history_of_psychiatry
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20 Mar 2009, 6:31 pm

I'm not quite a wiccan but I'm rather pantheistic and believe in many aspects of paganism.


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greenblue
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20 Mar 2009, 8:40 pm

Fnord wrote:
Just because you don't know what "The Truth" is - and maybe there's even no way you could ever know "The Truth" - it doesn't make any one of your opinions truthful or even valid. It just makes ALL of your opinions WRONG!

hmmm, I believe that should be a line of mine, I should have use that as a signature a long ago, why didn't I think of it before?


Fnord wrote:
I am not fooled by trick photography and cheap special effects.

You might be, but I'm not.

well, if I pay for it, I expect a good show.


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solinoure
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21 Mar 2009, 12:11 am

It is my firm belief that the wizards and druids and shamen of old were a role filled by aspies.

I mean think about wizard traits.
"Beware of wizards for they are subtle and quick to anger."
Sugests the different world perspective and the potential for meltdowns.

"Do not look into a wizards eyes for he can see your soul - and worse yet, you can see his."
We all know about the apie looking into the eyes thing - it can be as disconcerting to the aspie as the NT.

The have arcne interests.
Read special interests

They are apart from the ordinary life, usually in towers in far away enchanted forests.
Nuff' said.

Magic and AS have some deep relations...



Henriksson
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21 Mar 2009, 6:30 am

solinoure wrote:
It is my firm belief that the wizards and druids and shamen of old were a role filled by aspies.

I mean think about wizard traits.
"Beware of wizards for they are subtle and quick to anger."
Sugests the different world perspective and the potential for meltdowns.

"Do not look into a wizards eyes for he can see your soul - and worse yet, you can see his."
We all know about the apie looking into the eyes thing - it can be as disconcerting to the aspie as the NT.

The have arcne interests.
Read special interests

They are apart from the ordinary life, usually in towers in far away enchanted forests.
Nuff' said.

Magic and AS have some deep relations...

And then modern recording equipment came along, and the aspies suddenly lost all their magical abilities. What a coincidence.


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solinoure
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21 Mar 2009, 10:41 am

phil777 wrote:
Making people laugh is magic too, don't you think? (not directed at above poster)


Humor is one of the most powerfull magics there are. Both the abilities to make laugh and see humor... whereever...