The problem of Nazi/Mandatory vaxx and mask comparisons

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shlaifu
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08 Feb 2022, 10:18 pm

Aspie1 wrote:

ironpony wrote:

That's a good point. But since the government cannot force it on them, why do they continue with the lockdowns still? Why don't they just throw in the towel and say we tried to get them to take it and they won't so we lost, and tough for us? Why not just give up on it? The democratic way is to keeping asking and insisting hoping a no will turn into a yes?

That's because Democrats know that there'll always be sheeple buying into their lies, the lies that finished serving their purpose back November 2020 when Biden won. So they have a lot to gain from pushing the lockdowns and the masks, since a lot of people continue falling for it and worshipping the Covid god, his son Anthony Fauci, and the holy ghost Antifa. And as long as the sheeple keep falling for the lies, the Democrats keep pushing them.

As for QAnon'ers like me, they're a minority. QAnon'ers may reject the propaganda and see through the Democrats' lies, but there isn't enough of them right now. Which means there'll is no critical mass needed to make the lies---or better yet, the entire Democrat party---disappear. As a result, Democrats see QAnon'ers as a nuisance, rather than a threat. And other than paying Facebook, Google, and the rest of Big Tech censor the real truth about the Election Infection, they do little to nothing to stop QAnon, with QAnon being the equivalent of heretics in the Middle Ages.

yeah... a less insane answer would be that while vaccines do not fully protect a person, they ward off the worst consequences of an infection in most vaccinated people, which is hopefully enough to take the pressure off an overwhelmed healthcare system.
Over here in Europe, that's still very much the plan, because other vital treatments and operations are being postponed amd cancelled due to hospitals being full. It's a bad time to have cancer, a heart attack or to be in a traffic accident.
So anything that keeps more people out of ICUs is cheaper and creates way less of an impression of impotence.

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Last edited by shlaifu on 08 Feb 2022, 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ironpony
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08 Feb 2022, 10:20 pm

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

Kraichgauer
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09 Feb 2022, 1:05 am

Aspie1 wrote:

ironpony wrote:

I think you got it wrong about who constitutes "sheeple." It's QAnon worshipers who fall for the most insane, unbelievable lies. And it's QAnon that constitutes a fascist movement.
And no, trust me, we Dems and liberals take the QAnon threat very seriously.

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09 Feb 2022, 1:07 am

ironpony wrote:

Without the lockdowns, there likely would have been greater loss of life. Trying to save lives makes all efforts worth while.

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09 Feb 2022, 1:08 am

ironpony wrote:

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

That is correct.

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Aspie1
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09 Feb 2022, 6:30 am

Kraichgauer wrote:

ironpony wrote:

Without the lockdowns, there likely would have been greater loss of life. Trying to save lives makes all efforts worth while.

Maybe so. But I'm sure Democrats lost a lot of voters due to the lockdowns. Heck, I used to vote Democrat.

But the stupidity of it all---like going to a party makes you a murderer, but looting a store with your Antifa friends makes you a "woke" hero---made me switch sides. I even registered with the GOP. The rich can choke on their tax cuts, for all I care, if that means I can have my freedom. (Or "freedumb", :roll:

as liberals like to put it.)

Well, the joke's on the Democrats, when the Republicans take back the House and the Senate this year. With honest, unaltered ballots, unlike the 2020 election.

ironpony
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09 Feb 2022, 5:12 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

ironpony wrote:

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

That is correct.

So why should we, the vaccinated should have to suffer restrictions, just to protect those who refuse protection anyway? I think we should lift restrictions and if the unvaxed want to suffer more, let it be on them to do to themselves?

kraftiekortie
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09 Feb 2022, 5:17 pm

I feel like many restrictions will be relaxed over the next couple of months----provided that a new "variant" doesn't emerge.

Kraichgauer
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09 Feb 2022, 5:30 pm

ironpony wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

ironpony wrote:

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

That is correct.

That is tempting...

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10 Feb 2022, 2:33 am

ironpony wrote:

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

It's wrong.

https://www.health.nsw.gov.au/Infectiou ... 220120.pdf

This is the official data from the NSW hospital system.

On page 7 you will find the hospitalisation data.
2,627 people in hospital are fully vaccinated.
315 people in hospital are not vaccinated.

The overwhelming number of people in hospital with Covid, have had both their vaccinations.
Which is a rather inconvenient fact for people who want to blame the unvaccinated.

ironpony
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10 Feb 2022, 2:35 am

Oh okay, well if that's the case then then why is everyone making such a big deal about getting vaccinated if it's not working? Plus my gf's mom is a nurse in a hospital, and she constantly talks about how she wishes these people would just get vaccinated, then the hospitals wouldn't be so full, unless she is lying, or for some reason does not have this information.

SpiceWolf
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10 Feb 2022, 2:52 am

ironpony wrote:

Oh okay, well if that's the case then then why is everyone making such a big deal about getting vaccinated if it's not working?

I have asked myself that very same question.

ironpony wrote:

Plus my gf's mom is a nurse in a hospital, and she constantly talks about how she wishes these people would just get vaccinated, then the hospitals wouldn't be so full, unless she is lying, or for some reason does not have this information.

Or she may be getting her information from the media and/or politicians.
I'm a nurse and until I went and looked at the hard data, I was hearing the same thing from every side.

Because the politicians have, over and over, falsely stated that all the people in hospital were unvaccinated.
And the news media have, on many occasions, blindly repeated these claims without doing the vetting that they should be doing.

But when you go and look up the actual figures, they tell a very different story to the one the politicians are telling.

Kraichgauer
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10 Feb 2022, 2:55 am

SpiceWolf wrote:

ironpony wrote:

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

How reliable is that source? Because Politifact has expressed concerns about it's truthfulness:

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2 ... using-uk-/

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SpiceWolf
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10 Feb 2022, 3:35 am

Kraichgauer wrote:

SpiceWolf wrote:

ironpony wrote:

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

How reliable is that source? Because Politifact has expressed concerns about it's truthfulness:

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2 ... using-uk-/

I read all through your politifact link, it's talking about a completely different body in the United Kingdom, which is a completely different country to Australia.

New South Wales is a state of Australia, not to be confused with Wales, which is a country in the United Kingdom.

NSW health is an authoritative source for hospitals in the State of NSW.

Brictoria
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10 Feb 2022, 5:23 am

ironpony wrote:

Maybe this might help you out:

Quote:

Vaccine effectiveness studies have conclusively demonstrated the benefit of COVID-19 vaccines in reducing individual symptomatic and severe disease, resulting in reduced hospitalisations and intensive care unit admissions.

However, the impact of vaccination on transmissibility of SARS-CoV-2 needs to be elucidated. A prospective cohort study in the UK by Anika Singanayagam and colleagues regarding community transmission of SARS-CoV-2 among unvaccinated and vaccinated individuals provides important information that needs to be considered in reassessing vaccination policies.

This study showed that the impact of vaccination on community transmission of circulating variants of SARS-CoV-2 appeared to be not significantly different from the impact among unvaccinated people.

Source: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099%2821%2900768-4/fulltext

Kraichgauer
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10 Feb 2022, 5:29 pm

SpiceWolf wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

SpiceWolf wrote:

ironpony wrote:

But it seems to me that people who have the vaccine are protected and the hospitals are almost always being filled with the un-vaxxed, if that's right?

How reliable is that source? Because Politifact has expressed concerns about it's truthfulness:

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2 ... using-uk-/

Regardless, aren't the people you're championing pretty much arguing the same points?

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