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Do you think self described "nice" guys are realy
Sweet guys who like flowers and kittens and would never be nice to someone simply because of lust or infatuation, but are commonly mistaken for gay. 7%  7%  [ 3 ]
Cops, Figherfighters, Paramedics, Soldiers, and others who live in dangerous and auster conditions, who have a secret death wish or homicidal fantasy masked by a self professed desire to serve the community. 2%  2%  [ 1 ]
Social cowards who won't stand up for themselves or others 5%  5%  [ 2 ]
A guy who would not protect his woman in a dangerous situation. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
A Nerd who spend all day living in a self absorbed fantasy world of manga, video games, and porn who suddenly finds himself in "love" with a pretty woman who talked to him because she didn't want to be rude. 26%  26%  [ 11 ]
People who use the word "nice" as a crutch for social akwardness 14%  14%  [ 6 ]
A guy with an extreem and unwield moral compass, that refuses to comprimise the "truth" to save someones feelings, and thinks that being a virgin or recycling makes him better than everyone else. 7%  7%  [ 3 ]
None of the Above-Nice guys finish last because it's all womens fault 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Any one or more of the above 38%  38%  [ 16 ]
Total votes : 42

r1x
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06 Aug 2009, 3:00 am

1. Your not a nice guy just because you fall in love with a pretty girl and shower her with too much attention. Your desperate attempts to bribe her with your niceness does not mean she does not like nice guys, it means she doesn't like you. Your not a nice guy, your a stalker.
2. Your not a nice guy just because you allow yourself to be used by a pretty woman. Some women feel that stalkers who won't take a hint might as well pay for the privilege of being near them. Your a satellite that whispers how bad her boyfriend is and how much he's just using her. Because you don't like her boyfriend and you spend all your time with her but she doesn't sleep with you does not mean your a nice guy. It means you like things you can't have. Your not a nice guy, your pathetic.
3. Your not a nice guy because the only women who will get in a relationship with you are crying drama magnets or screaming rage queens. The normal guys can see a drama magnet a mile away, and they run. A normal guy doesn't take verbal abuse just because you always know what's on their mind. Your ADD/AS or whatever works better under stress, so its natural that you will hook up with someone who is manic/depressive, verbally abusive, or has 8 kids with ten possible fathers. That doesn't make you a nice guy, that makes you a masochist.
4. Lack of confidence does not make you nice
5. Being extremely left wing or right wing does not make you a nice guy. Protesting at abortion clinics or anti-war rallies does not make you nice.
6. Staying in your house reading comic books and playing video games does not make you nice.
7. Unfortunately, dating someone who you are not physically attracted to is also not nice. I wish that would put us on the nice scale. But they will eventually figure it out and be hurt.
8. Just because you don't notice the cute shy girl in the corner that has a crush you, doesn't make you nice, it makes you unaware of what's in front of you.
So, take the word nice and jerk out of your dating vocabulary. It applies to how you treat your parents, co-workers, and neighbors. Visit an old folks home and talk to some of the older widows, make them feel like someone cares without any reward. That's nice. Adopt a stray dog. Give money to charity. Go to your place of worship, and volunteer to run the sound system or something. And don't tell anyone your doing it, especially someone your dating.

NOTICE THE MODERATELY ATTRACTIVE SHY GIRL IN THE CORNER THAT TALKS TO YOU AND LOOKS AWAY. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT DOES NOT DO HER HAIR OR DOESN'T WHERE MAKEUP! NOTICE THE GIRL THAT LAUGHS AT YOUR SARCASTIC SENSE OF HUMOR. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT’S LONELY BECAUSE SHE DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO APPROACH YOU. THOSE GIRLS ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT DON’T LIKE JERKS.

BUT BEING "NICE" TO A GIRL YOU HAVE THE HOTS FOR IS NOT "NICE"! !! !! !! !! !! !! !! !

Signed..a reformed "nice" guy.



Roman
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06 Aug 2009, 3:51 am

r1x wrote:
8. Just because you don't notice the cute shy girl in the corner that has a crush you, doesn't make you nice, it makes you unaware of what's in front of you.


Interestingly, thats what I keep remembering as I look few years back. Two of these girls were not "shy girls in the corner", since they were somewhat active in chasing me (if they actually WERE, that part I don't know), but I ingored them to do my own thing. And, throughout all this time I was desperate in finding a girl. Why did I ignore them? Because I had it "programmed" in my head that I have to go to dating sites to look for girls, so any stranger talking to me is just slowing me down on my way to the PS. Right now I wish I could just go back and find them or something and that would save all the awkwardness from trying to avoid telling my family that I met them online and such, plus they seemed to be normal.

But again, I don't know if they were chasing me or just joking around. I was teased a lot in high school so I simply confused it with teasing which is partly why I totally ingored tehm. But few years later I read a dating advice that says that teasing is actually a sign of interest, and htat made me feel bad I ignored them. If they WERE just teasing me I would have always found a chance to get away; but if they weren't, who knows what I would have found.

Anyway, here are the girls I am thinkign about:

1) I did my Masters in Minnesota from 2001 till 2004, and I was often studying at the restaurants. At one of the restaurants a waitress kept trying to get my attention teasing me on how I never talk and always want to order the same dish. She simply pushed me off by this.

2) Again in MInnesota, there was another girl who was a lot quieter and did NOT push me off. She was at a grocery store and she kept trying to ask me how was I when I buoght stuff, and I kind of answered her questions and tried to brush her off since I was on my way elsewhere. At one point she said to someone "I am in love with this guy". Thta person asked "whom?" and she said "the guy who comes here does his groceries and never talks". That perfectly describes me. But I thought how could she have possibly refer to me in a third person if I was right there, so I decided it was someone just like me, and was too scared to ask just in case teh latter is true.

3) Between 2004 and 2009 I did my ph.d. in Michgan, and there was a girl in Jimmy Jones who kept joking with me about my orders. She, too, kept trying to start conversations with me and I kept brushing her off because it was typically really late when I got there (I was comming there because iti s open till 3 AM and I study late) so I was on a hurry to go to bed.



MsDoubt
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06 Aug 2009, 4:06 am

OMG a nice guy is a nice person. a nice guy and a nice girl are the same thing. a nice person respects people. That's the bottom line. You can be a shy nice person or an outgoing nice person. There is no problem with both.
You guys need to stop bashing yourselves about being nice. Bring someone flowers doesnt mean you are nice. Guys bring flowers to womens' doors and in the other hand is a gun ready to shoot her. I bet you all seen that trick b4.
If one is respectful then they are nice. Ignoring someone is not nice.
the girls who like jerks, there is a way to deal with them. Just don't give a crap about them, because thats not what you want or need, unless you are a jerk.
If a girl says you're too nice, it doesnt mean you're a loser, it means you are not what she's looking for, and that she has poor judgement.
It's just like a girl saying "you're too short", well maybe she wants a tall guy but it doesnt mean you're a loser.
All men go through this and all men get turned down by most women they like and ask out, unless they are billionaires.
If you are a man you have to deal with men problems
If you are a woman you have to deal with women problems
Asperger's excuses no one.

there was a time in history that women didnt have the right to vote, but just because Annie was autistic, it didnt mean that she didnt share the same problem.



r1x
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06 Aug 2009, 5:21 am

MsDoubt wrote:
Asperger's excuses no one.


Agreed



Last edited by r1x on 06 Aug 2009, 9:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

AnnaLemma
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06 Aug 2009, 7:28 am

Just some observations, because I shared offices/cubicles for years with a few self-described nice guys. Very emotionally needy--showered girls with attention and gifts and totally creeped them out. Somehow only pined for really beautiful girls, never were interested in plain-looking girls, who were otherwise quite nice themselves. Were vastly more sensitive to rejection than other guys, gave it more significance than it seemed to me the situation deserved (most wild predators have a success rate on the hunt of less than 50%). Looking back I can only say one of these was likely AS, but the others had some traits, though were probably NT.

They were pretty beaten up by the process and made me thankful to be female and happily married.


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LiendaBalla
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06 Aug 2009, 7:59 am

"None of the Above-Nice guys finish last because it's all womens fault"

What the $%^#? :?



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06 Aug 2009, 10:57 am

@LiendaBalla: That was sarcasm.

Props to the creator of this thread. Everything from 1-8 is 100% truth.



CrinklyCrustacean
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06 Aug 2009, 4:24 pm

It's a shame there isn't a positive option in that poll list. I'd probably have voted for it. :?



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06 Aug 2009, 4:37 pm

r1x wrote:
So, take the word nice and jerk out of your dating vocabulary. It applies to how you treat your parents, co-workers, and neighbors. Visit an old folks home and talk to some of the older widows, make them feel like someone cares without any reward. That's nice. Adopt a stray dog. Give money to charity. Go to your place of worship, and volunteer to run the sound system or something. And don't tell anyone your doing it, especially someone your dating.
I agree with you on this point... "jerk" and "nice" are just arbitrary terms the unlovables use to describe their situation (and to point blame away from themselves)... I too am guilty of using those terms in the past... Now I just try to accept my situation: that there is not one woman on this planet that likes me (as more than a friend... there are plenty that will be friends, though, and for that at least I am grateful)... Nowadays, I don't even consider myself "nice"... sure I try to be as friendly as I can under even the most adversarial conditions (hell, I beat you to the punch on the "volunteering to run the sound system at a place of worship" bit), but deep down I'm still a repugnant POS that's not worth any self-respecting woman's time...

Quote:
NOTICE THE MODERATELY ATTRACTIVE SHY GIRL IN THE CORNER THAT TALKS TO YOU AND LOOKS AWAY. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT DOES NOT DO HER HAIR OR DOESN'T WHERE MAKEUP! NOTICE THE GIRL THAT LAUGHS AT YOUR SARCASTIC SENSE OF HUMOR. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT’S LONELY BECAUSE SHE DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO APPROACH YOU. THOSE GIRLS ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT DON’T LIKE JERKS.

On the other hand, this paragraph is completely false. I don't "notice" any girls like this because they do not exist. There has never been a girl in the corner that talks to me and then looks away... As for the girls that don't do hair or wear makeup, those tend to attract me more than the so-called "good-looking" women that do, and yet even those types don't want anything to do with me... The only time a girl has laughed at me is if she is literally laughing at me, probably because I did something incredibly stupid... And I'm pretty sure the last group doesn't exist either...



Janissy
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06 Aug 2009, 4:49 pm

[quote="ToadOfSteel

Quote:
NOTICE THE MODERATELY ATTRACTIVE SHY GIRL IN THE CORNER THAT TALKS TO YOU AND LOOKS AWAY. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT DOES NOT DO HER HAIR OR DOESN'T WHERE MAKEUP! NOTICE THE GIRL THAT LAUGHS AT YOUR SARCASTIC SENSE OF HUMOR. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT’S LONELY BECAUSE SHE DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO APPROACH YOU. THOSE GIRLS ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT DON’T LIKE JERKS.

On the other hand, this paragraph is completely false. I don't "notice" any girls like this because they do not exist. There has never been a girl in the corner that talks to me and then looks away... As for the girls that don't do hair or wear makeup, those tend to attract me more than the so-called "good-looking" women that do, and yet even those types don't want anything to do with me... The only time a girl has laughed at me is if she is literally laughing at me, probably because I did something incredibly stupid... And I'm pretty sure the last group doesn't exist either...[/quote]

Of course she exists! You have to NOTICE HER. She is legion. Fine tune that radar. You probably walked right past her 3 times today all the while grumping about being unloveable to women. I am now starting to wonder if some of the men who looked right through me when I was your age were actually Aspies.



Space
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06 Aug 2009, 5:04 pm

This whole "Nice guy" thing is one of the worst things to happen to the human race in my lifetime.



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06 Aug 2009, 5:26 pm

There's no answer, no legitimate pejorative either. As far as the voting options at the top - on the mass of 'nice guys' out there it could be any of the above or just as easily none of the above. Things don't need to be just, need to make sense, need to have blame that falls on either the men or women involved when your dealing with something this primal in our character.

You will have self-serving bags who mistake themselves for nice guys, you'll have guys who thought they were cool or had enough going for themselves (legitimately rather than by braggado) who will find the strange conjunction of constant 'no' and 'your so nice' - they'll be starved of any other reason why and in that starvation they'll connect those two thoughts since they can happen in tandem quite easily. But - there are no rules here. If a guy calls himself a 'nice guy' in this regard, you could probably venture to say that he both hears it and can't get a date - that's it. For the guys who do everything they can for themselves and nothing's enough, which can happen as well, its hard to admit but - just like when it happens - its likely natural selection; being that's something that no one wants to have to morally answer to that part of their make-up I think that's also part of the reason why people get tarred for complaining about it.



MsDoubt
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06 Aug 2009, 5:39 pm

AnnaLemma wrote:
Just some observations, because I shared offices/cubicles for years with a few self-described nice guys. Very emotionally needy--showered girls with attention and gifts and totally creeped them out. Somehow only pined for really beautiful girls, never were interested in plain-looking girls, who were otherwise quite nice themselves. Were vastly more sensitive to rejection than other guys, gave it more significance than it seemed to me the situation deserved (most wild predators have a success rate on the hunt of less than 50%). Looking back I can only say one of these was likely AS, but the others had some traits, though were probably NT.

They were pretty beaten up by the process and made me thankful to be female and happily married.


What's your point? may I ask?. You can explain and tell me if I am wrong, because I may be.

You are glad that you are female because you don't have to put up with being rejected because you give someone your undivided attention all the time or a lot of the time. You are glad that you are female because you don't have to deal with the problems that men have, as in always trying to figure out if women like you as the way you are or as a different person. You are glad that you don't have to deal with having to approach someone a certain way just to get them attracted. You are glad that you don't have to think about how to approach someone, or if you say the wrong thing, you may creep someone out.
Well if you are glad because of those reasons, you are a pretty reasonable girl, because no one has to go through all of that. But this is what men have to go through everyday, especially AS men.
Its just like if we were to see a guy we were attracted to and give him attention, but every time we do, he just gets creeped out.
Just imagine people saying this:
In order for a girl to get a guy, she must be:

-Confident
-Assertive
-Don't be overly nice
-Don't come on too strong
-Must approach them
-If she gets rejected then its her problem not the guy's problem and she needs to fix it, and dont be a baby by worrying or crying about it.
-Must act this way and that way
-Must have money
-Must have all this
-A car
-Cash
-House of own

I'm trying to defend the guys because it seems that they arent getting the truth from anywhere or anyone else on this site.
It is true, all a girl has to do is look pretty and she can get guys.
A goodlooking guy can't get anything, he has to come along with other attributes.

A woman can be broke, have no job, have no car, insecure, needy, nice, short, tall, dress like a guy, dress like a girl, but all she needs to be is pretty and she can get a guy like that.



MsDoubt
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06 Aug 2009, 5:53 pm

Janissy wrote:
[quote="ToadOfSteel
Quote:
NOTICE THE MODERATELY ATTRACTIVE SHY GIRL IN THE CORNER THAT TALKS TO YOU AND LOOKS AWAY. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT DOES NOT DO HER HAIR OR DOESN'T WHERE MAKEUP! NOTICE THE GIRL THAT LAUGHS AT YOUR SARCASTIC SENSE OF HUMOR. NOTICE THE GIRL THAT’S LONELY BECAUSE SHE DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO APPROACH YOU. THOSE GIRLS ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT DON’T LIKE JERKS.

On the other hand, this paragraph is completely false. I don't "notice" any girls like this because they do not exist. There has never been a girl in the corner that talks to me and then looks away... As for the girls that don't do hair or wear makeup, those tend to attract me more than the so-called "good-looking" women that do, and yet even those types don't want anything to do with me... The only time a girl has laughed at me is if she is literally laughing at me, probably because I did something incredibly stupid... And I'm pretty sure the last group doesn't exist either...


Of course she exists! You have to NOTICE HER. She is legion. Fine tune that radar. You probably walked right past her 3 times today all the while grumping about being unloveable to women. I am now starting to wonder if some of the men who looked right through me when I was your age were actually Aspies.[/quote]

To TOS....Its not that those girls dont like jerks, they like anyone because they don't get enuff attention.
There are pretty girls who dont like jerks, but just because she doesnt like jerks doesnt mean that there arent guys approaching her every minute, or a couple of guys who like her.
The answer to all of this is not through people, it should be through God.
ask God....

"God, why did you make women this way?"
"God, why are women so confusing?"
"God, why do so many women like jerks?"

That way you get one right answer instead of bs that people make up themselves. God made women, and as they say, he didnt make any mistakes.
Your answer won't come as clear as day. Some guy told me that he prayed to God to help him understand women, and he got his answer. His answer was a wife and 3 girls.

And teh funny this is, is that, he still doesn't understand them.
Stop wasting your time trying to understand things, matybe its not meant to understand. just be yourself and go from there



AnnaLemma
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06 Aug 2009, 6:22 pm

MsDoubt wrote:
What's your point? may I ask?. You can explain and tell me if I am wrong, because I may be.


Don't know that I had a point, just observing that these guys had a pretty stressful time of it and some of it was because they felt singled out by events that happen to everyone. They beat themselves up a lot and couldn't bring themselves to be philosophical and learn from their results. I felt sorry for them and felt thankful that I was retired from dating, since it is pretty traumatic for everyone. I have never been even average-looking, and now I am old, on top of it. I didn't date till I was 18 and married at 24, but it was a very stressful process for me. If my husband dies first, chances are, I won't marry again. That is just how it is. Your experience is your experience.


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Janissy
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06 Aug 2009, 6:28 pm

MsDoubt wrote:
AnnaLemma wrote:
Just some observations, because I shared offices/cubicles for years with a few self-described nice guys. Very emotionally needy--showered girls with attention and gifts and totally creeped them out. Somehow only pined for really beautiful girls, never were interested in plain-looking girls, who were otherwise quite nice themselves. Were vastly more sensitive to rejection than other guys, gave it more significance than it seemed to me the situation deserved (most wild predators have a success rate on the hunt of less than 50%). Looking back I can only say one of these was likely AS, but the others had some traits, though were probably NT.

They were pretty beaten up by the process and made me thankful to be female and happily married.


What's your point? may I ask?. You can explain and tell me if I am wrong, because I may be.

You are glad that you are female because you don't have to put up with being rejected because you give someone your undivided attention all the time or a lot of the time. You are glad that you are female because you don't have to deal with the problems that men have, as in always trying to figure out if women like you as the way you are or as a different person. You are glad that you don't have to deal with having to approach someone a certain way just to get them attracted. You are glad that you don't have to think about how to approach someone, or if you say the wrong thing, you may creep someone out.
Well if you are glad because of those reasons, you are a pretty reasonable girl, because no one has to go through all of that. But this is what men have to go through everyday, especially AS men.
Its just like if we were to see a guy we were attracted to and give him attention, but every time we do, he just gets creeped out.
Just imagine people saying this:
In order for a girl to get a guy, she must be:

-Confident
-Assertive
-Don't be overly nice
-Don't come on too strong
-Must approach them
-If she gets rejected then its her problem not the guy's problem and she needs to fix it, and dont be a baby by worrying or crying about it.
-Must act this way and that way
-Must have money
-Must have all this
-A car
-Cash
-House of own

I'm trying to defend the guys because it seems that they arent getting the truth from anywhere or anyone else on this site.
It is true, all a girl has to do is look pretty and she can get guys.
A goodlooking guy can't get anything, he has to come along with other attributes.

A woman can be broke, have no job, have no car, insecure, needy, nice, short, tall, dress like a guy, dress like a girl, but all she needs to be is pretty and she can get a guy like that.


"All she needs to do is be pretty..."

Jsut two little words. Be pretty. If it's just two little words it must be within the reach of all women, right? Of course not. Just because it's only two words rather than a long list ( an overly long list, actually, since many paired up men didn't fit that criteria) doesn't mean it's any easier.

Oh, just "be pretty". For some women, that's about as do-able as telling an Aspie man to just be an alpha male.