I could get people to listen to me better if I...
16 Aug 2009, 10:59 pm
As interested as I am in seeing all posters' answers here thus far, I feel that nobody is seeing this thru an NT's eyes.
Namely: that we don't use proper body language or eye contact (normal NT social skills), thus we make it harder for them to read us/want to read us/put in the effort to read us. This makes it easier to dismiss us as either irrelevant or dangerous/on the verge of a meltdown.
It might sound strange, but insofar as many on the spectrum cannot maintain eye contact/exhibit NT body language and listen/process information simultaneously, it's probable that many NTs cannot process information of a social nature unless they and we do all the required elements simultaneously or within a short time frame.
This probably explains a great deal of why we are ignored, and why NTs become emotional/take the discussion to an emotional level when we try to repeatedly get their attention, us remaining calm, them "empathing" that we must be on the verge of a meltdown because THEY ARE or anyone acting like us, were they NT, would also be on that verge.
Just another reason why jumping to conclusions can be dumb.
19 Aug 2009, 8:05 am
All communication is negotiated. You think through what you say in a conversation the same way you write: You decide what you want the audience to 'take away' and you craft your statements to be appropriate for your audience and setting. In conversation, you also need to engage the other people by turn taking, asking questions, and adjusting to the feedback they provide.
On the other hand, I usually don't have anything I want people to 'take away' from the experience, and I'm quite happy telling them I'm allergic to small-talk. I certainly have no interest in boring them by prattling on about some random thoughts in my head.
I agree that arguments should be avoided and prevented, but that's my Aspie nature talking. NT's on the other hand like to have them. Some of my friendships resulted from a long argument. One even resulted from threats and the girl keyed my car. Either way, when NTs use emotionally charged words, if you don't get angry and use some back, they are going to assume something is wrong with you. But if you use them, let the argument form, let them get out what is on their chest, and then make up... Even in relationships, people say the best sex is make-up sex. Well, in a non-sexual world, you can't really believe that there isn't a bonding moment when people make up from a fight. Of course, people don't fight to bond with you or get to know you, but I'm just saying sometimes it is healthy to have a fight now and then. Either way, it goes back to if someone were to call me a racial slurr and I don't get mad and call them an A-hole, they are going to think there is something seriously disturbed about me even though their behavior, IMO, would be more disturbing.
_________________
"In the room the women come and go talking of Michelangelo." J. Alfred Prufrock
19 Aug 2009, 8:33 am
I can't say how I could get people to listen to me.
I am often a people watcher... I don't know why. I think a lot of it is trying to figure out how social rules work, and I find it rather amusing at times.
The thing is, it isn't just us they don't listen to. They don't listen to one another either. People with strong opinions on something will hear part of what you are saying, and if they disagree immediately interrupt and tune you out. A lot of conversations (I don't listen in to be nosy, just to see how it works mainly), seem like decent conversations but are really 2 people just randomly saying things with neither side hearing one another out.
My mother and I have both had people completely turn their backs to us in conversation if we say something they don't like, and NEVER tell us what it was they didn't like to begin with.
It's an odd thing... trying to talk socially. Because even though people appear to be being social, they are generally only interested in what they have to say. You can try to make a point over and over and have it ignored... heck, you can say "hi" to someone right before they are getting ready to talk, or after they've stopped, and at times not get a "hi" back, because it doesn't pertain to what they are saying to begin with.
Funny you bring up being able to be quicker to get to your point. I'm not sure that would help either at times. I find that only works with children, but with adults, they are often long-winded in what they have to say about something as well. Sure they want you to get to the point faster, but if they're gonna talk for half an hour, they need to listen to you too if you need to.
So if you are looking for intellectual conversation, I don't think it will ever change really, unfortunately.... or try being louder. If something is really important though, a point you really want to make though, make it loud and clear that you have something to say about it when you get a chance of silence.
I hear a lot of people in typical settings say, "Can I make a comment on that?" to get the other people's attention. Sometimes it works, sometimes overlooked, but it's often done in a quite obvious matter that they really really want to say it. They'll put their hands over their head (like raising their hands in a teacher's classroom), and say it very clearly and not necessarily LOUD, but vocally, if that makes sense. A lot of the time I see that though, attention is immediately drawn to the person, because it is stated as a question.... and people always seem curious if you ask it as a question for some reason.
As far as anything else, as I've said, I've had very little success besides flat out telling someone that I am talking and they NEED to listen to me if it is something involving me, then I tell them, if they aren't going to listen, don't even bother talking to me or asking questions because it's pointless to begin with, lol. I don't think I handle it too well. ...but often after I say it matter of factly and bluntly when they are quiet, I find they listen to me a lot more afterwards, lol. Maybe just to not set me off again, I'm not sure. But at least they listen.
19 Aug 2009, 11:16 am
I am often a people watcher... I don't know why. I think a lot of it is trying to figure out how social rules work, and I find it rather amusing at times.
The thing is, it isn't just us they don't listen to. They don't listen to one another either. People with strong opinions on something will hear part of what you are saying, and if they disagree immediately interrupt and tune you out. A lot of conversations (I don't listen in to be nosy, just to see how it works mainly), seem like decent conversations but are really 2 people just randomly saying things with neither side hearing one another out.
My mother and I have both had people completely turn their backs to us in conversation if we say something they don't like, and NEVER tell us what it was they didn't like to begin with.
It's an odd thing... trying to talk socially. Because even though people appear to be being social, they are generally only interested in what they have to say. You can try to make a point over and over and have it ignored... heck, you can say "hi" to someone right before they are getting ready to talk, or after they've stopped, and at times not get a "hi" back, because it doesn't pertain to what they are saying to begin with.
Funny you bring up being able to be quicker to get to your point. I'm not sure that would help either at times. I find that only works with children, but with adults, they are often long-winded in what they have to say about something as well. Sure they want you to get to the point faster, but if they're gonna talk for half an hour, they need to listen to you too if you need to.
So if you are looking for intellectual conversation, I don't think it will ever change really, unfortunately.... or try being louder. If something is really important though, a point you really want to make though, make it loud and clear that you have something to say about it when you get a chance of silence.
I hear a lot of people in typical settings say, "Can I make a comment on that?" to get the other people's attention. Sometimes it works, sometimes overlooked, but it's often done in a quite obvious matter that they really really want to say it. They'll put their hands over their head (like raising their hands in a teacher's classroom), and say it very clearly and not necessarily LOUD, but vocally, if that makes sense. A lot of the time I see that though, attention is immediately drawn to the person, because it is stated as a question.... and people always seem curious if you ask it as a question for some reason.
As far as anything else, as I've said, I've had very little success besides flat out telling someone that I am talking and they NEED to listen to me if it is something involving me, then I tell them, if they aren't going to listen, don't even bother talking to me or asking questions because it's pointless to begin with, lol. I don't think I handle it too well. ...but often after I say it matter of factly and bluntly when they are quiet, I find they listen to me a lot more afterwards, lol. Maybe just to not set me off again, I'm not sure. But at least they listen.
I think generally people are fairly self absorbed and as a result all share a similar listening disorder. But, some people do listen better than others. You pretty much just helped me understand why my sister will argue with me when I'm agreeing with her.
The thing is that many people on here, like myself, just want to be understood better. There's got to be a way. People listen to Dr. Phil and Oprah all the time.
Maybe it would help for things that are really important to say, "Everybody, listen to me for a second, and really listen to me because this is important." That too probably works better with children than adults, but I still think adults are just overgrown kids in the end.
One method I noticed works a lot and I tend to forget to use it is the Socratic Questioning. Socrates used it a lot, and so did Jesus. A lot of times, people like to make their own conclusions, so they don't want to take your word for it. Instead of telling them your conclusion, it might help to ask the right questions for them to come to a similar conclusion on their own. You can kind of coax too with hint like questions by asking about the variables you've already considered. Like you said, people love to answer questions.
_________________
"In the room the women come and go talking of Michelangelo." J. Alfred Prufrock
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