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Is it ethical to spend money for personal entertainment?

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Eggman
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01 May 2010, 2:58 pm

is it ethical to recieve medical care?


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zer0netgain
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02 May 2010, 10:19 am

Gromit wrote:
zer0netgain wrote:
You owe me no legal duty. Hence, if you choose not to intervene, you have done no wrong. That others might try to accuse you of being immoral for not intervening is not relevant.

That only makes sense if you get your ethical principles completely from social norms, as and only as expressed in law. I don't.


Then you are looking at a circular argument.

To me, the imperative to do something is ultimately a compulsion. Either to please someone else, a "God" or yourself.

If you want to give because it makes you feel good, then the compulsion is from within. It's the most "free" of the choices you make.

If the desire to give comes from a mandate from a "God" you follow, then it is still a compulsion. How "free" a choice is it depends on many factors (an a lot of theological debate I won't go into).

If the desire to give comes from social pressure/programming, it is a compulsion from outside. It is not "free" because you've been programmed or pressured to do what society expects.

Everything you choose to do is the result of some sort of conditioning.



Gromit
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06 May 2010, 2:36 pm

zer0netgain wrote:
[If you want to give because it makes you feel good, then the compulsion is from within. It's the most "free" of the choices you make.

That's the only case I am discussing. I'm not religious and there is no social pressure to do more than I already do.

I am very interested in your and also ruveyn's and Dox47's answer to this question:
Quote:
If I left you to rot in prison when I could have prevented you from being wrongly convicted at a small cost to myself, you would think that is OK, and if you knew what I'd done, you'd shake my hand and tell me no hard feelings, you might have done the same? If you can't honestly say that, you agree that the small cost to me of coming forward doesn't balance the large cost to you of me walking away. Then you have the same dilemma as I have. You deny that. Can you honestly say your feelings would be consistent with that denial if I left you in serious sh** when it would cost me very little to help you?



Gromit
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06 May 2010, 2:57 pm

Ichinin wrote:
I could give money and possibly save someone, but the money could be stolen my some greedy psychopath, fleeing from the the aid organisation with millions in his pockets.

You might be defrauded when buying that notebook you mentioned.

Ichinin wrote:
I could give money to someone through collector on the streets and make them happy, but who hugs me in return?

I have met someone who sponsors the education of two Indian kids. He has gone to visit, and probably got some hugs.

Ichinin wrote:
I could give money through an aid organisation to someones family so they can mass-produce more kids and scream for more money,

Have a look at this the links here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Population_organizations Looks like you can fund contraception for people who want it but are too poor to pay. Then they'll produce fewer kids and scream less for money.

Ichinin wrote:
Why is it unethical to deny some people money, but not unethical to withhold love to people that are unable to find someone?

Because giving money is under voluntary control, but giving love isn't. If I requested that you love me or someone else randomly chosen, could you deliver?

Eggman wrote:
is it ethical to eat? the food you eat could have gone to a starving person
...
is it ethical to recieve medical care?

I am discussing cases where a small cost to you or me means a big benefit to someone else. If you starve yourself to death or don't receive medical care you need, would you think that is a small cost?



Ichinin
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06 May 2010, 4:21 pm

Gromit wrote:
You might be defrauded when buying that notebook you mentioned.


Not when buying it over the counter.

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I have met someone who sponsors the education of two Indian kids. He has gone to visit, and probably got some hugs.


That really doesnt change my experience, it did for someone else and he had to travel across the planet. He could have just as well paid someone to hug him.

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Looks like you can fund contraception for people who want it but are too poor to pay. Then they'll produce fewer kids and scream less for money.


Thanks!! !

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Because giving money is under voluntary control, but giving love isn't.


Then thats my privilege to withhold. Because of the world is an loveless, evil selfish place that hate everyone who is different, i'll keep whats mine until i get my fare share of love.


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donnie_darko
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27 May 2010, 4:22 pm

you gotta live.