Asperger's, Anxiety Disorder, and ADHD

Post Reply New Topic

lol so cute.....

Sorry, spelling is not my strong point... For some reason, phonics really screwed me up.

Oh lol I realise now that i might have hurt your feelings by pointing it out...It just made me laugh so hard that i really didn't think....at all. Sorry

Until recently, my AS son has always wanted to be social. Maybe not in the size doses daily life gave him, but it was a huge need. Until recently. I think life has worn on him, and he's gotten frustrated with the way other people react to him. He's old enough and has learned enough to be aware; it used to totally roll off of him. And being aware ... it's not as fun as it used to be.

There definitely are the AS kids that are drawn to people, v. the ones that never were. By adulthood most of them, it seems, will withdraw more often. If it wasn't who they were, the world seems to try to make it that way.

My son has had a very good experience with Boy Scouts, and many AS kids do. He LOVES the outdoors, and he loves the tangibility of the advancement system. But, as with many things, each child's experience is highly dependent upon the group of adults running the unit. If you didn't luck out there, it can adversely affect your child's experience. Any chance of simply finding a different pack to join? Kids around here sometimes bounce around a bit before they find the one that is right for them. Being involved with the parent committee also helps, because you can use that time to make the adults aware of special concerns without having kids present that might overhear.

Actually, I was quite involved in Scouts for most of the time we'd been doing it.. I was even Cub Master for a year when our pack leadership fell apart, until we joined another pack. There are other packs to go to, but most of the packs around here are failing and melding into the same pack we did. It has become ridiculously huge, approx 80 boys.

I've told him that perhaps we will try again next year, especially because even though we haven't been since before Christmas, he is still really looking forward to Day Camp.

On a different note, having been through this.. What is your advice in regards to other children's response to my son. Is it better to let it go and let him figure it out as he matures.... or make him aware of it.. Like the little girl who said she was going to invite him to her party because her mom's making her... Ben was just excited that he was being invited to a party... Do I point out that she obviously doesn't want him to go? I don't want to hurt his feelings but I'd rather sit him down and discuss it than have him smacked in the face with it when he isn't expecting it.

I'm always as honest as I can be with him, as is appropriate to his age. I might not tell him all the facts about something, but edit information to what I think he can handle and understand.. but I never lie.
I was raised that omitting the truth is a lie of it's own kind.. so I feel that not telling him is being dishonest... but again, I don't want to break his heart.

This has always been one area where I'm torn.

Losing recess is a completely backward and antiquated approach to helping special needs kids overcome learning issues. You need to nip that in the bud - do NOT allow them to take away his recess. You need to tell them they are essentially punishing him for his disabilities and further isolating him from the "mainstream" kids by making him miss recess, nevermind removing his ability to destress and get fresh air. It sounds to me like you need to do some serious pushing for change in an IEP.

As for cub scouts... only you know whether it's the right thing for you son, but my advice would be to reconsider why you removed him. If it truly is an environment where he cannot succeed, I would agree it's the right decision to keep him out. But if it was an environment where he ran into trouble with another child, then that can also be seen as a fantastic learning opportunity for him and you. My son went through similar situations with a child at school, and with their help, he learned some invaluable life lessons and social skills in terms of how to cope with conflict and how to forgive people's flaws and move on.

Anyhow, just food for thought.

I gather that your son does not know he has Aspergers? I personally feel it is a child's right to know. I don't believe it is a parent's right to decide whether or not they tell their child, but rather it is our responsibility to tell them in the right way at the right time. I would also consider making the cub scout leaders and other parents aware, if you return to scouts. I believe this helps to ensure our kids' differences are understood and respected, rather than condemned or merely tolerated. The best way I've heard this described was "people are going to label your child, so you might as well make sure it's the right one".

He knows he has Asperger's and ADHD... I don't think he has a good understanding of what AS really means except that his brain works differently. When there is a situation that I can use to explain "this is an AS issue" I try to.

The people at Scouts did know exactly what his issues are, whether they understood it, I can't really answer.

I use tv as a teaching tool since it's one of his most favorite things in the world.
When he watches Extreme Makeover Home Edition
"See how Ty runs around being silly and loud."
Ben "Yeah, Mom, he's kinda crazy."
Me "No silly, he has ADHD."

When watching Big Bang Theory..

"See how Sheldon is doesn't understand people even though he's really smart about other things?"
Ben "Yeah, well he acts like he has some autism traits going on..."

As much as possible I use these things as a visual reference and a stepping stone into a conversation.

oops..Typo... of course Ben doesn't notice AS symptoms in Sheldon. .. sorry

As far as letting my son in what kid's responses really meant: I played it by ear but more often than not kept the negative assessments to myself. You don't want your child becoming vulnerable to pranksters, so you have to watch for signs of that and nip those in the bud fast, but there is also no point in shattering his happy illusions before they need to be shattered. Plus, young kids are often socially inept themselves, making hurtful blunders they don't really mean. My son figured it out soon enough on his own, that certain people were just tolerating him because someone told them to. There hasn't been any conflict with him about it, any suggestion that he wishes he had known sooner or that he felt I hid it from him. Just one day the child bluntly says something along the lines of, "Joe may be John's friend but he really isn't mine." Truth is, my son honestly does not care if people like him as long as they allow him to interact with them in the ways that make him happy, and they don't try to pick on him or otherwise make him miserable. Does he care if he isn't wanted at a party he wants to go to? NO. In his mind, it's their problem, not his. Perhaps someday that will change, but right now that's his attitude. The more difficult part is that at this age parents can't force kids to include him, so he is more aware of being left out of things he would have liked to attend, than being disliked. I think that part gets to him, that he doesn't get to do as much as he would if more people liked him.

Thank you DW... You tend to give very reasonable and sound advice.

What you say makes sense and is pretty much what I was thinking. I have a horrible habit of second guessing myself and over-evaluating my reasons. So while I was thinking all that, I was wondering if I wanted it to be true because it made my life easier by delaying the conversation.

Ok, back for part 2. Sorry about the delay, but it's been a busy week.

For starters, its time to discuss teaching methodologies.

Different people learn different ways, and what works for one person doesn't necessarily work for others. But I am sure you already know that. However, what is often overlooked is the need for information to be useful in order for it to be retained. You see, our brains are constantly going back through old data and deleting unnecessary information. For example, can you remember what you had for lunch yesterday? How about the day before that, or the day before that, or the day before that? At some point, you forget what you ate recently. And why is this? Does your memory only function for a day or two? Of course not, as you can still remember things which happened months or years ago, so why can't you remember what you ate last Tuesday?

The reason for this forgetfulness is that your brain has determined that this information (what you ate) is unimportant for your continued functioning, and as such has deleted the memory in order to make room for more memories that are more useful to you. If the human brain didn't delete old memories than there would be so many connections, and so much information stored in the brain that you wouldn't be able to process any of it effectively, and your functioning would be significantly impaired. This is exactly what happens with people who have Fragile-X syndrome. Their brains are so over-wired that they can't function. So while forgetting things that have happened to you may be somewhat bothersome, it is an important part of our functioning.

So the question you have to ask is how does your brain determine what to remember and what not to remember? Why can you remember your phone number which you got years ago, but not what clothes you wore a week ago? And the simple answer is usefulness. You see, your brain has labeled the phone number as 'useful, very important'. But what you ate, or what you wore a week ago is labeled as, 'Meh, whatever'. Likewise, your son's brain has labeled all this math stuff as 'Meh, whatever' because he does not understand it, nor does he understand the use for it. And as long as he doesn't see a need or use for mathematics, he will never be able to retain that information because his brain will automatically delete it shortly after he has learned it.

Now the important thing to understand is that you can't just mentally decide 'O, this is important, I shall memorize it'. Because the thought of 'this is important' isn't what determines whether or not a memory is kept. What determines whether or not a memory is kept is whether or not it 'feels' important. I can read a long list of words and think to myself, 'This is important, don't forget'. But ultimately, I will forget that list of words within a few days if I don't find a use or need for them. It doesn't matter how much I think they are important if I cannot relate them to something else, or understand what they mean, how they are used, or what purpose they serve. To me, it is just random unconnected information, and despite my desire to memorize it, I will forget it fairly quickly.

Likewise, you can sit down with your son and tell him 7+8=15, memorize it now! And you can have him write out 7+8=15 a hundred times. But ultimately, no matter how many times he writes it down, if he doesn't see a use, or need for it, he will quickly forget it. So, if you want him to remember math, you have to show him how math is used on a routine basis. For example, he put cookies into bake at 3:15, and they take 12 minutes to bake. When should he remove them from the oven? Well, 15+12=27, so 3:27. Or for subtraction, he needs to be some place at 2:45, and it takes 23 minutes to get there, when should he leave? You have to show him how, why, and where math is used, because then this math stuff wont just be numbers on a page, but it will actually be connected to something else, and make sense.

And that is why math games are generally good learning tools. They encourage the child to remember the math because to them, it is needed to play a game that they enjoy. And because it is needed to play the game, it is useful, and thus memorization happens automatically. So whatever teaching methods you choose to use, whether games, or flash cards, or sheets, etc. Make sure you actually relate the stuff he is learning in math to useful, and important things so that he can see where this information is used. Because if you don't, then his brain will just delete the information without giving it a second thought.

Now then, on to topic #3, the working environment

I believe you said that you have read my book, which is good, as this will make it much easier to get my point across. I am wondering if your son may have difficulty with math, not due to the subject itself, but the environment in which he is taught. The school environment can be very loud, distracting, and very difficult to focus in. Perhaps he is struggling with the material because he cannot stay focused during this time? Also, you say you are having problems with math at home. Is he calm and relaxed during this time, or is he stressing out? As you know, stressing out causes a person's cognitive abilities to rapidly decline, and if your trying to do homework while your child is stressed out, then you aren't going to accomplish much of anything. I am afraid I really don't have much useful advice here other than to say that you need to make sure your child is learning math during a time that he is able to learn. Simply sitting in math class doesn't mean that he is learning any math.

Also, for an unrelated comment, I am not exactly sure that the character Sheldon from the big bang theory is a good reference for asperger's syndrome. During the first 2 seasons, he would probably have fit the profile of aloof, confused by social customs, and not understanding other people. But during the 3rd and 4th season, they decided to 'supercharge' his personality in order to get more laughs, and changed it from being socially confused to strait up mean, dismissive, and arrogant. Right now, he is more rude then aspy.

Thanks for the insight on memory Tracker. I've found that is so true for my kiddo too.


I've found it really useful to introduce new topics my kiddo learns first with a social story explaining in clear terms why people need to know it, and then by playing games.

I'm pretty sure he learned addition by playing Sorry a hundred million times! We also mix memorizing tasks with physical ones...it seems to help him build stronger connections. Like instead of memorizing division off flashcards, I cut out a bunch of hearts (it was around valentines day) and put numbers on it. Then we picked a flashcard and raced to the answer. Lots of fun...and he remembers stuff because he wants to beat me hahhaha. Using multi-sensory activities seems to work well for cementing the ideas in.

Tracker...

I get what you're saying. In truth, I have a horrible memory. I have to make lists but, generally, just making a list helps me to remember. I think that's something that has thrown me off in all this. Ben has an incredible long term memory. He can remember things from when he was 2 or 3 years old, when I'm like... "Sorry babe, I have no clue what you're talking about." Which usually frustrates the hell out of him.

This is highly probable.. but I don't know how to get around that, minus trying special ed or homeschooling... which I'd like to try to avoid. In the 1st and 2nd grade he had a great teacher who actually converted her office into a quiet room for the multitude of kids in her class who could benefit from it. (Out of 23 kids, she had 10 that were either ASD, ADHD, MR, or ODD.) The children were allowed to take their work into this room anytime they thought they needed to, provided the room wasn't being used. This was great and I was amazed how many kids chose to use the room. Though my son did use it, he didn't really work in there. Maybe he was just using it to de-stress, and that too is great, but we didn't really see that it helped him academically.


He is stressing. He comes home from school and I give him a break to eat a snack and watch some tv and unwind. The minute I say "Homework" or more specifically "Math", he starts stressing out. I try very hard to stay mellow myself while he's flipping out about the prospect of doing it and trying to beg or scream his way out of it. I've tried waiting until after dinner to do homework, but by then he's too tired.

You both talked about games and/or putting math into terms he can relate to. I try to do this... I try to make math visual using beans, blocks, candy, lines drawn on paper, anything. I try to put problems into terms he can relate to. "If you have a pack of gum with XX pieces, and want to share with you XX friends, how many pieces can each person have?" or the like..... We play Blackjack, Sorry, and a ton of other games, but I'm not good at creating math games.. I do try to use every opportunity to point out math in everyday life... But most of the time I hit a brick wall... like with money.. He doesn't get that if he has $3.00 and something costs $2.99, that he only has a penny left. He is certain that he will have a dollar left... (SC.. I will try a variation of your game!)

We saw his psychiatrist today and we're going to try raising his dose again... I think I had discussed this before. Ben had been at 72 mg, and we decided to reduce it to 54mg (I think is the dose), but in waiting for the insurance to authorize it, I had to cut his dose to 36mg. At home he seemed to be doing fine so we thought we'd leave it there for awhile and see how it went. Because he seems to be struggling more in school and having problems with the impulsivity (and the spell check says that isn't a word, but I'm saying it is!), I think that he needs this... for now. During summer break we're going to be trying a different med that is non-stimulant, and that excites me as the stimulants have never worked that well and I have to wonder if they're having an effect on his anxiety.

It's so hard, as a parent, to judge the balance between pushing the issue too much and giving in too much. "Can't" means "I won't try". But how much do you make your child try if being unsuccessful is stressful and damaging to self-esteem?

I can't believe how much this has changed me as a person and a parent. I never thought I'd be a parent who says, "Who cares what your report card says." But I am. The sad part is that my son wants a report card he can brag about... and I don't know what to tell him about that. I just ask, "Do you do the best you can?" and when he says yes, I tell him to be proud of that and not to worry about the rest..... but that doesn't seem to be what he wants to hear.

Tracker- I had Ben read that one section of your book on coping methods and then we discussed it. I am amazed at the difference I'm seeing already. Of course, now I am realizing that just because he WANTS to do something, doesn't mean it isn't stressful for him. We're getting it... slowly!

Thank you

Ohhh and as for using Sheldon as a reference... I use it because 1) we really like that show... and 2) Sheldon has a lot of mannerisms that I can point out to Ben as either something he does, or his AS friend does... I can point out a mannerism and explain how it relates to Ben and he can get a visual on it. It actually leads to a lot of great conversations and self-discovery.

Remind him that everyone has to learn one step at a time. Just because these first steps are taking him a while does not mean it will always be the case. At his age there are still developmental phases involved which pace out differently for each child. The brilliant reader, picking up chapter books before K, may just be another good reader by 5th grade. And the kid who didn't read until 3rd grade may actually be fully caught up, reading the same books at the same pace as the kid who started before K. We see it all the time. Different pacing at this age is not an indication of full ability, and he needs to understand that. Plus, the emphasis of the grading rubric will change: now that my son can use spell check and is graded on the content of his essays instead of having to take spelling test after spelling test, his Language Arts grades are soaring. So, tell your son that if he keeps doing his best he may someday see a payoff in the form of grades that make him happy. You can't guarantee that, of course, but as long as he keeps doing his best he's certainly got a better shot at it than if he doesn't.