Why God should answer prayers.

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I'm going to add "Prayer Accomplishes Nothing" to my sig line.

"In Jesus' name"? I dare say you most certainly have not. How many times in the Bible did Jesus ask the Father for personal favors? I can't thank of any, save for the prayer to avert His own death IF and ONLY IF it were in the will of the Father to do so. You know good and well that a spontaneous regeneration of your fingertip defies natural order. If God had something greater to accomplish with such, He'd have done it. He clearly does not and has not. Now, I have no doubts at all the God might provide a way for this to happen, though not spontaneously. But I suspect that primarily your requests are not in a Christlike spirit. You cannot make demands of God, nor can you manipulate God into doing just what you want.

I am, though, sympathetic to the situation of those who suffer, especially amputees. I'm very sorry that this has caused you to suffer so.


We should continue to pray in like manner that God will continue these things. It does not exclude amputees by any stretch of the imagination.

You're also overlooking the intent of miracles in Biblical times, Back in OT times, there were a number of self-professed prophets and magicians. In order for a prophet to have credibility, he had to perform a "sign," or miracle. If he made a specific prediction that did NOT come true, he showed himself to be a false prophet. If short-term predictions failed, there was no reason to believe long-term predictions would be reliable, especially if the long-range prediction exceeded the lifetime of the prophet. There has to be a test to prove the validity of a prophet's message and the origin of that message from God Himself.

This, of course, includes healing. OT prophets all did the same things Jesus did. The apostles did the same things Jesus did. The purpose of these occurrences was to show that they belonged to God, that they could be believed, and that what they said (which they couldn't prove, since Jesus no longer walked the earth in bodily form) was believable. Without "signs" there was no way for the new faith to take hold.

However, we have the evidence of those times and there is no need anymore for us to have a "blind" faith. Further, God has given us the means through which many of the things long ago attested have been accomplished to effect the same results. Limbs that have been severed by accident, for example, can be reattached within a certain time window. We have been allowed to understand things such as bacteria, viruses, and prions so that we can better prevent or treat illness. We understand enough about they physical world that we can purposefully prepare chemical mixtures to get predictable results, rather than some random "magic" potion.

And we understand why physical regeneration isn't possible, which is more reason to believe that when such happened or continue to happen that it is not of science but of God. Most importantly, we understand that if God does not grant physical regeneration, perhaps it is spiritual regeneration that is most important. Jesus, after all, told those He healed because of their faith in Him to "Go, and sin no more." This seems to be the real point of physical regeneration in Jesus' time: It is an outward sign of what God does for us inwardly. We do not NEED miracles for this, since spiritual regeneration in and of itself is a miracle.

Apparently. But on the other hand, God is not a magician to be called on for the world's entertainment. God is not some leprechaun to be manipulated into granting us three wishes. I believe there is something more important in God's plan than merely the here-and-now.

Bear in mind that according to the Bible that the consequences we face come about as the result of the sinful nature of mankind and the choices that arise from human nature. We are free to choose something else, but not everyone chooses right OVER wrong. Even if we've done no wrong ourselves, we are still affected by external factors. This is not God's doing. "Blaming God" rather than trusting God is arrogant. After all, it is better to enter heaven without a fingertip than to burn in hell whole.

Considering all generations have been equally evil and adulterous...

e. It's not to be read literally.

Whether or not you wish to show any respect to me here is quite up to you, of course, but yes, that remark is quite insulting. I used to sit or lay and stare at the bottle and occasionally even beat on the table while wondering just how in the f**k I might ever get free of alcohol ...

... and that is simply not something I could have ever done on my own. It is perfectly fine with me if you want to take any or all credit for anything and/or everything good in your own life, but I'd be dead and damned today if I had tried that for even one more year after September 27, 1981, and at about 3AM, when I rolled and lit a nice, fat joint and walked into a police station smoking it and then blew a little smoke there for everyone to notice and then handed them my new ounce of Sensi as my "ticket" and asked to be locked up and held until I was sober so I could go see a man I had heard was "sober". I would gladly tell you that entire story if I had any reason to believe you might want to hear it, but unless you might some day find yourself in a similar predicament, well ... never mind.


Faith did not heal that man -- a healer healed that man.

... and neither do many Christians, either.

Yes, there is the matter of "those who are persistent in their prayers. KEEP ASKING and it will be given; KEEP SEEKING and you will find; KEEP KNOCKING and the door will be opened.", but not in any sense of continual begging and crying out while hoping one's prayers might yet some day and somehow be answered. Rather, the persistence being prescribed there is simply about asking to be shown "the path" and to then be enabled, equipped and empowered to walk it.


You are close there, but still a bit off. We need to be praying "in his likeness", and he was a well-informed and obedient son ... and no actual name ever need be mentioned there at all.


Was he not given the courage, strength and power to carry out his father's will? And of course, that would have never been imposed or forced upon him.

Right - talking to my wife about this yesterday. Neither of us can spot any major crisis where we were able to work our way out. Always a matter of an eagle swooping down, a hidden door opening, some red cape distracting the charging bull.

Of course this could be a matter of definition - I might not be inclined to count anything where my personal efforts seem to be effective as a "major crisis".

But even so, anyone who has not faced a major crisis he could not pass through apparently on his own merits in his own strength - well, we gotta say, SOMEBODY is looking out for that person.

While true, we do have to be careful in any condemnation due to that fact. AT LEAST Christians make the effort of maintaining their faith, be it blind faith or tested faith.


I don't really disagree. What's funny is in another thread someone suggested I do not have true faith, and I'm amused that someone would try to pigeonhole the word "faith" as something you necessarily have to believe without any evidence whatsoever! Why that is relevant here is because I reject the idea that God is some unseen, absent "trickster" who floats around "up there" tempting and testing us at His whim in order to teach us some vacuous esoteric lesson. I see human trials as having a point. And I reject the idea that God doesn't provide us also in the material sense as well as in the spiritual, invisible sense. I have certain material things in my possession that I did not work to have, things I did pray for, and I learned that whether the choice was ever mine to make that God would use these things He gave me for His glory.

My Synclavier is one of a very small number ever made, for example. I actually did pray specifically for this instrument, as silly as it might sound. I bought it from the proceeds I got in return for selling my house, which in turn was initially purchased from my wife's inheritance after her father passed. I actually did nothing to earn the nice things that I have, and my wife had more veto power than I did in that matter. It is the provision by God that I have the expensive material things that I have. You can ascribe it to the work of human hands if you want, but there's no doubt in my mind that it was God's will to set those things in motion to bring about His will. So far I have been unable to bring any work I've made to the public except in a church worship setting. I'm perfectly content with that, even if that is all there will ever be.

So, yes, I do believe the actions of God in our lives serve to provide material needs as well as spiritual needs. And I don't think it's right to think that one cannot make material requests and not expect answers to those requests. What matters most here is the believer's faith that God will provide according to HIs will and that the spirit of the one making the request is in like spirit to Jesus and His example.

What I do NOT believe in is invoking God's name or Jesus' name or the Holy Spirit in the form of any so-called "positive confession" in order to get whatever you want. I also do not believe that God, whose prerogative it is to answer or deny any prayer, is compelled to grant all requests, certainly not always in the way we expect. And I do not think it reflects negatively on the faith of one making the request if the request isn't granted.

Now, God can certainly "show you the path," but I don't think it presumptuous to ask for more. We need only be careful of our motivations for asking.


Agreed. I would add that any proper prayer is incomplete if we fail to acknowledge who it is we're praying to. If you ask something of a particular person, you would call that person by name. So it is one ought to pray to God, who might be referred to as Our Heavenly Father or as Yahweh. I have no objections to public prayer in worship, and often I hear public prayers ended with "in Jesus' name". We probably do this more out of habit than actual understanding of why we should, but saying so is a reminder of the proper spirit of prayer, praying as Jesus would pray.


Of course. And that's not unreasonable. People are given strength by God to endure the trials He allows us to face all the time. Jesus was always seeking God's will in all situations, even if those situations were otherwise unfavorable. I think of the Christian ideal as being a slave to God's will at all times just as Jesus functioned as God's exemplary servant on earth. I also view the sense of suberviance to God as also being a sense of greater freedom from the concerns of a fallen world. Had I made my decision later in life, I think I'd have "felt" more freedom and had more choices in life than I do. However, free of God also means slavery to sin. So the only real choice anyone has is whether they choose God or something else. Jesus gave up His freedom, but only because He chose to. Being God's Son, He could do this perfectly, whereas even believing Christians doing their best, myself included, don't always get it right.

I have heard it said God watches out for babies and drunks!

Seriously though, I sometimes do not -- er, make that hardly ever -- know what to say to someone who has not first come to a true crisis in life. Nevertheless, I certainly do still mean to take nothing whatsoever away from anyone else ultimately found standing within the assembly gathered/collected there "on that day".

Overall, I was down inside a slippery pit of some kind and had absolutely no means of/for escape ... and so I had to be pulled from that "miry clay".

In contrast, some people suggest simply "pulling oneself up by the bootstraps", so to speak, but those kinds of efforts only ever found/left/resulted in me merely tipping my own self -- nose first, of course -- right back over into the mud.

Certain people keep the angelic host busy.

In our last church but three [if I have not lost count] there was a man of little visible intellect but perfect childlike faith. He would RUN along the ridge of a steep slick metal roof, sure God would hold him up. Never a scratch.

One day he is trying to fix a garbage disposal. Electricity - metal pipe - water - close quarters - I and likely you would go turn off the power at the mains. Several of us told him to do that. He says no, he's fine, God won't let anything happen. He does the job, unscathed.

Halfway through, the lights go out in the building. I go downstairs to investigate. I know a bit about electricity. Looked at the box, got this increible chill of the spine. You or I before working on the disposal unit would have pulled the plug on the kitchen circuit - anf you or I would have fried. Old building, wired eccentrically. The "kitchen circuit" did not feed the kitchen - we would have needed to pop a different circuit, not labelled.

Our friend ignored precautions. First time he stuck his screwdriver in - circuit powered - he accidentally shorted something and killed the circuit, then worked in perfect safety.

No disagreement here. Most recently, and with my wife and me living in a house she will eventually inherit from her mother, I have asked to be able -- money (for materials) and health needed -- to do the things necessary here for my wife's sake after I likely precede her in death. However, I do not really care whether or not that petition gets signed since my own participation there would only be temporal and short-lived anyway.


Do you even know it?! (Proverbs 30:4)


Agreed. I think that "name it and claim it" prosperity stuff is exactly that: complete nonsense. I know a man who claims he has had gold ooze out from the skin of his arm, but that little whatever-it-was just must not have worked well enough for him to no longer now still have to work!

I feel like one of those people. Despite my complete trust in God to save me, and despite God always showing up when it counted, I do not test God. Not like that.

I've noticed this in my own life because I have a certain attraction to and penchant for disaster. I might have told this story before--not long after my wife and I first met, and in the earliest serious stages of our relationship, I happened to be staying at her apartment when a thunderstorm sprang up, quite quickly I might add. I looked outside her window and saw a deputy sheriff along with some other "official-looking" people. A thought popped in my head that they were the local storm chasers, so I went outside to look. Indeed, there was a funnel cloud very much on its way to the ground. So I ran to the end of the parking lot opposite the apartment so I could get a better look. My wife (girlfriend at the time) was screaming for me to come back inside. I said, "No, sweety, I wanna SEE it!! !" No sooner had I answered her and turned around, I looked again and saw the cloud very politely retract itself back to the sky.

We live quite some distance from my mother and my wife's relatives, so we're always driving long distances for weekend visits. I recall passing through one very powerful storm, and my wife does not handle driving in storms very well, only to find that tornados from that system had demolished houses and power lines mere minutes before we got there. Most recently, just a year ago, I drove through the tornado that hit Yazoo City on April 24. It was so huge I just thought it was a really bad thunderstorm, no worse than anything I've ever driven through before. Yet I wasn't hurt, nor was my entire family who were with me, and the car suffered no damage whatsoever. But we did get to see the damage we missed by mere seconds.

I don't why these things happen to me, but I take it to mean that whatever it is God has be doing from moment to moment, it must really be important. I pray that I do not waste that time.

Ah me. All too many years agone, just come back to the States from London, I sat on the step of the University provided apartment building watching as the storm clouds moved swiftly overhead, reaching down about a dozen minifunnels. Nothing touched down. Spectacular. Stupid.

It takes me back.

My in-laws were once shocked when my wife wanted to end her visit early and get back on a plane to the Florida Keys so she and I could/would be together there in our houseboat while a hurricane was approaching!

Indeed I do! And you'll note my fairly heavy use of "God" in reference to God, and even doing THAT makes me nervous. See Exodus 20:7.


Don't you mean "blab it and grab it"? Now, yes, I do believe human beings are endowed by God with His creative potential. That doesn't mean we have the ability to speak entire universes into existence. I do believe that God is capable of giving individuals the power to speak things into existence if it suits God's purpose to do so. It is prosperity gospel's hidden motivations for personal gain that put it at odds with the Bible. I can't fathom how it is so many people get sucked into this kind of thing. The only people who "blab it and grab it" are the ones calling congregants to put the money in the plate while the "minister" grabs it all after the service.

Speaking of "blab and grab," I've been entrusted to a pretty deep secret regarding someone at my church. It's nothing really earth-shattering, but now's just not a good time for things to get around. On the one hand, I'm unhappy about it because it means there will probably be some big changes for me down the road in the absence of a good friend. Yet it is also another answer to one of my prayers. The Psalms are replete with curses for those who have done us wrong, and they reflect how I've felt for a very, VERY long time despite having remained silent these past few years. God is also about to remove one of my family's bitter enemies. And so it is dazzling to me how waiting out and navigating this storm has led us to a much better place.

But the thing is, the things that happened to us a few short years ago were really only the breaking of the dawn, and over the next two years we started seeing other things in our church that made us question our reasons for staying. While our church is about to be much SAFER for us now that all those people who opposed me and my family will be gone, is it really where we want to stay? Or is there a void being left that we are meant to fill? Just as you mentioned that God "shows us the path," and just as we agree in different ways that God provides our physical as well as spiritual needs, and just as I've experienced God firsthand in my life, I'm praying now that God will reveal the next path ahead and grant us the wisdom to take it.

La di da, vo di o do, here we go again.

Know it well, my angelic friend. With you. You WILL be shown the way.

We were guided through a series of three churches each of which in turn we pretty much killed - that was after the big schism in Church A drove us out.