Ummmmm...so... what's up?

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I've always had a bit of a problem with this and for some lately it even seems to be getting worse, probably because things are slowing down and I feel like I have less to talk to people about straight-away. Pretty much its about starting conversation, aknowledging people, and doing it without getting people irritated with you.

One example, like tonight even, I have two roommates - one I talk to all the time and one who's around less and while we're cool its like we don't just click into conversation. A lot of the times when I see the guy come home and see he still has his uniform on I'll ask him how work was and he'll just give me a look or ask "Are you asking because you really care or is this just a mindless ritual?". A lot of times at work I notice something similar with the waitresses and a lot of the 'cooler' servers in the social clicks, its like if I say hi to em or ask em how things are going they'll look at me like "why are you bothering me?".

My roommate just mentioned when I was talking to him about it that I just don't switch things up enough - I know how that bleeds the sincerity right out of things but still, I have about maybe 3 or 4 things I can think of to say usually and anything else is usually too corny. I could straight off the top start talking to em about something or ask em a question about something else to start a conversation but being that I'm not real involved with life right now it's not an option that I have as much as a lot of other people do. It sucks also because with a lot of people as well my conversation starters like how's school, what section you working in tonight, etc., is often times enough to have em instantly looking aggitated and desperately looking for someone else to talk to. Mind you it doesn't happen real often and my social skills seem to work very well at times but only during the times when a conversation is rolling or when something else happens to where they make a comment on a situation or I do - either way that's something that's quite often just not there to save you and usually you have to start something from scratch.

I'm wondering if any of you have mastered this skill, how were you able to overcome that default blank you draw when it comes to that? I've been trying for years to figure out a way to beat this because i know it'll not only hold me back horribly in social situations but it's a complete dealbreaker with most people, almost any romantic relationship, and as long as I don't have this kind of thing sorted out I'm pretty much dooming myself to stay in this uneasy place with a lot of my NT friends even where I won't wanna call them unless my more outgoing roommate is calling em and getting em in on plans over here or whatever. Being someone who wants as much self sufficiency as he can get this is one of those things I tend to get real pissed at myself about.

Sorry, I wish I had the answer because I'm in your position too. Every conversation I have with people these days seems to be an exercise in mind-numbing repetition. And I get that look from people, too.

I think it has to do with our slight "humor mistake."

No suggestions or answers here... I'd love to be able to initiate conversation, small talk, etc with people in a normal way too. My problem is that whenever I'm in a situation where I have an opportunity to do that, the idea of talking to the other person doesn't even cross my mind! I say nothing! I only talk if the other person initiates the conversation, or if I have important info to pass along or an important question to ask. Otherwise I'm silent, and I end up making myself look antisocial. People think I've got a superiority thing going on or else they assume I don't like them. Once the social opportunity is over and I'm looking back on it later, I realize that I did it AGAIN. Not sure how to get around that neurological glitch... The worst part is when you can't do anything about it. I'd talk to people if I could remember to do it, but honestly most of the time the idea of saying something to them doesn't even cross my mind.

Sorry, don't mean to send the thread off-topic. This is just something I've been thinking about a lot over the last few days because of a conversation with a coworker. (Just a reminder of one of those lifelong issues that I was doing a good job of not thinking about...) She mentioned that other coworkers ask her why I don't talk to them. She said that she tells them "Well, she talks to me." Bad answer - that really makes it look like I don't like the other people, if I talk to her and not them. But I only talk to her because she's one of those hyper-social people who talks nonstop, so I don't have to initiate the conversation myself.

It sounds like maybe you and I are around different types of people too. Sounds like you're getting negative reactions when you do make the effort to talk to people. I'm around people who want the interaction and they don't understand why I'm not doing it. I guess part of it is probably the fact that I'm female and girls generally do talk more than guys though. (Even if they did get that interaction from me they'd probably be pretty disappointed in the quality of it, kinda like your situation.)

Last edited by neongrl on 10 Aug 2006, 1:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

I get around this by using neutral greetings that don't really require answers like "Hey" or "How ya doin'" or "How's it going". If people feel like talking they'll pick that up and run with it. If they don't, they can just grunt back and you've accomplished the connection in any event.

I avoid initiating conversation because I am usually very uncomfortable around most people. I don't like eye contact. I am usually bored with NT conversation. And I seem to irritate alot of people.

I have thought about ways to overcome this problem. I have wondered what would happen if I was more my authentic aspie self in front of NTs. For example, when their eyes meet mine and I get that sensory overload then (if I were radically honest) I might say, "Please stop looking at me because your eyes hurt me!" Okay, the NT would probably think I was a lunatic, but hey, at least I would be being honest about my perceptions!

And if I wanted to talk to someone but could not think of anything to say to them then I would say, "I want to talk to you but I can't think of anything to say right now, I just wanted you to know I like working with you."

I actually worked for a short while with an NT who talked in this same radically honest way to people and she was the most popular worker in the whole district!

As yet I have not tried being my radically honest aspie self because I am not sure it would work for me as well as it did that NT coworker. But someday soon I might give it a try...

Last edited by anandamide on 10 Aug 2006, 1:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

Lol, see, that's exactly what I'm doing. I think at work it doesn't seem to be as bad lately and one thing I've noticed is you almost have to hold it back half the time and not give em anything for them to actually be happy about when you do, otherwise it does just seem hollow and people become skeptical of you. With my roommate, again, I've noticed I get much more of a positive response if I cut all that and actually ask a question about something, anything - like "Hey, did you get any milk while you were out? Ok, just wanted to know cuz I'm headed to the store right now", something that has some degree of relevence. At work if I do talk about something I at least have it psychologically filtered to where I at least know what not to say, then again I think I'm still overcautious and tend to filter out a lot things I could say just on account of how I think I'd be presenting them in tone, expression, nonverbals, that can really make or break the kind of reception you get from other people almost regardless of topic. My other roommate is great at "Hey ___" and then going on about something he's doing that day that he's psyched or passionate about, that's great for short-cutting all that and while I wish I had that much in the way of new things going on truth is I don't.

I get a degree of that with eye-contact and the way I tend to deal with it is I'll make eye contact in more face to face conversations whereas I'll handle it the eastern way other times and talk to them and try to shoe confidence but I guess not worry too much if it does seem to reflective. Its usually a lot easier to get away with not making eye contact when your standing next to em, your both kinda slouched on the wall, and while their talking your kinda doing a bit of that cocking your head in the other dirction like your trying to put your ear right in the path of where their voice is comming from - as long as you show that spark of receptiveness and like your right there with what your saying it tends to help. What kills me though is being so drained or locked down at work that when a waitress or someone like that smiles at me I physically can't bring it out to smile back and I get the feeling it would take so much effort that the smile would be twitched out or goofy - that sucks but then again it doesn't really seem like they hold that against me too much. Even today I was getting on the highway, about to make a right up the on-ramp, and one of the waitresses I've worked with for a while called out from the next car and waved, the best I could do was look over and give her one of those 2-fingered hi signs - wasn't too happy about it because I'm not a fan of that 'too cool' stuff and IMO I'm in the wrong place to be acting like that even if I can't help it.



That girl obviously has something else going on for her too thats probably the biggest part of why that worked - she's obviously real intune with what does and doesn't fly with people, she's probably that good at understanding other NT's that she can even push the boundaries a bit and people understand because they can just tell she's on the up-and-up. In a way that kind of realness is usually either an illusion or something someone gets just by having themselves that well trained psychologically.



Taking what I said above I don't know that I'd recommend it, at least now.

An added benefit of this approach is it helps rapidly identify any other aspies you might be greeting for the first time

I think making the effort is my biggest problem - in the past I just wanted control over my environment and I wanted people to know who I was, I used to think that people would like me for me if they really got it. Now I know better, know there's people out there who could see right through me and still hate me, now its not nearly as hard to accept social rejection because I know what kind of BS is built into the way most people handle things.

On your end of things, even though you do have some things that bug you that your also aware of I know at least a few NT's who are like this as well. I'll just say that I have a friend of a friend who I hang out with here and there when she's with the group - she's 20, blonde, attractive and definitely comes off like she's kinda yuppyish and has the propensety to be stuck-up. When I was at my friends' house and met her the first time she was sitting in another room by herself, walked straight in, talked to my friend's girlfriend with us mostly walled off as audience, and walked back away. I kinda cringed when I had to leave because I realized she was sitting at the chair that I had my coat at. Lol, being the kinda guy who locks down in akward situations like that I kinda walked over pulled on the coat, said "Heads up", and of course she kinda glared at me. You might draw a lot of conclusions from all that but my friend's girlfriend explained that she's like that when she first meets anyone and that she is actually pretty cool. I think by the next time I saw her things were totally different and while it would be hard to say that we hardcore identify I can't say I've gotten to know her well enough or vice a versa. When you look at that example, here's an NT who innitially acts real cold and stuck up but its sheerly social anxiety and even if she might have had some of that in her past she seems like one of those people who's actively challenged herself to outgrow that kind of thinking. I wouldn't say this to her or that couple we hang with but I really feel bad for her in that she's got some of the same issues she fights with, first impressions are usually all you make all day with people because contacts aren't real consistent, and at the same time all too often her friend has to pitch in and explain that about her anytime she meets a new group of people through her. Being an NT, having seemingly no excuse, and then having to deal with that must be ridiculously straining.

With that male coworker though yeah, that was pretty shady of her to say that. At the same time though, has he ever tried to make conversation with you? I think if you could break things up and try to show your friendlier self you might break the ice but then again it seems like the longer it stays the weirder and tougher to break it gets - I hate that.

Actually it wasn't a male coworker, they're all female right now, but that part doesn't really matter. And it sounds like those questions about me kinda bounce around between all my coworkers. (And anyone else who knows me.) But I've found from experience that the people who know me better pitch in and put in a good word for me, just like you were saying about that other girl. In the end most people seem to like me and I can get along with almost anyone... that talking thing is still frustrating though nonetheless because even though other people accept that about me, I wish I could do better and it seems to be something I have no control over.

Actually she knew what she was doing. That girl would make comments to people just to get them to like her. But then she'd actually be laughing at the person behind their back when they responded well to her friendly comments. She had lots of social skills, but she was a total as*hole. She learned everyone's life stories and would gossip behind people's backs. And yet her brown nosing and super friendly tactics worked for her very well with everyone from temps to bosses.

Anandamide, thats another angle where you'd kinda have to be the kind of person she is to make that work. If your a good person then that's one thing that usually keeps most people from being that popular. Not that people love a shitey person for the sake of it, they just know that the person's a liability and its amost like apeasing the local bully for their own security.

Yes, she was a total creep. I found out later that she was once arrested for harassing Princess Di. That girl definitely had some personality problem. And yes, you are absolutely correct, people responded in a friendly manner to her insincere comments because co-workers were afraid of her and tried to appease her like snivelling dogs. But you know what? Her insincere flattering and friendly comments worked really well for her. She got promotions galore and had lots of friends among the bosses.

I agree with you that an aspie probably couldn't pull that sort of manipulation off very well.